The price of being U2?

[doubleU]

No matter what type of album U2 makes next time around, it will get flamed in here.

Here's my theory. Once U2 made Joshua Tree they put themselves in a corner. Any time you create a masterpiece all aftermaths are even more critically judged.

There may have been a small backlash from War to UF but nothing to really make the radar.

But once JT was made, every step they made was judged harshly.

This board is very much divided. It's almost as if loving U2 during every incarnation is frowned upon.

The backlash they are receiving from fans about the 00's is very similar to the backlash they received during the 90's.

I predict U2 can never make a universally accepted album again.

They could make the greatest ground breaking album and some will bitch about how it's trying to keep up with trends. If they keep with the sound now, people will bitch about how they are trying to cash in on their typical sound.

It's the price of being U2.

 

[DignityPassesBy]

I completly agree with someone on here for once

 

[mickeza]

Of course they can't make a universally accepted album, i don't think they ever have made a universally accepted album. I know a fair few of U2 fans who do not see JT as the masterpiece many people describe it as. Now Zooropa and POP

 

[olympia85]

I predict U2 can never make a universally accepted album again.

it's true...
many U2 fans can't accepted Pop
many people say that they have won grammy for the career and not for the album...

 

[fly so high!]

There was an interview with Bono published in the "Goodweekend" (Sydney Morning Herald Feb 18th) by Michka Assayas called "The cool crusader"

Assayas:
Some of your biggest fans who've been following you for the past 25 years have said lately:"Bono doesn't seem to lose himself in the music as much as he did before. Now,he's very professional,very much in control." it's a thing i've heard more than a few times.

Bono:
You're just talking to people who are atrophied in their souls. I'm not!

Assayas:
What do you mean?

Bono:
These are just grown-ups. Ask younger people who are coming to see us. I know how much I am involved in a song on a night. There's no question that has been one of the most emotional rides of the tour. the singing is particularly emotional. These people really don't know what they're talking about. They know who they're talking about,but it's not me,it's them.

Assayas:
You mean they're projecting themselves onto you.

Bono:
Of course.....These people, we see them every night. Usually, by the end of the night, they've escaped themselves out of that self-consciousness and they've come to this. But some people sit there with their arms crossed. They're just never gonna understand, because they lost the ability to give themselves to music. People are looking for the obvious,the staging, and I absolutely accept that criticism.We have made these kind of very quick shifts in style of production over the years,and people would come along and go: "Oh, my God, what have they done now? they've a mirror ball spaceship on stage, they've a television station on the road!" Now,this time, we didn't pull one of those tricks. We broke rhyme. it's important to break rhyme occasionally. We stayed within this mould where the music was at the centre. now the emotional core is where the fireworks are going off.

 

[olympia85]

thanks to share this interview...

i love U2 and when Bono says "You're just talking to people who are atrophied in their souls. I'm not" i appreciate that

i love U2 because they can change wath they are

 

[KhanadaRhodes]

i totally agree. i'm sure there's some type of U2 fan out there who, at the very least, isn't as fond of each album as others may be.

i'd go so far as to state there might be fans out there who don't like the joshua tree or achtung baby!

 

[ozeeko]

That's pretty funny. Bono defending his music. Of course it couldn't be him, he's God and infallable. All kidding aside, I liked their last album but hate the present one. But I guess that means I'm atrophied in my soul. In a live performance I bet Bono does give it his all, even with newer material of lesser quality, but since I haven't gone to any concerts this tour, all i have is the studio album, which sounds like four guys on autopilot, Bono included. So say what you will about my soul. I'm still sitting here with my arms crossed. (and typing with other extremities)

 

[yolland]

The same thing really happens to any artist who goes through multiple evolutions in their sound and/or performance style--there will always be fierce partisans of one era or another. It's not just U2.

 

[deirdre]

No matter what type of album U2 makes next time around, it will get flamed in here.

Here's my theory. Once U2 made Joshua Tree they put themselves in a corner. Any time you create a masterpiece all aftermaths are even more critically judged.

another case in point...Springsteen after "born to run"...I've been posting on a Springsteen message board for the past 6 yrs or so... and it's a love / hate relationship with everything he does..

the price of being Springsteen

 

[doctorwho]

That's pretty funny. Bono defending his music. Of course it couldn't be him, he's God and infallable. All kidding aside, I liked their last album but hate the present one. But I guess that means I'm atrophied in my soul. In a live performance I bet Bono does give it his all, even with newer material of lesser quality, but since I haven't gone to any concerts this tour, all i have is the studio album, which sounds like four guys on autopilot, Bono included. So say what you will about my soul. I'm still sitting here with my arms crossed. (and typing with other extremities)

But see, you've just proven Bono right.

And so have I, to some extent.

When you talk about "material of lesser quality", I do not think of HTDAAB - but I can rattle off tons of songs from past albums that failed to impress me. And there are plenty of times where I felt U2 weren't trying - where track 8 sounded way too much like a track 3 (or whatever) on an album... where the songs just blended together (I'm looking your way, JT). And so, in that aspect, I too could have sat there "with my arms crossed".

The difference, though, is that I did see them in concert. And even if I wasn't a fan of some of the work, seeing it live changed everything. It's clear to me how much effort the four members of U2 put into each show - especially Bono. Is Bono "on" every night? Is U2 "on" every night? Is every show spectacular? Obviously not. There are nights when things just seem a bit off. But those nights are to be expected - they happened in 1982, 1987, 1992, 1997, 2001 and 2005. They'll happen again.

However, for the most part, seeing U2 live in concert is brilliant. The music truly comes alive. One can get lost in the music. And on those nights when I felt U2 was off, I have to wonder - was it me, or them? Was I perhaps not in the mood for hearing U2 or seeing a concert that night? Perhaps my mind was elsewhere and *I* was the one going through the emotions of just enjoying a show, but not really getting into the spirit of it. I know I've done this. And this is what Bono is talking about.

Of course, it's far better to sit there with arms crossed and say Bono is being egotistical and U2's last work isn't good than do some introspective thinking.

 

[STING2]

No matter what type of album U2 makes next time around, it will get flamed in here.

Here's my theory. Once U2 made Joshua Tree they put themselves in a corner. Any time you create a masterpiece all aftermaths are even more critically judged.

There may have been a small backlash from War to UF but nothing to really make the radar.

But once JT was made, every step they made was judged harshly.

This board is very much divided. It's almost as if loving U2 during every incarnation is frowned upon.

The backlash they are receiving from fans about the 00's is very similar to the backlash they received during the 90's.

I predict U2 can never make a universally accepted album again.

They could make the greatest ground breaking album and some will bitch about how it's trying to keep up with trends. If they keep with the sound now, people will bitch about how they are trying to cash in on their typical sound.

It's the price of being U2.

Probably a better title would be, "the price U2 has payed for the success of the Joshua Tree album and tour".

The first sort of backlash to U2 came during the time of Rattle And Hum. 1987 was the last time U2 were free of any sort of backlash or intense hatred from some part of the public or their own fans, whether it was a large group or a small group.

 

[ozeeko]

Of course, it's far better to sit there with arms crossed and say Bono is being egotistical and U2's last work isn't good than do some introspective thinking.

I've been introspective enough in past threads. I'll make this short and sweet: I haven't seen U2 live during this tour, and I'm unsatisfied with the studio album. End of story. Maybe Bono himself can convince me that it's my soul in question and not the music itself. Even though I love 95% of everything they've ever put out.

 

[goincommando]

Well, of course it boils down to the fact that not everyone will love one thing, but I do understand where you're coming from.

It's the same case with the infamous one-hit wonders. They make a huge smash, globally accepted, then the rest of their careers is trying to do anything in their power to recreate the success, only in this case, it's to try and make an album that has the scale tipping more in the accepted favor.

 

[doubleU]

It's the same case with the infamous one-hit wonders. They make a huge smash, globally accepted, then the rest of their careers is trying to do anything in their power to recreate the success, only in this case, it's to try and make an album that has the scale tipping more in the accepted favor.

Um, there's a big difference in one song and an album.

My point is like what Sting2 said. Their first major backlash was after JT and those backlashes have followed them ever since then.

 

[Earnie Shavers]

The backlash they are receiving from fans about the 00's is very similar to the backlash they received during the 90's.

It's actually very different. I mean, I'm sure it's exactly the same for some fans/people, but around here I think it's mostly very very different.

Generally though, I agree with the majority sentiment above. There is no way with such a wide spanning catalogue that everyone will like everything.

 

[doubleU]

Re: Re: The price of being U2?

It's actually very different. I mean, I'm sure it's exactly the same for some fans/people, but around here I think it's mostly very very different.

How can you say that? The internet and all of it's infinite beauty wasn't around back then.

I'm talking about the original backlash that AB got and the backlash Bomb gets today is very similar. With the exception of the "they're embracing their signature sound" argument everything is the same.

They sold out.

They are trying for the younger audience.

Bono changed his lyric writing style.

etc.

Generally though, I agree with the majority sentiment above. There is no way with such a wide spanning catalogue that everyone will like everything.

But that really wasn't my point. My point wasn't so much that not everyone is going to like something. My point is that from that point on, there is always going to be a sharp division.

 

[U2FanPeter]

Weren't fans calling them sellouts when they moved to Stadiums in 1987?

I'm sure fans of the first 3 albums were thrown for a loop when they heard UF.

u2fp

 

[U2DMfan]

Re: Re: Re: The price of being U2?

Who is making universally accepted albums these days?

 

[ozeeko]

I didn't like POP when it came out, not due to songwriting, but because of the initial sound and style that i heard coming back at me. Of course I was in 8th grade when I heard that album, so what the hell would I know? When I ventured out and extended my tastes in music and knowledge, suddenly POP clicked for me. (and is in my top five fave albums by them) To be fair, I wasn't giving it a chance because I wanted them to return to Joshua Tree or Achtung Baby form. On the newest release, I don't have a problem persay with the sound of the album, or even the mainstream approach they are taking (i did like ATYCLB) It just comes down to what I find to be lazy songwriting.

 

[doubleU]

The same thing really happens to any artist who goes through multiple evolutions in their sound and/or performance style--there will always be fierce partisans of one era or another. It's not just U2.

True to an extent, but it's much more noticable with U2.

Take Kid A for example. There was a backlash but it wasn't anything like that of when U2 went from JT to AB.

I'm members of REM, Pearl Jam, Radiohead, and a few other message boards.

PJ had some backlash with Riot Act but you don't have threads a year later about how bad it sucks.

Same with Kid A on Radiohead boards the backlash was almost non-existent.

 

[ozeeko]

I think U2 gets a bigger backlash because they go around saying "We want to be the biggest band in the world" They set themselves up.

 

[fly so high!]

There was an interview with Bono published in the "Goodweekend" (Sydney Morning Herald Feb 18th) by Michka Assayas called "The cool crusader"

Assayas:
Some of your biggest fans who've been following you for the past 25 years have said lately:"Bono doesn't seem to lose himself in the music as much as he did before. Now,he's very professional,very much in control." it's a thing i've heard more than a few times.

Bono:
You're just talking to people who are atrophied in their souls. I'm not!

Assayas:
What do you mean?

Bono:
These are just grown-ups. Ask younger people who are coming to see us. I know how much I am involved in a song on a night. There's no question that has been one of the most emotional rides of the tour. the singing is particularly emotional. These people really don't know what they're talking about. They know who they're talking about,but it's not me,it's them.

Assayas:
You mean they're projecting themselves onto you.

Bono:
Of course.....These people, we see them every night. Usually, by the end of the night, they've escaped themselves out of that self-consciousness and they've come to this. But some people sit there with their arms crossed. They're just never gonna understand, because they lost the ability to give themselves to music. People are looking for the obvious,the staging, and I absolutely accept that criticism.We have made these kind of very quick shifts in style of production over the years,and people would come along and go: "Oh, my God, what have they done now? they've a mirror ball spaceship on stage, they've a television station on the road!" Now,this time, we didn't pull one of those tricks. We broke rhyme. it's important to break rhyme occasionally. We stayed within this mould where the music was at the centre. now the emotional core is where the fireworks are going off.

My scanners crapped itself, if you guys are intersted in the whole interveiw it can be found in the UPDATED edition of BONO on BONO which will published here in Australia on March 9!
But in the mean time i will get my hubby to scan it at work if you guys like!

 

[STING2]

True to an extent, but it's much more noticable with U2.

Take Kid A for example. There was a backlash but it wasn't anything like that of when U2 went from JT to AB.

I'm members of REM, Pearl Jam, Radiohead, and a few other message boards.

PJ had some backlash with Riot Act but you don't have threads a year later about how bad it sucks.

Same with Kid A on Radiohead boards the backlash was almost non-existent.

Thats true, but those bands are not even close to being as popular as U2 are. If you ask some people in the general public, they might tell you that REM and Pearl Jam are not even bands anymore.

When bands reach that low level of popularity, the remaining hardcore fans for the most part close ranks and support the band. The number of critics is even smaller. But with a band with massive popularity like U2, your always going to have people coming on to the website whether their actually a big fan or not.

Radiohead were never really that big commercially except perhaps with "Ok Computer". When you have a small dedicated fan base, a backlash is virtually impossible.

U2 did not get its first backlash until after they became the most popular artist on the planet.

 

[STING2]

Weren't fans calling them sellouts when they moved to Stadiums in 1987?

I'm sure fans of the first 3 albums were thrown for a loop when they heard UF.

u2fp

There was come concern among the fanbase about the move to stadiums, but it wasn't from the perspective of their "selling out", but that it would be harder to have a close intimate show with the band in such a place as a stadium.

The Unforgettable Fire launched U2 into being one of the top in demand live acts on the planet. Nearly all fans embraced the album. Kurt Loder of Rolling Stone may have been thrown for a loop, but there is nothing that shows that the fans were.

Its amazing how much the bands popularity grew in only 2 years from WAR to UF.

 

[GibsonGirl]

No matter what type of album [insert band] makes next time around, it will get flamed in [insert forum].

Here's my theory. Once [insert band] made [insert popular album] they put themselves in a corner. Any time you create a masterpiece all aftermaths are even more critically judged.

There may have been a small backlash from [insert albums of varying styles] but nothing to really make the radar.

But once [insert popular album] was made, every step they made was judged harshly.

This board is very much divided. It's almost as if loving [insert band] during every incarnation is frowned upon.

The backlash they are receiving from fans about the [insert era] is very similar to the backlash they received during the [insert era].

I predict [insert band] can never make a universally accepted album again.

They could make the greatest ground breaking album and some will bitch about how it's trying to keep up with trends. If they keep with the sound now, people will bitch about how they are trying to cash in on their typical sound.

It's the price of being [insert band].

I think you'll see the point that other posters and I are trying to make. Every popular band goes through this. People will always disagree on the music. If you think U2 has it the worst, you can't be a member of many other band forums. Music fans on the Internet just like to bitch a whole lot, regardless of the band's popularity.

 

[doubleU]

I think U2 gets a bigger backlash because they go around saying "We want to be the biggest band in the world" They set themselves up.

Um yeah they weren't doing that after JT, when AB came out, or Pop.

 

[Bono's shades]

I saw U2 during the Vertigo tour and thought they were amazing. HTDAAB the album, however, leaves me cold for the most part. I didn't care much for ATYCLB either. It just sounds like U2 giving up and taking the past of least resistance. So I guess my soul is the one that's "atrophied"? Whatever.

I'll bet the people Bono was referring to who had their arms crossed during the show were just rich yuppies who only know about three U2 songs and were only there because they wanted to be seen at the hottest concert of the year.

 

[ozeeko]

Um yeah they weren't doing that after JT, when AB came out, or Pop.

Yeah, and Rattle And Hum wasn't critically accepted (i like the album though). A lot of people in the media saw U2 as being too self-important and that distorted their view of the music. Even Larry Mullen at that time said he was sick of being the biggest in the world and being something like the U2 jukebox pumping out hit after hit everynight. So they changed their approach. It worked (AB). With HTDAAB Bono was stating all different variations on the "biggest band on the planet" theme, and even had the audacity to call their upcoming album a hard rock affair driven by a guitarist who's sick of seeing his lead singer with dodgy politicians. The album came out, was not even close to what Bono said it was all about, and then on the DVD you get Bono saying "This is our first record." Yeah the first record I've ever loathed. Point being: when you make promises that reveal themselves to be empty, and you intentionally deceive fans that are eagerly awaiting an entirely different album, you are going to disappoint people. And when you make absurd comments like "this is our greatest album. These are our greatest songs" you will undoubtedly offend people who fail to believe the hype.

 

[ozeeko]

I saw U2 during the Vertigo tour and thought they were amazing. HTDAAB the album, however, leaves me cold for the most part. I didn't care much for ATYCLB either. It just sounds like U2 giving up and taking the past of least resistance. So I guess my soul is the one that's "atrophied"? Whatever.

I'll bet the people Bono was referring to who had their arms crossed during the show were just rich yuppies who only know about three U2 songs and were only there because they wanted to be seen at the hottest concert of the year.

I think it's foolish to say people aren't liking music cuz their souls are atrophied. Could it be they just don't like the music. Could it be you (U2) aren't producing music to the best of your ability? Artists usually care less about what some fans have to say. They're doing quite well for themselves (somehow). He should just say "whatever. Each his own. Maybe they just don't like it." There's a difference between not liking the music and blind hatred for a band no matter what they release. Blind haters probably wouldn't be seen at a U2 concert anyway. Unless they had a secret agenda, like assassinating Bono. Also, not all concert goers have to be fainting at the sight of Bono. Maybe those atrophied souls were actually stoned, and just soaking in the experience without much movement. You can't expect everyone to be freaking out.