"The Overcorrection of Pop"

The friendliest place on the web for anyone that follows U2.
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
See posts with no answers
Status
Not open for further replies.
C

Chizip

Blue Crack Addict
Joined
May 11, 2001
Messages
18,139
Location
gone
Someone used this phrase in another thread to describe the current phase of U2, and I think it is a very accurate description. If I had to use just one word to describe the current U2, the word I would use would be:

Safe

Everything they do these days, the music they make, their image, what they wear, how they tour, their setlists, how they market themselves...it is all very safe. Just look at this quotes from the Popmart tour and then from the Vertigo Tour.

Yet it's not easy to classify. "One of the biggest problems that people are going to have with the show is that it's just completely different--there are no big lighting trusses hanging down and no big speaker columns on either side of the stage," Owens says. "Your reference points are gone--and what you expect to happen just doesn't. But I think that's great. It's a bit like the album; it will take a while for people to see what's going on. What's so fantastic about U2 is that they're willing to take these gambles. That's the Paddy factor, actually--the Irishness. We all copped an attitude that if it doesn't work out, well, we all can go out and have a pint later."

"There is an extraordinary confidence, that comes mainly from Bono, that's just infectious," Owens concludes. "You just know that if he and Willie believe it will happen, chances are it will."
Click to expand...

That was describing Popmart, while this next quote is describing Vertigo

Frankly, although I understood Berry's practicality, I was shocked by this remark as it flies in the face of U2's career-long mission of constant reinvention. In tandem with their recorded output, Zoo TV, PopMart and Elevation represented huge leaps in terms of their live presentation. By contrast, Vertigo appears to be a short hop.

I asked Willie Williams, U2's lighting guru since 1982 and now their overall show designer, to comment on this observation. He said: "It's a fair statement, but it’s interesting how some functional elements of a show are never questioned. We had exactly the same backline last time. We had the same PA last time, and yet no one’s saying, 'gosh, how dull, it’s repetition, have they run out of ideas?'

"We really questioned whether we should do something completely different, or whether we should use that format again. But, in the end, the only reason to not do it would be because we did it last time. And to put them in a less successful performance situation, for no good reason, just seemed churlish. Another major factor which prompted those decisions, was the fact that we are actually playing in many of the same buildings."
Click to expand...

There just seems to be a stark contrast in attitudes. If there was any tour to repeat it would be ZooTV, the greatest tour ever. But no, U2 didn't want to repeat the past, they wanted to take a gamble and create something even bigger and better. But for the Vertigo Tour, the attitude was more "Well it worked before, so might as well do it again."

Very safe. It's almost as if the "failure" of Pop/Popmart shook the extraordinary confidence Bono and the band once had and has lead them into this current era of U2.

And what I think may be turning some fans off is that we've never seen a "safe" U2 before, so it takes a little bit to adjust to. Now I'm not implying that a safe U2 is a bad thing. Personally, I love HTDAAB, and I like ATYCLB. If U2 had continued to be daring on an album following Pop and it didn't work out, it could have led U2 down a path to irrelevance. So in that regards, playing it safe was probably the best career move.

But is this era of a safe U2 here to stay, or is it just being used as a foundation to be more daring in the future? Now that they've reclaimed the title of "Biggest Band in the World" will they go back after the title of "Best Band in the world?" If they continue to be safe, it could lead them down the same path of irrelevancy that a misplaced daring path would have lead them.
 
Firstly, I dont get why any band would want to be "the biggest band in the world" per sé.
Isnt it supposed to be about expressing yourselves (as a band) as artists?

To me, this change in image, style, etc would be a lot more credible if they never stated the whole 'we want to title of biggest band in the world back"-line.

Dont get me wrong, I absolutely LOVE ATYCLB and HTDAAB. I am thankfull for those albums and cherish them dearly, I really do.

It just seems like a very big leap from the POP-era into the ATYCLB-era.

I dont know what my point is, really :huh: , I do think they sound and perform convincing these days. So not saying they're faking it or playing it safe. I dont know, maybe they've just moved on, got older, etc..
 
I think in Stuck in a Moment symbolises what U2 are about for now 'just trying to find a decent melody to sing in my own company'...its just trying to get back to the basics of songwriting i think therefore yeh its relatively safe but pretty good songs came from it...

I think though they are building a base for them to be more daring again...people are never satisfied with U2, fans left them because they didn't like Achtung Baby, critics didn't like Rattle and Hum umm because really i have never understood that one:wink: Critics started to dislike 'ironic' U2 during Popmart because it just got off to a bad start but ended up being a great tour, but the whole of the 90s got labelled by a lot of critics as the 'crappy ironic U2 era'...Some people expect U2 to jump through hoops to please them with whatever sound they are looking for (not aimed at you), i am happy if the guys feel happy making the music they want...fans should come second to that i think (of course they need their fans but we are fans because the guys have done what they wanted to do)...we just have to wait and see what U2s life brings to their sound in the next few years, i think another change is on the way, but i won't be needlessly disappointed if it doesn't happen...
 
VertigoGal said:
I could've sworn we've already had a thread on this. :scratch:
Click to expand...

Maybe I should have just started another Game thread instead.
 
I think U2 is a bit torn between what they want to do and what they see as necessary. Bono is currently using the leverage of the band's popularity to influence world leaders on debt relief and aids.

I'm sure they would love to blast the bastards Bono currently has to schmooze with, but they are trying to save lives.

They've put a tremendous weight on their own shoulders and it's hard for me to believe they've done as well as they have musically the past two albums considering all that.
 
Chizip said:

And what I think may be turning some fans off is that we've never seen a "safe" U2 before, so it takes a little bit to adjust to. Now I'm not implying that a safe U2 is a bad thing. Personally, I love HTDAAB, and I like ATYCLB. If U2 had continued to be daring on an album following Pop and it didn't work out, it could have led U2 down a path to irrelevance. So in that regards, playing it safe was probably the best career move.
.
Click to expand...

One of Bono's favourite lines used to be "There is no reverse gear in this band". Funnily enough I haven't heard him say that for 3 or 4 years though, maybe realising that is exactly the gear that U2 have slipped into the last 3 or 4 years.:wink:
 
I actually like the two last albums and many of their 00's songs. But when I do a top 5/10, I almost don't include any 00's songs excepting Walk On.

Conclusion: They still make good music, they're still in greah shape; THEIR ALBUMS STILL ARE GOOD, but not so exciting and fresh as 80's and 90's
 
Well to be fair most of those threads are about HTDAAB specifically, and I have even said in this thread that I love HTDAAB. This topic is more of a general discussion of the current incarnation of the band that was created after the Pop era and what the future holds for U2.

I found those 2 quotes about the 2 tour designs and I thought it was interesting because I think they accurately portray the overall attitudes that U2 had at the time. And I didn't really want it to get buried amongst the constant bitching between the fans in those threads.
 
MrBrau1 said:
This same arguement is going on everywhere. With generally the same 3 or 4 posters getting everyone riled up. Some make smart comments. Some drop 1 liners followed by a :wink: Though most have a hard time with change.

here:
http://forum.interference.com/t132579.html

and here:
http://forum.interference.com/t131360.html

and here:
http://forum.interference.com/t132402.html

and here:
http://forum.interference.com/t133116.html

and here:
http://forum.interference.com/t131101.html
Click to expand...

I have ALWAYS thought it was the same 3 or 4 people doing this, sometimes using alters to make their numbers seem larger.

I don't know why some people are so bitter over this. Isn't it time to get over it and move on?
 
Chizip said:
Well to be fair most of those threads are about HTDAAB specifically, and I have even said in this thread that I love HTDAAB. This topic is more of a general discussion of the current incarnation of the band that was created after the Pop era and what the future holds for U2.

I found those 2 quotes about the 2 tour designs and I thought it was interesting because I think they accurately portray the overall attitudes that U2 had at the time. And I didn't really want it to get buried amongst the constant bitching between the fans in those threads.
Click to expand...

well, I don't think the actual stage structure has as much to do with it. anyway, they are using the new light-bead things, so I guess that's substantially different. I think it has more to do with the concept. While I don't think it's as a grand of a concept as ZooTV or PopMart (at least from a fashion standpoint:wink: ), there are certainly different themes that they've consciously thought out...the Boy set, the political part, the spiritual part, etc.

I think you're reading too much into the quotes...
 
Chizip said:

But is this era of a safe U2 here to stay, or is it just being used as a foundation to be more daring in the future? Now that they've reclaimed the title of "Biggest Band in the World" will they go back after the title of "Best Band in the world?" If they continue to be safe, it could lead them down the same path of irrelevancy that a misplaced daring path would have lead them.
Click to expand...

I think Chizip is a genius and I want to marry him.

The title of the thread says it all.

And I don't know why everyone is freaking out, he said he enjoys both ATYCLB and HTDAAB (as do I, HTDAAB is one of their best albums). This isn't a "current U2 sucks" thread, this is a "this is where I think U2 is right now, I wonder what path they will go down in the future" thread. And that last paragraph of yours Chizip summed it up perfectly... if they continue the back-to-roots sound and feel of their last two albums there will most likely be backlash. People have ADD, they can't deal with the same thing for too long. They will get bored of it. Just as people got tired of earnest preachy U2 with Rattle and Hum and ironic experimental U2 with Pop, they will get tired of this current U2 phase. The attention span of the masses is limited.

I really do think U2 is building a platform for themselves to be more daring and experimental again...they've proven twice over they are the biggest band in the world. No band can honestly compete with U2, and anyone that argues for Coldplay loses because Coldplay worships U2. Now that U2 has cemented themselves at the top of the world they are more free to experiment again. I think U2 will change again, though we may get one more "safe" album...which I'm fine with, often the third in a series is the best of the three (I'd take War over Boy/October and crazy me loves Pop more than Achtung/Zooropa).
 
U2Kitten said:


I have ALWAYS thought it was the same 3 or 4 people doing this, sometimes using alters to make their numbers seem larger.

I don't know why some people are so bitter over this. Isn't it time to get over it and move on?
Click to expand...

Who said anyone's bitter?
Is it being bitter to evaluate U2?
 
How do you all know, there may have been NO REASON for the 'correction' or change except that the music that came out of them was from a different time and a different place, with no ulterior motives!
 
U2Kitten said:
How do you all know, there may have been NO REASON for the 'correction' or change except that the music that came out of them was from a different time and a different place, with no ulterior motives!
Click to expand...

Yup, as I stated in my initial post on this thread. I agree. But the claim to be the biggest band in the world again makes me wonder sometimes. But it's entirely possible that this is simply a natural artistic evolution. Guess we'll never know for sure.
 
You know I'm starting to think that is why U2 does things in threes. They had the UF/JT/R&H trio, but by the time they got to R&H U2 got critically bashed, and then after that they changed directions. They followed that with the AB/Zooropa/Pop trio and by the time they got to Pop they got critically bashed, and so they decided to change direction again. If they came out with another album in the ATYCLB/HTDAAB mold and an Elevation Tour Pt 3 would the critics turn on them again?

I hope they realize the need to mix things up before the critics give them the nudge they have needed to do it in the past.
 
VertigoGal said:
.I think you're reading too much into the quotes...
Click to expand...

There is nothing to read into. It's right there in black and white.

Before: Willing to take gambles

Now: Stick with the same old, same old.

I'm not complaining either about the present. I really like HTDAAB. But that's not what this is about.

I think this era of U2 is going to be around for a little while then they'll evolve some more and move on. It works for them. As someone posted earlier, I too think the band is doing what they feel is necessary, for now. How much will the music change? No clue.
 
U2Kitten said:
How do you all know, there may have been NO REASON for the 'correction' or change except that the music that came out of them was from a different time and a different place, with no ulterior motives!
Click to expand...

this could very well be, but it also well known that U2 works very hard to stay relevant. And that's not a bad thing, that's how theyve been successful for over 25 years.

When they recorded AB it was the hardest thing they've had to do as a band, they nearly broke up over it. But they knew that they had to change their sound in order to stay relevant and not fade off into distant memory like many of the other successful 80's bands.

I think they are always looking for a sound that not only are they feeling at a certain time or place, but also a sound that will keep them as successful as possible.

If this wasn't the case why would they have worked so hard, and forced themselves, to the point of nearly breaking up, to come up with a new sound for the 90's?
 
Chizip and I haven't been on the same page in many ways lately.

But I have to say, the man's right this time. :up:
 
In terms of touring I wonder what do people want them to do. They have come up with all the new video stuff and all the lightning, the switch of drums on LAPOE, the different kinds of stages for stadium and arenas, the confetti, the many changes on the set list (even if it's a little static right now, which shouldn’t be a shock), the comeback of many older songs, new versions for older and NEW songs (like The Fly, Elevation, One, Mysterious Ways, Vertigo, Yahweh), a new kind of spontaneity on their playing (like Larry adding new stuff on some songs every night), the use of new technology, even Adam being more out there. Damn, that seems pretty good to me. Just because they don't have a giant olive on a stick and Edge is not wearing a cowboy suit it doesn't mean that they are playing safe. I agree though that this and the last tours are a lot more conventional than their previous tours, no doubt about that, but that is not necessarily a bad thing. Why turn a rock n' roll show into a circus? I still believe that they are trying out many new things and in the future will do more tours with more imaginative ideas. I think they are just listening to what they feel like they need right now. After more than a decade of writing a whole new book on touring maybe it feels good to not feel like they should reinvent the whole thing all over again. And MAYBE they are not doing so because they simply don't have any groundbreaking ideas right now. But so what? That doesn't mean that will never come up with out of the box kind of stuff for future tours.
 
inmyplace13 said:


Ahem... LEMON

:wink:
Click to expand...

no, they had a giant olive on a stick AND a giant lemon :D

I agree pretty much with what The BrazilianFly said :up: I don't have really any complaints about this tour except the lack of Pop and Zooropa. Everything else is brilliant, the Eurigo stage is :drool:

Chizip is dead on with the threes thing.
 
AtomicBono said:


no, they had a giant olive on a stick AND a giant lemon :D
Click to expand...

Right, but I think the focus should be on the almighty LEMON!

At least the Lemon was always my focal point on that end of the stage.
 
I have two quotes from Bono from sometime during ZooTV that really drive home the contrast for me. The subject is how a good portion of people didn't understand the point of ZooTV. The first quote is in response to how Bono felt about that:

"If they don't get it, I don't give a fuck"

The second quote is in response to the idea of U2 losing fans because of ZooTV:

"We don't need them"

These quotes can be found in the first and second full paragraphs on page 117 of 'Bono: His life, Musci, and Passions' by Laura Jackson.

Take the attitude in those quotes and take what appears to be U2's attitude now. You're telling me they haven't made a concsious decision here?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

Digital Spy 2
I am back
Replies
2
Views
269
Digital Spy 2
Digital Spy 2
dan_smee
I listened to No Line on the Horizon right through tonight for the first time in about 10 years…
2 3
Replies
83
Views
2K
lazarus
lazarus
Janet H
Forum Downtime - software update 1/23-24
Replies
13
Views
683
Headache in a Suitcase
Headache in a Suitcase
Reggie Thee Dog
Are we NOT discussing the Dolby Atmos Mix of Achtung Baby?
Replies
13
Views
1K
count rushmore
count rushmore
L
Play Do You Feel Loved, Babyface, Some Days Are Better Than Others, Playboy Petition
Replies
8
Views
740
rosephile
R

Latest posts

Back
Top Bottom