Songs of Ascent - Part II

[dan_smee]

Biut the vocal on NLOTH isn't very melodic and this is what I mean when I say that I (and others who've reviewed the album on Ebay and actual music critics) can't hear melodies.

I lol'd.

I lol'd hard when I read this.

Ebay reviewers and music critics in the same sentence!

But further to that, what sort of person melds their own taste to what some other randoms say? You can respect someone else's opinion, but saying its gospel is just dumb.

love that ebay reviewers are the supreme overlords of what a melody is. I have seen ebay reviewers with typing so bad that I would seriously doubt their capacity to make toast, so forgive me if I trust how I feel about music, rather than what hot_bitch_694U thinks.

Cheers

 

[Cactus Annie]

Well the guy that sold me the velvet painting of Jesus in an 18 wheeler on Ebay said he loved the melodies. His name was HeySus420.

Any reviewer who said they don't hear melodies should be fired on the spot and never write about music again for they don't know what they are talking about...

I can't hear any melodies either. I agree with him. The melodies of Edge's guitar just dodges in and out. It appears now, all of a sudden, studio sound effects are more important than strong melodies and they've just spent 2 years throwing a box of sound effects down a flight of stairs and released it under the name of NLOTH. A few weeks back you said that it contained subtle melodies. Well I don't want subtle melodies. I want clear, obvious melodies that feels like a hot air dryer in my face: OOTS, MD, COBL and Yahweh. It's more like jazz, which isn't very melodic either.

I don't know how anyone can think any song off Bomb or ATYCLB(or really any of their albums) is more challenging to sing than anything off NLOTH. That just doesn't make sense.

OOTS seems a more difficult song to sing than anything on NLOTH because melodically Bono just seems to be singing one note. Plus I absolutely hate his straining on this album. It may be on purpose but I don't like it. Why is it stronger vocal on this album compaired to Bomb? And please don't say that same boring thing that some people on interference think is the most important thing in singing Because it has higher notes. I don't care about that, he always sings high notes, even on October so that's nothing new. I care more about phrasing, different timing or using the emotion of the song to direct how he sings it. How can he do this when he's not using adequate breath support?

What do you is more difficult to sing? The melodically one note chanting that Mick Jagger does on Satisfaction or the melodically pleasing singing of Elton John in I Guess That's Why They Call It The Blue's. I go for Elton's song.

You'll have to explain this one to me, because Edge has never been "riff oriented", except for a very few exceptions.

Many people have said that they've gone back to the riffs that dominated their music in the first 3 albums. That's probably why I'm not so keen on it. In U2 by U2 Larry said that their music isn't dominated by riffs because as a singer Bono needs more harmonic information. What's changed? In a book I browsed through described their music as tuneless during the early days.


Dan_smee if tons of people say that an album is lacks melodies, surely they can't all be wrong? You can't say everyone has it in for the band. I agree with them. There are songs out there that are more melodic than others. Viva La Vida is more melodic than I Bet You Look Good on The Dancefloor. OOTS is more melodic than Vertigo. Don't Look Back In Anger is more melodic than Welcome To My Generation.

 

[Niceman]

People who think this album lacks melodies are wrong. Simple as that. Objectively wrong!

You can not like the melodies, but I can hum them......

 

[BVS]

I can't hear any melodies either. I agree with him. The melodies of Edge's guitar just dodges in and out. It appears now, all of a sudden, studio sound effects are more important than strong melodies and they've just spent 2 years throwing a box of sound effects down a flight of stairs and released it under the name of NLOTH. A few weeks back you said that it contained subtle melodies. Well I don't want subtle melodies. I want clear, obvious melodies that feels like a hot air dryer in my face: OOTS, MD, COBL and Yahweh. It's more like jazz, which isn't very melodic either.

I'm not sure what your obsession with "sound effects" is, but you don't seem to quite understand what they are, do, or who uses them...

If you want more obvious melodies then maybe Pink is more your style.

This album is full of beautiful melodies, I'm sorry you can't find them.

OOTS seems a more difficult song to sing than anything on NLOTH because melodically Bono just seems to be singing one note. Plus I absolutely hate his straining on this album. It may be on purpose but I don't like it. Why is it stronger vocal on this album compaired to Bomb? And please don't say that same boring thing that some people on interference think is the most important thing in singing Because it has higher notes. I don't care about that, he always sings high notes, even on October so that's nothing new. I care more about phrasing, different timing or using the emotion of the song to direct how he sings it. How can he do this when he's not using adequate breath support?

Not one thing in this paragraph makes any sense.

Many people have said that they've gone back to the riffs that dominated their music in the first 3 albums. That's probably why I'm not so keen on it. In U2 by U2 Larry said that their music isn't dominated by riffs because as a singer Bono needs more harmonic information. What's changed? In a book I browsed through described their music as tuneless during the early days.

Do you know what a 'riff' is? Once again this doesn't make any sense.

Dan_smee if tons of people say that an album is lacks melodies, surely they can't all be wrong? You can't say everyone has it in for the band. I agree with them. There are songs out there that are more melodic than others. Viva La Vida is more melodic than I Bet You Look Good on The Dancefloor. OOTS is more melodic than Vertigo. Don't Look Back In Anger is more melodic than Welcome To My Generation.

I don't know where this "tons of people" are coming from, Ebay? Seriously, that's a legit source now? You seem to be listening to a lot of people who don't know shit about music...

 

[jphelmet]

This does not sound good. I am starting to think this will slip into the typical U2 cycle, and they will mess with this for a good long time before it sees the light of day.

While a spring release date had been mentioned, Bono seems to damping down that expectation now, saying that while they have nine pieces of music that they think are really special, the album will only come out if and when it is as good or better than No Line. And it certainly won't come out, as was reported in some media, this year. Bono is unashamedly clear that he wants No Line On The Horizon to be the U2 product that gets bought this Christmas.

 

[U2girl]

Spring or Fall 2010, either way is fine by me.

 

[Salome]

they won't even have released a 4th single of No line by december 09 at this rate

 

[bathiu]

This does not sound good. I am starting to think this will slip into the typical U2 cycle, and they will mess with this for a good long time before it sees the light of day.

full quote sounds better:

(...)
What will come out of that journey, ultimately, will probably be three albums. Edge is adamant that the work that was done with Rick Rubin (the legendary metal, Beastie Boy and latterly Johnny Cash producer and label boss) before the band went back to make an album with longtime collaborators and de facto fifth and sixth band members Brian Eno and Daniel Lanois, was not shelved, that it is something they will go back to. It just became apparent that the work they were doing with their old friends Brian and Daniel was the album to make right now.

When I suggest to him that Window in The Skies, which came out of those Rick Rubin sessions, is one of the best songs U2 have done in years, Edge agrees that Rubin is great on songs and he says that Window in The Skies is only the tip of the iceberg of the Rubin sessions. But, in the meantime, there will probably be another album from the No Line On The Horizon sessions.

While a spring release date had been mentioned, Bono seems to damping down that expectation now, saying that while they have nine pieces of music that they think are really special, the album will only come out if and when it is as good or better than No Line. And it certainly won't come out, as was reported in some media, this year. Bono is unashamedly clear that he wants No Line On The Horizon to be the U2 product that gets bought this Christmas.
(...)

and it sounds very good to me

 

[Gonna Run 2 U]

Has anyone confirmed sales going up for NLOTH? I was in the store today and there werent many copies left in the many shelves reserved for it. Must have made a good fathers day gift.

 

[Jarvio]

put kettle on duck

 

[jphelmet]

full quote sounds better:

(...)
What will come out of that journey, ultimately, will probably be three albums. Edge is adamant that the work that was done with Rick Rubin (the legendary metal, Beastie Boy and latterly Johnny Cash producer and label boss) before the band went back to make an album with longtime collaborators and de facto fifth and sixth band members Brian Eno and Daniel Lanois, was not shelved, that it is something they will go back to. It just became apparent that the work they were doing with their old friends Brian and Daniel was the album to make right now.

When I suggest to him that Window in The Skies, which came out of those Rick Rubin sessions, is one of the best songs U2 have done in years, Edge agrees that Rubin is great on songs and he says that Window in The Skies is only the tip of the iceberg of the Rubin sessions. But, in the meantime, there will probably be another album from the No Line On The Horizon sessions.

While a spring release date had been mentioned, Bono seems to damping down that expectation now, saying that while they have nine pieces of music that they think are really special, the album will only come out if and when it is as good or better than No Line. And it certainly won't come out, as was reported in some media, this year. Bono is unashamedly clear that he wants No Line On The Horizon to be the U2 product that gets bought this Christmas.
(...)

and it sounds very good to me

first off, i am still hopeful it will be sooner rather than later, but this is very different from what has been reported before.

i hadn't heard this before, that there are only 9 songs finished. it had sounded all along like the whole album was ready to go with 1st single and everything already decided. the quote "the album will only come out if and when it is as good or better than No Line", sounds like every u2 album that ends up taking a really long time. doesn't sound like its ready to be released at all, but they are going to tinker away at it like they always do.

i read the whole article, so the full quote doesn't sound any better to me. you really think from that article the rubin sessions are anywhere near being released?

i guess i have followed u2 far too long, and seen them say a quick turn around many, many times only to see them drag it out.

 

[bathiu]

i read the whole article, so the full quote doesn't sound any better to me. you really think from that article the rubin sessions are anywhere near being released?

I think that releasing 2 more albums the way they did the last 2 (4+years) they will be 60 by the time the Rubin sessions are released.

 

[Yahweh_OMG]

I think that releasing 2 more albums the way they did the last 2 (4+years) they will be 60 by the time the Rubin sessions are released.

that s why I see them speeding up the gap between 2 albums.... 2 years would be fine for me...

 

[bathiu]

that s why I see them speeding up the gap between 2 albums.... 2 years would be fine for me...

still hoping for this "spring release", they will have a break between 2010 and 2011 legs of the 360Tour, and they only need two more songs, so...

 

[jphelmet]

still hoping for this "spring release", they will have a break between 2010 and 2011 legs of the 360Tour, and they only need two more songs, so...

i hope so. i am not trying to be negative here, i just think with u2's track record its best to count on it being later rather than sooner.

if SOA comes out within 2 years of the release of NLOTH i will be ecstatic.

 

[mikal]

hmmm......with these new quotes, i'm afraid i'm joining the the 2013 group. sorry folks, but that sounds like a band that wants to spend at least a year in the studio finishing the album.

 

[U2girl]

first off, i am still hopeful it will be sooner rather than later, but this is very different from what has been reported before.

i hadn't heard this before, that there are only 9 songs finished. it had sounded all along like the whole album was ready to go with 1st single and everything already decided. the quote "the album will only come out if and when it is as good or better than No Line", sounds like every u2 album that ends up taking a really long time. doesn't sound like its ready to be released at all, but they are going to tinker away at it like they always do.

i read the whole article, so the full quote doesn't sound any better to me. you really think from that article the rubin sessions are anywhere near being released?

i guess i have followed u2 far too long, and seen them say a quick turn around many, many times only to see them drag it out.

Well, 9 songs finished and knowing their lead single sounds better than their "we'll make an album quickly" generic talk after ATYCLB and HTDAAB. I'm sure it will take work until they're fully satisfied with it.

I doubt Fall 2009 was ever seriously considered by the band (ie other than Bono's over optimistic idea).

Now if there's no real news until they re-start the tour in 2010...we can worry.

The article doesn't mention any of the potential Spiderman musical leftovers. And if Saints/WITS is indicative of the Rubin material, they can keep that stuff shelved. It seems, anyway, they're more into SOA right now.

 

[jphelmet]

Well, 9 songs finished and knowing their lead single sounds better than their "we'll make an album quickly" generic talk after ATYCLB and HTDAAB. I'm sure it will take work until they're fully satisfied with it.

i agree, not the same as before but also not as good as it originally sounded. you know as soon as they start on different songs, they will start changing and tweaking what they already have. maybe they will work on it during the tour, they do have lots more time in between fewer shows.

like is said, i am still hopeful. just a lot more cautiously optimistic than i was after the initial reports.

 

[Irishteen]

I never expected it this year anyway, a 2010 release was more likely with them working on it between legs 2 and 3 of the tour. If we don't hear about it again by this time next year or if they release a one off single then we know it's not gonna happen but I still think we could get it next year

 

[nirniva]

I'm guessing we'll be seeing SOA sometime in 2010, mainly because they've already got 9 songs finished. If this is going to be an average-length U2 album, they only need about 2 or 3 more songs. Another March release, perhaps?
After that, I'm guessing they'll take a break for a year or two, after which they'll polish up some stuff from the Rubin sessions and release an album based on that. AND we've got the Spider-Man soundtrack to look forward too, along with the live DVD of 360...what a great time to be a U2 fan!

 

[Cactus Annie]

What makes anything on NLOTH more difficult to sing than anything on Bomb?

OOTS,md, Yahwah and CFYT appear to have more complicated vocal lines whilst the tracks on NLOTH seem easier because they are melodically one note.

Eno likes sound effects.

This is How I like Music, in this order:

1/ Melodic (vocal line AND main instrument- either guitar or piano) Big and obvious within a few listens. The Beatles were good at this. You can never tire of a good melody.
2/ Chord Structure (Let It Be has a beautiful chord structure to my ears)
3/ Mix (how this differs from verses, choruses and different sections of the song. BTBS best chracteristic is the jingly guitar in the chorus)
4/ Dynamics (intensity of the song-how it changes)
5/ Groove (not as important as a melody but occassionally I like a bass groove)
6/ Beats (same as above)
7/ Big catchy Hooks (must be from the vocal in order to really be considered catchy so that you can singalong to. People take more notice of the vocals more than anything else so it's pointless relying on other instruments for your hook- like NLOTH)
8/ Choice of the instruments and the sounds they make (I like the sound of electric and accoustic guitars. I also like piano's and synthesizers)
9/ Harmonies (Imagine has rich harmonies)
10/ Originality (or creative sense of the use of any sampling. One day we find out U2 used the same riff from the Fly in NLOTH, just like they did on Lady with the Spining Head.)
11/ Unusual Instruments (Like ocarina's, wooden flutes or recorders, etc)
12/ Unusual Sounds (In one song Pink Floyd recorded the sound of one of the band members dog barking although they did admit that they started to lose the plot when they recorded the sound of busy ants)
13/ Layers (aren't these used to cover up bad playing and singing? Listen to George Michael songs, it's just him singing with very little layers. Hazel Davies in this month's Word magazine mentioned this. They are 4 people in the band, the main thing are drums, bass, guitar and voice. They are not the Electric Light Orchestra. Maybe they should take a few leaves out of George's book)
14/ Production (It's there to serve the songs only. It should not overtake everything else or the musicianship. Producers should take a backseat. On their latest album the Pet Shop Boys didn't process anything through a computer. They played their own instruments)
15/ Skill in Playing (It's not a competitive sport. Some of the best songs in the world have been simple to play. As long as it's nice to the ear then that's all that matters. No stupid flashy guitar solo's if they impede on the song.)
16/ Innovation (whatever that means. If you like a song you like a song. I thought I was the only one of this opinion until my mum said it last week. AB is not innovative. Bowie did it 20 years earlier. Pop wasn't inniviative either. Have you guys ever been to Ibiza?)
17/ Structure (I don't care about this but some people seem to get their knickers in a twist if a song contain a verse-chorus format. As long as it's fitting to the songs purpose. I read that Bono was fascinated when Oasis first came out because they used this format and he got inspired to write his songs like that. So maybe you can blame Noel if you don't like this structure).

Pink is not melodic, her music is catchy. There's a difference

 

[mikal]

What makes anything on NLOTH more difficult to sing than anything on Bomb?

i didn't even care to read the rest of your post. as a singer, i can guarantee that the vocals on NLOTH are a lot more difficult than HTDAAB.

 

[Cactus Annie]

How's that?

 

[mikal]

the key the songs are in. it's pretty simple. the verses on MOS are twice as difficult as anything on HTDAAB.

 

[Cactus Annie]

But he's straing to sing the songs most of the time

What about phrasing?

 

[mikal]

But he's straing to sing the songs most of the time

What about phrasing?

he's a rock singer. of course he's going to strain.

 

[digitize]

You can never tire of a good melody.

No, I'm pretty sure I can.

 

[BVS]

What makes anything on NLOTH more difficult to sing than anything on Bomb?

OOTS,md, Yahwah and CFYT appear to have more complicated vocal lines whilst the tracks on NLOTH seem easier because they are melodically one note.

Well answer this, what makes any song more difficult to sing than others?
And why does "difficulty" matter to you?

99% of singers will tell you that it's the key that will make a song more or less difficult for them.

And stop with the "one note" thing, you are tone deaf if it sounds like one note to you, which is fine I don't mean that as an insult many people are tone deaf and can still really enjoy music.

Eno likes sound effects.

And? What does this have to do with anything?

BTBS best chracteristic is the jingly guitar in the chorus)

Bullet the Blue Sky has "jingly" guitars?

One day we find out U2 used the same riff from the Fly in NLOTH, just like they did on Lady with the Spining Head.)

How many people have to tell you it's not the same riff? It's been pointed out to you by several posters.

13/ Layers (aren't these used to cover up bad playing and singing?

No. They are for texture. Do you think that a song that has a guitar line over a piano over a backbeat with a voice on top is because someone's trying to cover up something? Every song has layers.

Pink is not melodic, her music is catchy. There's a difference

Then I think you may want to try and define "melody" for us because I think you are using an entirely different definition than the rest of us...

But he's straing to sing the songs most of the time

What about phrasing?

Where is he straining?

What about phrasing? What's your point? I really think you are mixing up and confusing so much of the terminology.

 

[shart1780]

Two U2 albums in two years? LOL, no way. I said this before No Line even came out. This is U2. If you think they're gonna work on another album so soon you're dreaming. Never pay attention to anything Bono says, he's full of BS.

I guarantee you we won't get an album until 2012 at the earliest.

 

[BVS]

Two U2 albums in two years? LOL, no way. I said this before No Line even came out. This is U2. If you think they're gonna work on another album so soon you're dreaming. Never pay attention to anything Bono says, he's full of BS.

I guarantee you we won't get an album until 2012 at the earliest.

I think part of the reason this rumour has lasted this long is that it hasn't just been Bono talking about it...

But we shall see.

I'm still hopeful for a spring 2010. They do another promo pitch to see if they can get some Christmas sales of NLOTH. Wrap up tour in October, go into studio and come back the next year and do another leg of the tour incorporating new songs...