SOE 31: Yes, we have no bananas

[dabiggestu2fan]

Originally Posted by Popmartijn

I don't understand why this is such a big low for people. I mean, this has been done all the time in music, artists referencing their own work. From Chuck Berry to The Beatles via Prince to Elvis Costello (who released a whole album sampling and referencing his own work and Wise Up Ghost is a good album), they all do it. So I don't see any issue in U2 referencing/re-imagining part of Volcano. It's not like they're doing something no-one has done before.

Because God forbid you sample your own work!!!! American soul is automatically garbage because of that don't you know??... End sarcasm

[CosmoKramer]

Originally Posted by pop_mofo

Am I the only person who enjoys the refu-jesus???

I haven’t heard the song yet to her how it’s sung and it what context but it seems like a decent play on words.

[U2girl]

Originally Posted by pop_mofo

Am I the only person who enjoys the refu-jesus???

Am I the only one waiting with the refu-jesus until Dec 1st....?

I mean The Blackout. The Little things, The best thing and now Get out...isn't that enough ?

As for trends...LOL. Trendy would be Reach me now or Troubles, not this. And trend chasing started with 1991 however you wish to deny it.

Also...the gap between bad and good U2 isn't new. The band that gave you WOWY also gave you Trip through your wires. The band that gave you Stay also gave you Some days are better than others. The band that gave you One also gave you Miami.

[CosmoKramer]

Originally Posted by U2girl

Am I the only one waiting with the refu-jesus until Dec 1st....?



I mean The Blackout. The Little things, The best thing and now Get out...isn't that enough ?



As for trends...LOL. Trendy would be Reach me now or Troubles, not this. And trend chasing started with 1991 however you wish to deny it.



Also...the gap between bad and good U2 isn't new. The band that gave you WOWY also gave you Trip through your wires. The band that gave you Stay also gave you Some days are better than others. The band that gave you One also gave you Miami.

You’re on point.

Also, Headache always responds with a poop emoji to you but you are in agreement with him on a few points....I imagine he is conflicted on what his emoji response will be.

[Nick66]

Originally Posted by digitize

Okay, I’m just going to be honest: these aren’t very good songs, are they? Like, I guess I’m happy to have a new U2 album, but, like, this is the band that made Bad. Or even BD/COBL/MOS. And now... this? Like, the songs aren’t awful, but they’re just so many tiers removed from what I know U2 are capable of.

Agree with this & pretty much everything else you've said in this thread.

The U2 that made those songs is gone, and isn't coming back. That band vanished, not suddenly, to be sure, but "slowly stripped away" by degrees, until we're left with what we have now. If it had happened suddenly, we'd have noticed...i.e. if they went from Pop straight to SOI.

So what we're left with now is mostly just excuses and rationalisations, even from the people who love this stuff..."The lyrics aren't that bad"..."After playing it ten or twenty times it's growing on me a little bit"..."It sounds the same intentionally, because it's a companion to SOI", "The x remix is better"..."It's great if you ignore the rap bit"... etc. etc. etc. I don't want to have to try to convince myself a U2 song is good.

The thing is, they're not even trying to be the kind of band that made the songs you mentioned. The ambition to be great is gone, replaced merely by the desire to be popular. They stopped trying sometime towards the end of the NLOTH sessions, I think. That's what I meant earlier when I said it seemed like they were regressing as a band. They're simply not the same band w/o Brian & Danny. They're also, frankly, older, so some of this just flat out isn't their fault. The muse doesn't hang around forever, and God has other rooms to walk into.

So yeah, it is hard accept that the band who recorded Bad made these songs, but there it is. As Mikal said, these might be among the last songs we ever get from U2, and we should appreciate the band now, because when they're gone, they're gone.

It's just in many ways that band has been gone for a while anyway....though you can still catch glimpses of them if you manage to catch them on the right night.

[mikal]

Listened to GOOYAW at full blast. Wow what a good song!

[visocchi]

Originally Posted by Axver

It's an interesting contrast between this and the quote DeVaul posted. The chase for radio play strikes me as kind of old fashioned. The band are at a point where any tour will sell on the strength of their overall career, any album is a hot chance at number one, and they'll accumulate heaps of streaming stats too. Radio might be a tough nut to crack but do they need to crack it?

I can't help but feel that a less radio-centric approach would still reap sizeable rewards. I just wonder if some aspects of modern promotion have passed them by and/or working as a heavily corporatised machine makes it hard to move away from the old established approaches. And, well, trying something "new" with SOI burned them hard.

That one hit song can really rev up demand as it did with Beautiful Day and Vertigo and bring in a million casual fans to the ticket sales that would normally not be there. U2 are not immune to low ticket sales even at this point in their career as the two shows in Denver for the Innocence tour in 2015 showed. Plus, they have always wanted to have hits and have their songs be on the radio and apart of the culture of the time. They'll keep trying even if they never have another hit again because it is what they have always done since 1980.

[Hollow Island]

Originally Posted by dabiggestu2fan

Because God forbid you sample your own work!!!! American soul is automatically garbage because of that don't you know??... End sarcasm

the issue for me isn't really that they're reuising their own work on two (supposedly but not really at all in any way) related works but that they're using one of the most lame, embarrassing parts of their catalog

but yeah, American Soul is kinda garbage because the chorus is fucking bad. the rest of it is good and I was impressed with the song until YOU ARE ROCK N ROLL came in. Even if Volcano had never come out this would still be lame af

[dan_smee]

Had a great chat to a coworker today about Kevin Spacey. Not knowing ANY of the details of the events in question (just like all of you), I raised that I was disappointed that he used it as his platform to come out, and that it is potentially damaging for a young gay person struggling with these issues.

My coworker (who is a strong feminist, lefty) said that as none of us know the details, she is also concerned about the fact that these things get reported removed from all socio-cultural context. Standards and norms of twenty years ago are simply not comparable to today, yet we judge people based on current standards without knowing the facts.

This is how I feel about U2s music. Expecting it to be the same is the 80s is a fools errand. Comparing something designed to be consumed in a modern cultural context with things created and interpreted decades ago is moronic.

Greatness is not objective, and less so when we think about what greatness meant to us in the 80s vs now, or what greatness means to the general public in those contexts.

Do I think this stuff is great? No. Is it bad? No. The people spouting extremes on either side are just being obstinate - and the reason people get upset with it is that they want some original thought to engage with instead of mindless, predictable nonsense.

FWIW - I’m enjoying having new music, and I fully acknowledge that means I will artificially play up the degree to which I like these songs. So fucking what? I’m enjoying it.

[purpleblackeye]

I like Get Out....and most of the other songs are pretty good, with the exception of American Soul. It's not even about the Volcano sample - it just seems to have no drive; it plods along and the cliche lyrics call attention to themselves more because Bono's vocal is too high in the mix (not surprising). And why is it that Edge's guitar is so muted in almost every new song? I love Adam's bass, but it's weird that Edge is so reticent and a background player now.

I have to say this though - SOE so far is making SOI like a Kid A or OK Computer in terms of experimentalism or sonic texture (SOI is a favorite of mine though and there is a lot of adventure there that it doesn't get credit for). I am genuinely surprised at how poppy it sounds so far - even the Blackout, which is sort of cheapened by the Fred/Ned Jack/Zach nonsense.

[Axver]

Originally Posted by pop_mofo

Am I the only person who enjoys the refu-jesus???

Originally Posted by mama cass

no, i like it - i think it's a deliberate attempt to provoke the evangelicals maybe - it will really infuriate that lot i'm sure (and certain Interferencers but for other reasons)

Originally Posted by CMIS

Nope, you got company. Its funny, not saying its brilliant. But its not embarrassing

We just found the three people whose lyrical opinions should be forever ignored. I bet you even like the little old lady lyric in Stand Up Comedy.

Originally Posted by kiwilad

Can we rename EYKIW to Cesspool of Ducks and Cults?

PLEASE.

Originally Posted by visocchi

That one hit song can really rev up demand as it did with Beautiful Day and Vertigo and bring in a million casual fans to the ticket sales that would normally not be there. U2 are not immune to low ticket sales even at this point in their career as the two shows in Denver for the Innocence tour in 2015 showed. Plus, they have always wanted to have hits and have their songs be on the radio and apart of the culture of the time. They'll keep trying even if they never have another hit again because it is what they have always done since 1980.

Mate, Beautiful Day and Vertigo were 17 and 13 years ago! Sure, having a radio hit counted for heaps then (even if the iTunes ad is what did more for Vertigo than anything else). But, hell, in 2000 I was a 13 year old who listened obsessively to the radio, and even by 2004 the only reason I ever heard the radio was when the temperamental cassette player in my mother's car decided not to work. By 2009 it didn't matter a jot that Boots tanked; 360 could remain the biggest tour the band ever do.

You can have a huge hit that's part of the culture of the time without radio, quite easily. If U2 are all about snaring a younger audience, go where they are. And that's not the radio.P eople 30 and under aren't exactly sitting around cranking the radio waiting for their favourite tune. They're on Spotify, on YouTube, on social media. That's why starting the promo with The Blackout on Facebook was a good idea - not great, since Facebook has become the ubiquitous social media platform over-40s have discovered and ruined for their kids, but a very positive step anyway. A proper social media blitz would've done more for the band than getting Best Thing to 20th or whatever on Hot AC or Trending CF or Modern Rawk Hitz or Double AABBCC.

[nickoslo]

Ok what about production aspect of thw tour, what can we except?
Screen will defo be new to match jt30 tour resolution, what else?

[dabiggestu2fan]

Originally Posted by dan_smee

Had a great chat to a coworker today about Kevin Spacey. Not knowing ANY of the details of the events in question (just like all of you), I raised that I was disappointed that he used it as his platform to come out, and that it is potentially damaging for a young gay person struggling with these issues.

My coworker (who is a strong feminist, lefty) said that as none of us know the details, she is also concerned about the fact that these things get reported removed from all socio-cultural context. Standards and norms of twenty years ago are simply not comparable to today, yet we judge people based on current standards without knowing the facts.

This is how I feel about U2s music. Expecting it to be the same is the 80s is a fools errand. Comparing something designed to be consumed in a modern cultural context with things created and interpreted decades ago is moronic.

Greatness is not objective, and less so when we think about what greatness meant to us in the 80s vs now, or what greatness means to the general public in those contexts.

Do I think this stuff is great? No. Is it bad? No. The people spouting extremes on either side are just being obstinate - and the reason people get upset with it is that they want some original thought to engage with instead of mindless, predictable nonsense.

FWIW - I’m enjoying having new music, and I fully acknowledge that means I will artificially play up the degree to which I like these songs. So fucking what? I’m enjoying it.

This! I'm really enjoying new music from our favorite lads, but if I start to compare their latest work to their work in their peak decades ago, yes I'll be disappointed ofcourse. I think it's best to enjoy the songs for what they are in its own self and not compare them to their best. We all know their best is behind them so if you compare every new u2 song to their best work, let me tell you, you are going to hate everything they come out with. Kindof depressing to see so many negative reactions especially those who say "the band that gave us ONE, gave us this??". Let the current work stand on its own two feet. Times are way different now than in the 80's and 90's.

[Hollow Island]

Originally Posted by Axver

It's an interesting contrast between this and the quote DeVaul posted. The chase for radio play strikes me as kind of old fashioned. The band are at a point where any tour will sell on the strength of their overall career, any album is a hot chance at number one, and they'll accumulate heaps of streaming stats too. Radio might be a tough nut to crack but do they need to crack it?

I can't help but feel that a less radio-centric approach would still reap sizeable rewards. I just wonder if some aspects of modern promotion have passed them by and/or working as a heavily corporatised machine makes it hard to move away from the old established approaches. And, well, trying something "new" with SOI burned them hard.

Radio will definitely be a tough nut to crack. I don't even know what radio stations they're hoping to be played on. Classic rock and "alt rock" stations won't touch this stuff because it's too pop. Sonically it's most in line with top 40 radio, but it's not fun or dance or Latin or rap enough to land there...and they're also an old rock band. The only song that could be generously classified as rock that I've heard on top 40 over the last few months is Coldplay/Chainsmokers, and I guess Imagine Dragons.

[pop_mofo]

[QUOTE=Axver;8214774]We just found the three people whose lyrical opinions should be forever ignored. I bet you even like the little old lady lyric in Stand Up Comedy.


For what it’s worth, I am definitely not a fan of stand up comedy, so that’s something