Playing it Safe Since Pop

[Yahweh]

Nobody has to "play it safe" after selling 7 million records.

How corny would it look for a mid-40s band to be doing songs with concepts that they did during the 90s period, very corny....and infact I think thats actually one of the reasons that POP flopped in the US because even in their late 30s, they looked out of place doing songs like Discotheque to people.

POP was an excellent album one of my favourites but I think that the band released it too late in their careers for it to be apprciated properly image wise. Achtung Baby was realeased at just the right point where they wearnt seen as being too old to do something conceptually challenging to people, image wise. If U2 had released Achtung Baby in 1997 with the ZooTV tour it probably would have flopped too because of circumstance.

 

[djerdap]

The way I look at this "safe playing" is that I actually don't like it. I think that the next album should bring something new. For me, All That You Can't Leave Behind was not that great. It was an mediocre effort that was redeemed with an excellent How To Dismantle an Atomic Bomb. I will always look at HTDAAB as "ATYCLB as it should have been". Now it's time to move on. I'll be a bit disappointed if the next album is in vein of the last two albums. I grew up with albums like Achtung Baby and Pop, so it's not surprising that I think this way.

 

[ZeroDude]

Does anyone really think the songs from ATYCLB and HTDAAB sonund anything like the Joshiua Tree or Achtung, War, Boy or anything for that matter, I dont..................

 

[doctorwho]

Lyrically, the songs seem simpler....and musically they are shorter.

I was listening to JT today and they were just on a different plain then. Lryically, there is no comparison. The lyrics make you 'think' and reflect a little bit.

Oh yeah... I did a whole TON of thinking with "with or without you... oh oh... I can't liiiiiiiive, with or without you - oooooh, oooh, oh, oh, ooooh, oh...etc.".

The point is, YOU think the JT lyrics are better and more fascinating. I find the lyrics on HTDAAB equally though-provoking in some areas, and far, FAR more intimate in others. The JT era Bono could not write the songs on HTDAAB - he wasn't able to open up then as he can now. Bono may wear shades, but his heart and true self are shown in his lyrics. The JT era Bono couldn't (and perhaps wouldn't) do this.

 

[The OOTS]

WOWY is the most commercially successful song on that album.
How intimate are the do-doots on Original of the Species?????


Yes, I think the lyrics are WAY more fascinating and complex on UF, JT, AB, Zooropa, Pop.

And, I understand it is my opinion.

 

[80sU2isBest]

I don't believe they did anything for any other reason other than that's what they wanted to do at the time- ever- for any album. Pop was in them in 97, this is what's in them now. That's all.

I agree.

And "wild experimentation" doesn't automatically equal "good".

If ATYCLB and Bomb are "safe", then give me safety.

 

[ponkine]

Alright: it´s time to put on the table one thing:

Pop wasn´t bad received: that´s SO wrong. I don´t know how old are most fans here, but it´s clear they don´t remember Pop times . Pop was extraordinary well received by all critics, fans and media
The only one problem was U.S sales. Despite Pop sold 10 million copies, in the USA they didn´t sell the amount of copies they wanted.

 

[doctorwho]

WOWY is the most commercially successful song on that album.
How intimate are the do-doots on Original of the Species?????


Yes, I think the lyrics are WAY more fascinating and complex on UF, JT, AB, Zooropa, Pop.

And, I understand it is my opinion.

I'm so glad you understand that - because hopefully you'll then understand that I disagree. Using the excuse that WOWY is "the most commercially successful" song isn't valid. It's a song on that album and it qualifies. We can't start excusing songs because they are "hits". But if you want, I can go on... how painfully obvious is "I Still Haven't Found..."? How annoying and ridiculous is "Trip Through Your Wires"? And JT is full of songs about events. The most personal Bono gets is "Streets" which was inspired by his trip to Africa. In contrast, Bono - from "Pop" through HTDAAB - has very personal, inspirational lyrics. He's not whining and preaching any more. He's telling a story. He's relaying personal thoughts about life and his family. To me, this is far more thought-provoking than having someone tell me about "God's Country".

 

[The OOTS]

There is no intimate message in I Still Haven't Found....???

War, UF, JT, Pop don't tell stories??????? And if those albums are whiny and preachy...give me THOSE any day.

AS far as ridiculous songs...please....they are on EVERY Album.

I guess I enjoyed the messages, the struggles, the condemnations, the poetry. You need to hear about Bono's personal life and family...the 'safer' issues.

 

[U2_Guy]

Alright: it´s time to put on the table one thing:

Pop wasn´t bad received: that´s SO wrong. I don´t know how old are most fans here, but it´s clear they don´t remember Pop times . Pop was extraordinary well received by all critics, fans and media
The only one problem was U.S sales. Despite Pop sold 10 million copies, in the USA they didn´t sell the amount of copies they wanted.

Pop was extremely well received. Rolling Stone magazine said marvellous things about Pop (i have that mag and just read the review once again). But, as you say, most americans didn't really "get" what U2 wanted with Pop & Popmart. You know, the average music buyer in the USA don't want edgy music that actually makes you think. The price we U2 fans that love that kind of music pay? ATYCLB, and to a lesser extent HTDAAB.

But you're right. Pop was a huge record all over the world.

 

[Lancemc]

U2 have moved on. Get over it.

 

[doctorwho]

There is no intimate message in I Still Haven't Found....???

War, UF, JT, Pop don't tell stories??????? And if those albums are whiny and preachy...give me THOSE any day.

AS far as ridiculous songs...please....they are on EVERY Album.

I guess I enjoyed the messages, the struggles, the condemnations, the poetry. You need to hear about Bono's personal life and family...the 'safer' issues.

Please! Safer issues?! ANYONE can write about the "tragedies of the world". Oh boo hoo - look at the starving people, how rich America is, how bad America is... look at the dead poet, the injustice of it all! That's poetry 101.

Give me actual life experiences - something you can ONLY get from living, not ranting about the injustices of the world. Those topics are about as safe, and banal, as possible! This is why I've always felt that JT is the closest U2 came to "selling out". They wrote about topics that everyone can say, "yeah - that's not right" to. From my perspective, it seems it's you who likes the "safe" topics. It's far more risky to be personal.

Besides how often do you want Bono to write about war? How often do you want him to write about Africa? He had "Walk On" on the last album, dedicated to a person and "event" (the tragedies in a country). And HTDAAB has songs like L&PorE - hardly a "safe" topic.

Maybe you need your lyrics more abstract so you can interpret them how you wish. I like those - I admit - but it's nice to see a change, and the more personal lyrics on the last 3 albums are a wonderfully refreshing when compared to the more simple abstract thoughts of earlier works.

 

[doctorwho]

Alright: it´s time to put on the table one thing:

Pop wasn´t bad received: that´s SO wrong. I don´t know how old are most fans here, but it´s clear they don´t remember Pop times . Pop was extraordinary well received by all critics, fans and media
The only one problem was U.S sales. Despite Pop sold 10 million copies, in the USA they didn´t sell the amount of copies they wanted.

Just a slight correction... "Pop" sold 6-8M copies, depending on which source you read. What's known for a fact is that it sold 1.5M copies in the U.S.

 

[barrett]

For whatever reason, the American audience did not appreciate two excellent albums in POP or Zooropa. The last two albums have been more mainstream and probably geared to US listeners. Remember no band today has the fan base or impact that U2 does at almost 20 years past their commercial prime. I think U2 got scared in the late 90's and felt they would lose the American audience. The last two albums returned them to the US masses. The last tour and this tour will also concentrate on the US and solidify themselves with the fans and media. With these two successful albums, I think U2 will be a bit more original and experimental with the next album. If not, U2's safe albums are still better than anything else.

 

[U2girl]

You know what's interesting?

While some claim ATYCLB and HTDAAB were geared to US listeners - and so what if they were? U2 never hid their fondness of America - no one seems to mind Joshua Tree or Rattle and Hum and if those weren't geared to Americans, I don't know which U2 album is.

Also, consider it's easier to try new things on the back of a hugely succesful album like JT or AB.
ATYCLB didn't have that wave to ride on.

 

[cardosino]

Please! Safer issues?! ANYONE can write about the "tragedies of the world". Oh boo hoo - look at the starving people, how rich America is, how bad America is... look at the dead poet, the injustice of it all!

Seems to me that all albums have a mix of songs about "something" (Crumbs, miracle drug, BTBS, MOTD), and the personal (WOWY, ISHWILF, SYCMIOYO, OSC) when you really break it down.

Personally I think their most "unsafe" release was in releasing WOWY as the 1st single off of JT. This was the band ont he verge of being the biggest band in the world, and they release a bittersweet most un-radio-esque song you could imagine as the first single.

 

[The OOTS]

I totally agree that the last 2 albums were geared towards mainstream fans in the US. I also agree they were a bit scared of losing the American audience after Pop. I think with ATYCLB, they tried to write simpler, easy listening, pop songs to appeal to a mass American audience. The US also happens to be where the big money is as well. That is why they toured the US twice last time around, and will with the upcoming tour where they know than can get $135+ for seats.

 

[Sleep Over Jack]

Alright: it´s time to put on the table one thing:

Pop wasn´t bad received: that´s SO wrong. I don´t know how old are most fans here, but it´s clear they don´t remember Pop times . Pop was extraordinary well received by all critics, fans and media
The only one problem was U.S sales. Despite Pop sold 10 million copies, in the USA they didn´t sell the amount of copies they wanted.

This is the second time you've stated incorrectly that POP sold 10million....


It sold 6-7million tops.

 

[Lancemc]

One more post Jack and you break 1000. Quick! Say something funny!

 

[Sleep Over Jack]

Good Lord!

 

[Yahweh]

I dont think the last 2 albums are geared towards US listeners they are geared towards U2 listeners.

As I said before POP came out too late in U2s career for it to be truely apprciated because people dont expect 38 year olds to be doing "techno" beats, it was all image that made the album fail in the US.

It did not sell 10 million copies either, it sold 6.5 to 7 million copies which is still a really amazing total it just didnt happen to be what was expected from the slumping record industry at the time, which is still slumping by the way.

I agree with a 1997 Bono quote "The industry is slumping because the records are boring", it still holds very true today.

Will we see an album like Achtung Baby, Zooropa or POP again probably not will we continue to see great albums I would put a bet on it being most definately, U2 are absolute masters at their craft.

 

[U2_Guy]

U2 have moved on. Get over it.

I think you meant moved backwards.

 

[U2Kitten]

And "wild experimentation" doesn't automatically equal "good".

If ATYCLB and Bomb are "safe", then give me safety.

 

[Sleep Over Jack]

Even most of U2's more experimental works have been anchored with pop elements...look at The Fly for instance, great hummable melodies there as well as the sci-fi rock guitar. I for one am glad they have such strong instincts for melody.

 

[U2Kitten]

This is the second time you've stated incorrectly that POP sold 10million....


It sold 6-7million tops.

True, and as doctorwho pointed out the big number was only 1.5 million on the US.

Here is a thread with all the official stats on the sales of POP and ATYCLB:

http://forum.interference.com/t106060.html

 

[LMP]

What I really don't get is why didn't it do so well in the US or rest of the world too it's up there lyrically w/ AB at times and sonically w/ Zooropa at times.

I stress, at times

 

[Saracene]

Strength of lyrics isn't usually the big selling point with albums; and Zooropa was an in-between album coming after the popularity of AB.

And I think that the whole campy/garish image of the band at that time did a lot of harm. For me the whole era has a whiff of trying too hard, which I don't feel about ZooTV even though it was much more radical coming on the heels of the 80s. And that spreads to POP lyrics too; that album has some of the greatest lyrics Bono's ever written, but from time to time I feel he tries to be too self-consciously clever-clever.

And IMO there's a world of difference between the way an album is received initially and the way it's viewed some time later on (often unfairly).