New Album Discussion

[dan_smee]

I don't think that U2 ever consciously chose to have three trilogies of albums.

Agreed. There is an undeniable series of trilogies going on there, but I think that is more a by-product of them being bored of a certain style after 3 albums, and not the result of a conscious decision to make 3 albums, and move on systematically.

 

[djerdap]

Personally, I have no problems with the "chimes" per se, just the uninspired phoned-in playing that Edge displayed on NLOTH. Cedars was probably the only track where he demonstrated some innovation. I don't think anyone is expecting Edge to radically shift from his recognisable minimalistic style, but he really was the weak(est) link on NLOTH. Eno ended up doing a lot of the heavy lifting on the better tracks, and I can't help but feel he was compensating for Edge's overwhelming blandness.

Completely agree.

In almost every moment on the album that begged for The Edge to step in and bring the song to another level - which he did quite successfully in the past - he brought it to an underwhelming and anti-climactic point. His bland "solos" on Moment of Surrender and Magnificent are the epitome of this.

 

[LemonMirrorSky]

Completely agree.

In almost every moment on the album that begged for The Edge to step in and bring the song to another level - which he did quite successfully in the past - he brought it to an underwhelming and anti-climactic point. His bland "solos" on Moment of Surrender and Magnificent are the epitome of this.

If you thought his work on NLOTH was bland, what about HTDAAB?? Geez!

Personally I think that the last time he really impressed us was on Pop. But out of the last 3 albums, I would take NLOTH over the rest.

 

[djerdap]

I actually think, while the songwriting is pretty underwhelming on The Bomb, his guitar playing delivers in making some tracks work more than they should. Miracle Drug is one great example with the slide solo, his work on Love and Peace makes me try to ignore the godawful lyrics as much as possible, while City of Blinding Lights and even something as syrupy as Original of the Species have some memorable guitar parts. Bono was the main Bomb problem, along with the overcooked production.

However, his boring and derivative work on All Because of You did foreshadow some of his approach on No Line on the Horizon.

 

[Nick66]

I don't think that U2 ever consciously chose to have three trilogies of albums.

I agree. There's certainly some neatness and logic to looking at their records as trilogies after the fact (and actually it does work to do so), but they probably didn't intended it that way. I do think, however, that they've noticed it just as the fans have, and at this point, whether because it's a new "trilogy" or, more a new decade, there's clearly a vibe that they are entering their next (and probably last) phase.

If you thought his work on NLOTH was bland, what about HTDAAB?? Geez!

Personally I think that the last time he really impressed us was on Pop. But out of the last 3 albums, I would take NLOTH over the rest.

I've always been a bit baffled by the slamming of Edge's work on NLOTH here. After my initial (favourable) impressions of the record's sound on the first listen, the next thing I noticed was Edge's playing, which stood out to me in a way it didn't on the previous 00's records.

 

[LemonMirrorSky]

I actually think, while the songwriting is pretty underwhelming on The Bomb, his guitar playing delivers in making some tracks work more than they should. Miracle Drug is one great example with the slide solo, his work on Love and Peace makes me try to ignore the godawful lyrics as much as possible, while City of Blinding Lights and even something as syrupy as Original of the Species have some memorable guitar parts. Bono was the main Bomb problem, along with the overcooked production.

However, his boring and derivative work on All Because of You did foreshadow some of his approach on No Line on the Horizon.

But Bomb was chimes galore!! Anyway I can kind of see your point. Neither album was anything much to write home about when it came to Edge's work. But I do like his contribution to Cedars though.

 

[LemonMirrorSky]

And no matter what anyone says, I enjoy the heck out of the chord changes on Magnificent and the guitar work on Breathe as well. So... whatever.

 

[The Sad Punk]

Aww yeah The Edge that third chord you played just now was perfect dogg

Maybe play it again a little later alright

 

[Registered Dude]

y'all are harsh.

This conversation reminds me of a time I was on a bus in Dublin, and there were two little old ladies in the seat in front of me reading the newspaper. They had thick, northside accents.

The conversation revolved around Edge, and an article about his daughter, who was in the hospital.
I'll never forget the conversation. Just a simple exchange:

little old lady #1: "Ahh would ya look at dis, yer man from U2, De Edge, his daughter's in the hospital."

little old lady #2: "Tsk.. ah. poor De Edge."

 

[LemonMelon]

Aww yeah The Edge that third chord you played just now was perfect dogg

Maybe play it again a little later alright

Be supportive of Larry, he needs it at his age.

 

[LemonMirrorSky]

I've always been a bit baffled by the slamming of Edge's work on NLOTH here. After my initial (favourable) impressions of the record's sound on the first listen, the next thing I noticed was Edge's playing, which stood out to me in a way it didn't on the previous 00's records.

The thing I liked (and still like) most about NLOTH was that the subtlety and atmosphere was back after the brick-in-the-face Bomb. It is a little bit like their Zooropa or Unforgettable Fire of the 00s. I know that's a bold statement considering clunkers like the middle 3 songs but I still think it is miles ahead of ATYCLB and particularly Bomb. Even in a song like Magnificent which some consider to be U2 phoning it in or whatever... I hear subtlety in parts.. and atmosphere. which just wasn't there in a comparable song like say COBL on Bomb. So... okay what was my point here.. lol.. I guess I just appreciate NLOTH as a whole and never bothered really to dissect Edge's guitar work out of it and really evaluate it as a stand-alone feature.

 

[Vlad n U 2]

y'all are harsh.

This conversation reminds me of a time I was on a bus in Dublin, and there were two little old ladies in the seat in front of me reading the newspaper. They had thick, northside accents.

The conversation revolved around Edge, and an article about his daughter, who was in the hospital.
I'll never forget the conversation. Just a simple exchange:

little old lady #1: "Ahh would ya look at dis, yer man from U2, De Edge, his daughter's in the hospital."

little old lady #2: "Tsk.. ah. poor De Edge."

This is the most interesting post in this thread everyone else can go home now.

 

[lazarus]

The thing I liked (and still like) most about NLOTH was that the subtlety and atmosphere was back after the brick-in-the-face Bomb. It is a little bit like their Zooropa or Unforgettable Fire of the 00s. I know that's a bold statement considering clunkers like the middle 3 songs but I still think it is miles ahead of ATYCLB and particularly Bomb. Even in a song like Magnificent which some consider to be U2 phoning it in or whatever... I hear subtlety in parts.. and atmosphere. which just wasn't there in a comparable song like say COBL on Bomb. So... okay what was my point here.. lol.. I guess I just appreciate NLOTH as a whole and never bothered really to dissect Edge's guitar work out of it and really evaluate it as a stand-alone feature.

I can get behind this.

 

[Nick66]

The thing I liked (and still like) most about NLOTH was that the subtlety and atmosphere was back after the brick-in-the-face Bomb. It is a little bit like their Zooropa or Unforgettable Fire of the 00s. I know that's a bold statement considering clunkers like the middle 3 songs but I still think it is miles ahead of ATYCLB and particularly Bomb. Even in a song like Magnificent which some consider to be U2 phoning it in or whatever... I hear subtlety in parts.. and atmosphere. which just wasn't there in a comparable song like say COBL on Bomb. So... okay what was my point here.. lol.. I guess I just appreciate NLOTH as a whole and never bothered really to dissect Edge's guitar work out of it and really evaluate it as a stand-alone feature.

Yep.

I can get behind this.

I can get behind this.²

 

[pepokiss]

I'm still waiting for this one...

 

[U2girl]

How are the producers responsible for rehashes? Does Brian Eno break out a guitar and tell Edge what to play? Did the same Lanois that was miffed at what U2 ended up doing on NLOTH push them towards a sound that ending up making him miffed at them? Make some sense here.

It was Bono that talked Edge back into his "Coca-Cola riff" back in 2000.
Blame that on the band. It's their music and they have the ultimate say-so.

U2 have worked with 8 different producers over 4 albums - Howie B, Flood, Nellee Hooper, Eno, Lanois, Chris Thomas, Jacknife, Lillywhite - and not one of those 4 albums was "cohesive". Not one. They were all 'Best of' the eras.

Maybe it's just time to stop blaming the producers. And/or giving them that much credit for 'new sounds' that U2 end up moving away from anyhow.

U2 will either have the goods or they won't. Regardless of who is producing. What DM/Burton gives them - is a different and younger perspective. A fresher set of years. A jolt of confidence. And if they don't listen to him, it's not going to matter. They stopped listening to Eno and Lanois.

And the ONE time we know they listened to them on NLOTH was on Moment of Surrender, pretty much the universally accepted best song on NLOTH (not my fav, but the consensus) - when E/L told them to leave it the fuck alone.

The one piece of hard evidence we have - is that quite possibly, they should have listened MORE to Eno and Lanois on NLOTH. But I know that conflicts with your 'narrative', so I wonder why I bother even as I type these words.

They are working closely together, specifically they were writing together on NLOTH. How do they not have input on the music ?

The "Coca cola riff" (whatever that's supposed to mean) works and it was fresh at the time. Unlike a lot of what made it on Bomb and NLOTH on Edge's part. It's nice if done right and not overused. Notice how Bono evaded the self help-book lyrical approach from ATYCLB and Bomb and moved onto in-character writing on NLOTH (almost but not quite, making up for the guitar player resting on his laurels...). There's absolutely no reason Edge can't lay off the chimes and "rawk" riffs. Bring it back if you must have a retro album like Bomb, but enough is enough.

True. They haven't had a true album since Zooropa. But they also haven't used Eno/Lanois and/or Lillywhite for a full decade before, and it shows.

Fresh ears, that is the point. Move away from Eno and Lanois because they can't bring anything new to the table.

We also knew Eno, post NLOTH, admitted they were wrong on the Morocco sounds and ultimately it didn't sound credible enough. But that flies in the face of the narrative of "sell out U2" dropping out of Morocco sounds...

 

[U2girl]

This is bullshit. The band was clearly interested in trying something different by recording in Morocco, even if the more heavily-influenced experiments didn't make it to the album. There's also the increase in group singing, chants, etc.

Fez, Cedars of Lebanon, Moment Of Surrender, even the vibe on Magnificent don't sound like anything from the two previous albums.

Morocco was overhyped.

Magnificent is everything U2 wanted so badly on Bomb - getting the vintage U2 sound yet updating it for the 21st century. (like I said, NLOTH is basically Bomb done right/better). There's plenty of non mistakable 00's U2 on NLOTH.

Cedars brings back U2 circa Pop.

Fez is UF U2 crossing paths with Zooropa U2.

 

[super fly guy]

Why do people hate the bomb? In my opinion its a great album, and so is no line. I don't know what they have planned next but I cant wait!

 

[digitize]

Why do people hate the bomb? In my opinion its a great album, and so is no line. I don't know what they have planned next but I cant wait!

I can't speak for others, but ABOY alone brings it down by a significant amount in my books.

However, I love No Line.

 

[Blue Room]

Why do people hate the bomb? In my opinion its a great album, and so is no line. I don't know what they have planned next but I cant wait!

I think it is a very good album, it gets way more hate than it deserves. It has a couple of very weak tracks that seem to bring the whole album down for a lot of people. But you could say that about almost every single U2 album except JT and AB though.

Very good album, great tour.

 

[PhilsFan]

Why do people hate the bomb? In my opinion its a great album, and so is no line. I don't know what they have planned next but I cant wait!

To summarize, since you're asking (note that I'm not of all of these opinions, this is just representative):
- It's poorly produced, including clipping heard on the opening of Crumbs.
- There's no cohesion. It feels like a "collection of singles." The tracklisting makes little sense (i.e. Sometimes into LAPOE) and it lacks the "whole greater than the sum" feel of many of U2's earlier albums.
- It's a pretty terrible album lyrically.
- People really don't like the album version of Yahweh, and One Step Closer is pretty divisive as well.
- Others find Miracle Drug/Sometimes boring, some find OOTS very sappy, others ABOY easy.
- Double-tracked vocals on ABOY and Crumbs.
- Again, this album is just really bad lyrically.

 

[Vlaco]

To summarize, since you're asking (note that I'm not of all of these opinions, this is just representative):
- It's poorly produced, including clipping heard on the opening of Crumbs.
- There's no cohesion. It feels like a "collection of singles." The tracklisting makes little sense (i.e. Sometimes into LAPOE) and it lacks the "whole greater than the sum" feel of many of U2's earlier albums.
- It's a pretty terrible album lyrically.
- People really don't like the album version of Yahweh, and One Step Closer is pretty divisive as well.
- Others find Miracle Drug/Sometimes boring, some find OOTS very sappy, others ABOY easy.
- Double-tracked vocals on ABOY and Crumbs.
- Again, this album is just really bad lyrically.

This. That album really represented an all-time low in their career.

 

[OpenG180]

It's an ear bleeder. Terrible mastering. TERRIBLE. It's a torture to listen to this album on CD or mp3 or any other digital medium. Mastered too hot. Too much compression. A serious contender to win the loudness war. It's probably behind Death Magnetic or Stadium Arcadium.

The vinyl is better but not much.

 

[lov12113]

I completely disagree. An album is made of it's songs, and HTDAAB has a lot of great tracks. For me, it's not a big deal that all the songs aren't "cohesive" with each other. In fact, it is a lot more cohesive than it gets credit for. There are certain themes that run throughout the entire album, and last time I checked, that means there is some cohesiveness. It's personally one of my favorite U2 albums. I'd rather listen to HTDAAB than a lot of their other albums, though it isn't min my top 3. And for all the B.S. about the lyrics sucking, I find the lyrics pretty interesting (i.e. good). The only song that has substandard lyrics is Veritgo, in my opinion. It always amazes me how so many people here seem to hate this record, when it's not really deserved, and it is certainly not what the general public thinks of the album. Hate it or love it. I love it.

 

[lov12113]

I think it is a very good album, it gets way more hate than it deserves. It has a couple of very weak tracks that seem to bring the whole album down for a lot of people. But you could say that about almost every single U2 album except JT and AB though.

Very good album, great tour.

Spot on. It was a great record.

 

[U2girl]

It was Bono that talked Edge back into his "Coca-Cola riff" back in 2000.

Actually it was the other way around. Bono wanted to talk him out of it until Edge gave him the dirty look and (correctly) kept the riff.

 

[digitize]

I highly recommend listening to a vinyl rip of Bomb. It doesn't make it a good album, but it makes the good tracks on it (if you think that there are any) far more pleasing to listen to.

 

[CosmoKramer]

I completely disagree. An album is made of it's songs, and HTDAAB has a lot of great tracks. For me, it's not a big deal that all the songs aren't "cohesive" with each other. In fact, it is a lot more cohesive than it gets credit for. There are certain themes that run throughout the entire album, and last time I checked, that means there is some cohesiveness. It's personally one of my favorite U2 albums. I'd rather listen to HTDAAB than a lot of their other albums, though it isn't min my top 3. And for all the B.S. about the lyrics sucking, I find the lyrics pretty interesting (i.e. good). The only song that has substandard lyrics is Veritgo, in my opinion. It always amazes me how so many people here seem to hate this record, when it's not really deserved, and it is certainly not what the general public thinks of the album. Hate it or love it. I love it.

Well said. I love this album.

For me:

Great songs-
Love and Peace...sick guitar and bass
Miracle Drug....Edge's singing part is awesome
Vertigo....song just pumps me up. The first time I heard it, I was like WOW and to this day it's so energetic

Good songs-
One Step Closer(its slow and I didn't like it at first but it REALLY grew on me over the years)
City of Blinding Lights...should be in the great category but just doesn't get to that level with me for some reason
ABOY single version...the album version is average because to my ears, the chorus is off beat and not timed well....very strange


Additionally, Vertigo and City of Blinding lights have become "classics" live (ie they get the crowd going nuts)

I will say that Crumbs is a horrible song but I can find at least one "horrible" song on every album they have (POP has several) so I look at the album as a whole and this album is great.

On a side note, years and years ago I posted how I hated Wake Up Dead Man and some poster basically called me an idiot for not liking it. Well, all theses years later....I still HATE that song with a passion and think it is rubbish that took up perfectly good album space (BTW...I like POP as a whole, if only the single versions of some of those songs were on the album.....if only!)

 

[Gonna Run 2 U]

I would be excited if he was talking about Kings Of Leon. They seem like a bunch of arrogant pricks at this point but they have made some pretty awesome music. Caleb has a unique voice love it or hate it you know it's him.

 

[lazarus]

U2 have worked with 8 different producers over 4 albums - Howie B, Flood, Nellee Hooper, Eno, Lanois, Chris Thomas, Jacknife, Lillywhite - and not one of those 4 albums was "cohesive". Not one. They were all 'Best of' the eras.

True. They haven't had a true album since Zooropa. But they also haven't used Eno/Lanois and/or Lillywhite for a full decade before, and it shows.

I have to disagree with something here. Whether or not you feel Pop was compromised, produced poorly, ill-advised, rushed to completion whatever, I don't understand how one can't consider it cohesive or a "true album".

The track order/selection is pretty solid, especially compared to the unfortunate last-minute change on ATYCLB, the last-minute dropping of Mercy and Fast Cars on Bomb, and that desperate middle section on No Line. I wish they had made room for North And South Of The River and/or I'm Not Your Baby, but whatever.

Thematically, it's one of their most cohesive works, with Bono and other characters struggling with their faith against the dizzying backdrop of fin-de-sicle culture. He begins the album with the futile escapism of Discotheque, pleads for his mother's approval on MOFO, questions his own existence and career on Gone, and ends the album with a cynical call for peace followed by a wish to resurrect his mother. This isn't all over the place.

Sonically, I don't think this is erratic from track to track. You may not like Miami, but it flows perfectly out of Gone and transitions perfectly to Playboy Mansion, for example. It's just as well-sequenced as Achtung Baby.