MERGED--> U2 Recording With Kanye West + Kanye & U2

[LemonAid]

Why would Kanye want to be less creative?

ouch! ...but have a point.


Kanye: "....Freedom has the scent of a what?!??....."

 

[Flying FuManchu]

Not one of those examples was a true collaboration between U2 and a hip hop artist.

The Wyclef thing was already a song that Wyclef wrote and recorded, he re-recorded it with Bono throwing in a few lines.

The Wyclef Edge thing was just a one off live show.

And the Pras thing with a sample? Um yeah who cares, it was a sample.

Didn't Bono also play guitar on that New Day song as well as write lyrics? I belive so. IF that isn't a true collaboration, I don't know what is. Wyclef did write some lyrics but Bono did as well.

I'm not talking about the concert where Edge played guitar with Wyclef. A track called "Class Reunion" on one of Jean's albums has Edge playing guitar (Joshua Tree style) throughout the whole track.

The Pras thing was a sample of ISHFWILF... actually it was pretty much the whole song redone P-Diddy style (alah what Diddy did with the Sting song). Sorry, but hip hop tends to do that bad sampling thing where they add the big beats and polish up the sound. Who's to say that won't happen in a U2- Kanye collaboration.


IMO everything didn't have the COMPLETE U2 collaborating but its not like Adam or Larry are going to add anything outside of a bass and drums WHICH tend to be what these hip hop producers focus a lot on. Do you think Kanye as the producer (or any hip hop collaborator) will put the onus on Larry or Adam to create hip hop beats? Hell naw!

I keep thinking of that awful Metallica- Ja Rule collaboration and seeing the same thing. Oh yeah! Rapper rapping over a U2 instrumental with huge hip hop beats. LOL.

 

[Flying FuManchu]

If U2 want to have fun with it, they should... sort of like doing a jam for the fun of it. Its just the past results aren't inspring enough to believe that a Kanye partnership will create magic or some kind of great fusion.


Its also easier to believe that b/c its two different genres trying to make something work, they'll probably try to avoid stepping on each other's toes and say that something that sounds like crap or at best, "cheesey as hell," is great stuff.

 

[JMScoopy]

the idea of U2 doing a "hip-hop album" or having some rapper on one of their albums makes me sick to my stomach.

 

[doubleU]

Didn't Bono also play guitar on that New Day song as well as write lyrics? I belive so. IF that isn't a true collaboration, I don't know what is. Wyclef did write some lyrics but Bono did as well.

Bono adding a few lines does not make a U2 and hip hop collaboration.

I'm not talking about the concert where Edge played guitar with Wyclef. A track called "Class Reunion" on one of Jean's albums has Edge playing guitar (Joshua Tree style) throughout the whole track.

Fair enough, never heard of it.

The Pras thing was a sample of ISHFWILF... actually it was pretty much the whole song redone P-Diddy style (alah what Diddy did with the Sting song). Sorry, but hip hop tends to do that bad sampling thing where they add the big beats and polish up the sound. Who's to say that won't happen in a U2- Kanye collaboration.

Um, yeah I know what it was. But how can this be a collaboration? They asked to use the sample, U2 said yes, they got paid end of story. It's not a collaboration. We don't know what they are going to do, but if they are in the studio together they more than likely aren't going to use an old U2 song and just add lyrics and beats.

Do you think Kanye as the producer (or any hip hop collaborator) will put the onus on Larry or Adam to create hip hop beats? Hell naw!

We have no clue. Not all rock and hip hop collaborations have been this way. Judgement Night soundtrack had a few that weren't this way.

 

[doubleU]

the idea of U2 doing a "hip-hop album" or having some rapper on one of their albums makes me sick to my stomach.

No one ever said they were going to do a "hip hop album".

Read out of context much?

 

[Flying FuManchu]

How is the ISHFWILF being used not a collaboration to a degree when they pretty much used the whole song? They let Pras use the song the way he used it. Hell, he might have even had it done and sent them the end result and they gave the OK which would even be worse.


I'd like to know how pro-Kanye/ hip hop collaborators crowd think U2 and say Kanye would collaborate? Is U2 gonna get together in a studio and play a song and Kanye is gonna play with them alah Lanois? Don't think so. Is U2 gonna try to improvise on the spot and Kanye is gonna rap over it? Yikes... typical... stuff. How in the process itself will U2 avoid the suckage that normally comes from a collaboration between two distinct genres with two different personalities which can potentially clash and not let it result in suckage. If Jean couldn't make it interesting, I sort of doubt Kanye will.

 

[Flying FuManchu]

No one ever said they were going to do a "hip hop album".

Read out of context much?

Then what's the big deal with collaborating with Kanye then? They just want him to produce a typical rock album?

 

[JMScoopy]

No one ever said they were going to do a "hip hop album".

Read out of context much?

i know that

i was saying if they did.

 

[doubleU]

How is the ISHFWILF being used not a collaboration to a degree when they pretty much used the whole song? They let Pras use the song the way he used it. Hell, he might have even had it done and sent them the end result and they gave the OK which would even be worse.

So if I added a sun to a Picasso painting, I can tell everyone we collaborated together? Sounds great.

If Jean couldn't make it interesting, I sort of doubt Kanye will.

Here's where you keep screwing it up. I did some reading on the Class Reunion thing. Wyclef wrote and recorded everything, Edge came in later and added guitar. So it was already sucking.

And yes I would love to hear the "U2 gonna try to improvise on the spot and Kanye is gonna rap over it". I think it could be brilliant.

 

[doubleU]

i know that

i was saying if they did.

Yeah and if U2 did a polka album that would suck too.

 

[Flying FuManchu]

So if I added a sun to a Picasso painting, I can tell everyone we collaborated together? Sounds great.



Here's where you keep screwing it up. I did some reading on the Class Reunion thing. Wyclef wrote and recorded everything, Edge came in later and added guitar. So it was already sucking.

And yes I would love to hear the "U2 gonna try to improvise on the spot and Kanye is gonna rap over it". I think it could be brilliant.

You want to deny the collaboration of the Edge? They worked together. Don't deny it considering the guitar is prevalent in that track. No, on the Picasso thing b/c Picasso is dead, so that wouldn't fit what is defined as a collaboration b/c you can't work together with a dead person, especially intellectually.

LOL at you also shifting the blame of a song's suckiness away from the Edge considering he did work by writing a KEY part of the song.

Sure... listening to Kanye rap over the band improvising might be interesting, like for laughs...

 

[Catman]

'Cause notning says street cred like Boner in your tracks.

Street cred is overrated

 

[MrBrau1]

Why would Kanye want to be less creative?

Right.

We all know that songwriting is the lowest form of creative expression.

Anyone can do it.

 

[doubleU]

You want to deny the collaboration of the Edge? They worked together. Don't deny it considering the guitar is prevalent in that track. No, on the Picasso thing b/c Picasso is dead, so that wouldn't fit what is defined as a collaboration b/c you can't work together with a dead person, especially intellectually.

I'm not denying it, I'm just saying he was already limited, and I wouldn't call it a full collaboration.

I'm defining a true collaboration as having an intellectual effort throughout the process.

That's why calling the whole Pras thing a collaboration is shit to me. He took something they wrote almost 20 years ago. They had already done their part.

Just like I wouldn't call 'Slide Away' a Bono collaboration.

 

[martha]

Everyone unbunch your panties. You're arguing for nothing. If Bono says it, it might as well be U2.com saying it.

Now I'm hoping it does happen, just to watch the crapping out here. That will be fun.

 

[Flying FuManchu]

So using your definition of "collaboration" regarding the Edge and Wyclef,... One could look at a similar instance where Adam and Larry just add bass and drums to an already written guitar track with lyrics. One could say it's not a collaboration between Adam & Larry with Edge (Example being Sunday, Bloody Sunday) because a lot of times the guitar/ keyboard parts, written by the Edge, are the main parts of the song and pretty much mean the song is basically done (especially considering Edge writes some lyrics as well). I guess, then Larry and Adam were no collaborators.


As for the Pras example... 2 things I want to point out. One is that the song where Pras took the sample of ISHFWILF is a "possible" example of what a U2 collaboration with a hip hop artist/ producer could turn out to be. If you want to hear more of that, then go right ahead and demand it, except they'll probably have Bono being the singer rather than the female vocals singing the hook.

What I fear a U2/ hip hop producer collaboration will entail is they pick out some token Edge guitar that we've heard before. Bono gets to be the person who sings the hook, and Kanye or Jay Z get to rap over studio beats made by famed hip hop producer. Then U2 has a crossover hit and reaches millions of listeners and soon they become hip hop legends with kids from the inner city buying up U2 cds.


The other thing is that the Pras song contained pretty much the chorus and Edge guitar/ key riffs that were written by U2. U2 ok'ed the use of their song and probably heard the end result as well and probably gave their tacit approval of it.

Pras saying:

"I got Bono's cell number, and I called and asked him. He said, 'Really, my biggest record of all time?' I sent him the idea, he played it for the rest of the band, and they loved it. Bono called me back and said, 'Listen, I've never cleared a record for anyone, but I'm a fan of the Fugees and a fan of you. If this record can help you, go ahead and take it.'"

So they heard the final cut it seems, said yes to it, and loved it to boot. In my eyes its a collaboration. Its not any different when studio musicians do work over the phone and in separate studios alah Metallica and Ja Rule or Bono and Kirk Franklin. U2 wrote the key parts to the Pras song outside of his rap. He used it and they approved it. That song contains parts that they wrote. If they hadn't approved of its use AND listened to the final cut, then its just Pras ripping them off. But that wasn't the case.

 

[Flying FuManchu]

Everyone unbunch your panties. You're arguing for nothing. If Bono says it, it might as well be U2.com saying it.

Now I'm hoping it does happen, just to watch the crapping out here. That will be fun.

It will happen. Bono sang with the likes of Aaron Lewis of Staind, Christina, Justin, the Backstreet Boys, Nelly, etc... when Bono puts his mind towards trying to sing and collaborate with the best and brightest in the music industry, it tends to happen!

 

[doubleU]

So using your definition of "collaboration" regarding the Edge and Wyclef,... One could look at a similar instance where Adam and Larry just add bass and drums to an already written guitar track with lyrics. One could say it's not a collaboration between Adam & Larry with Edge (Example being Sunday, Bloody Sunday) because a lot of times the guitar/ keyboard parts, written by the Edge, are the main parts of the song and pretty much mean the song is basically done (especially considering Edge writes some lyrics as well). I guess, then Larry and Adam were no collaborators.

Uh, yeah you're not getting it. The whole SBS example; Edge wrote the guitar part, Larry then came in and added one of the most recognizable U2 drum beats, and Adam added his part. And I'm sure they had a say if they saw it going the wrong way or if they thought it needed something more. So yes it was a collaboration.

The Edge and Wyclef thing, Wyclef wrote the song already layed it down had the vocal melody mapped out and everything. Edge came in and just layed guitar down over that. He had no other say and was limited to that layout. If they had both sat in the studio and Wyclef said I have this idea where can you take it, or Edge said I have this riff can we do anything with this, then it would have been a collaboration.

But we're arguing bullshit semantics.

You have your fears and I'll keep an open mind about the thing.

 

[U2DMfan]

I could see a very interesting version of Fast Cars
A new single to go to a new demographic, released in the fall 2006 downtime.

Bono doing all his verses, Kanye rapping during the chorus in place of the lazy Fast Cars chorus

Edge playing along to a Kanye beat.

It could be good, something brand new on the spot might be sloppy like New Day or some shit.

 

[Earnie Shavers]

It will happen. Bono sang with the likes of Aaron Lewis of Staind, Christina, Justin, the Backstreet Boys, Nelly, etc... when Bono puts his mind towards trying to sing and collaborate with the best and brightest in the music industry, it tends to happen!

That's pretty much the most self contradictory post I've ever read in here.

 

[Earnie Shavers]

I'd like to know how pro-Kanye/ hip hop collaborators crowd think U2 and say Kanye would collaborate? Is U2 gonna get together in a studio and play a song and Kanye is gonna play with them alah Lanois? Don't think so.

Kanye is a producer first and foremost.

 

[Axver]

It will happen. Bono sang with the likes of Aaron Lewis of Staind, Christina, Justin, the Backstreet Boys, Nelly, etc...

When the hell did that happen?

 

[doubleU]

When the hell did that happen?

'What's Goin On' single.

 

[BigMacPhisto]

???

Come now, you know as well as I that Kanye's most recent effort was brimming with creative goodness, whereas U2's mostly sounded like the band on autopilot. Not that standard U2 isn't great (it beats out anything else in the mainstream, at least), but U2 hasn't exactly done anything extraordinarily "new" sounding since Zooropa. Passengers was just the same Brian Eno stuff we've heard for twenty years previously, only not nearly as relevant or exciting........Pop was a disaster although Discotheque was a nice experiment.........and then we have the last two albums, which although featuring incredible songs, don't have much in them musically that makes one go "wow!"......

 

[Catman]

Now I'm hoping it does happen, just to watch the crapping out here. That will be fun.

 

[ozeeko]

Kanye & U2

Whether this pans out or not, I am totally against this collaboration. I think U2 will lose any at all credibility they have left by doing this. It's almost like a last ditch effort: hmm, who's the hottest artist out right now? Kanye West? Yeah, I hear he's popular. Let's record with him. It will attract more young people! Come on, this has disaster written all over it. Just record a good album that you're more than capable of doing. For the love of God!!!

 

[Catman]

Nah, unlike you (I assume...), I think Kanye West is a good artist and U2 (or atleast Bono) believes so, as well. If they wanted to duet with the hottest artist around, they would've pulled an Aerosmith years ago (remember the Superbowl?)... yeah. It's not like they're making a single with Nelly or Mariah Carey or Ja Rule or Nickelback or Black Eyed Peas or Fall-Out Boy or whoever else is "hot" right now. I wouldn't even consider Kanye the biggest artist right, now anyway... someone more along the lines of Mariah or Green Day if you want to go by record sales.

The point is, I would be more than happy with U2 collaborating with Kanye. Hopefully it will spark some creativity within the band... because they way I see it, as long as U2 are content with being the biggest band on the planet, they might be unwilling to change at this stage in their career. Maybe a spunky collaborative effort is just what the band needs

 

[ozeeko]

Maybe their first single will be "George Bush Doesn't Care About Black People". I think Kanye is definitely the hottest artist of the past two years. All you hear about is how great he is (most of the acclaim comes from the man himself). And I fear that U2 WILL be pulling an Aerosmith for doing this. If they want to jam with someone, they should pick an interesting rock band. I doubt Bono drives around listening to Kanye. I doubt the same for Edge. This is just something for publicity, and to prove how hip U2 still is ....(if this rumor holds any truth to it at all, of course)

 

[Carek1230]

^I'm with you. I am not all that impressed with Kanye and don't understand U2's supposed fascination with his "music".