Important: Free, Fee, or Gone --- Feedback!

[Spiral_Staircase]

I'll try to be concise:

1. I voted for option 3.

2. I think it's very important to maintain at least some ability to read and post for free. One of the great things about this place is that new faces are showing up all the time. I know that I would never have paid to join if I couldn't get in and check the place out first.

3. From Elvis's comments, our problem seems to be bandwidth, not server storage space. Everyone please read Melon's explanation of bandwidth.

4. A premium membership of $24/year or $2/month would be an amazing bargain. I'll pay this whether you charge it or not. The search function alone is worth that much to me.

5. Elvis & Team Interference, you do good work.

6. My cat's breath smells like cat food.

 

[amybatt]

A few thoughts occurred to me about the ongoing discussion:

1) I'm systems conversant as well, so I know full well that no, the archives of all the PLEBA, FYM, "trim the fat" areas of the board don't take up bandwidth. What does take up bandwidth are the avatars, animated smilies, pics in sigs, etc. I'm on cable, and it takes years for some of this to load. But if I had a dial-up I'd be more irked at how long it takes to load some pages. The pics should be links, not set into the posts themselves (like they do on youtwo.net). That's a waste of bandwidth.

2) No, I don't come here to socialize and meet friends, although it seems a large portion of the group does. I come here on the outside chance there's some morsel of news that I haven't read somewhere else. So in that sense, yes, I can find what I'm looking for elsewhere.

3) Elvis wonders why some people are too cheap to pay, and feels that that these people are leeching off the system. The internet has been historically known for a free exchange of info. The sites that are pay sites are typically out to make a profit by and large, and typically provide a service or goods in return (porn, download files, etc). Let's say hypothetically (and generously) that 20% of the Interference members ante up the $10 a year. That's $20,000. Does it really cost that to maintain the boards for a year? Where's the excess going to go? Certainly not to the owner/mods, for that would go against the credo of profitting off U2. And if Elvis truly feels leeched off of, then it is definitely time to step down; it's no longer fun and enjoyable, and more of a task and a drain. Let's be serious, given that there are only $2000 in donations thusfar, 95%+ of this board were just called leeches.

Out of curiosity, I'd love to know how many other Interferencers pay to be a member of a message board (not a download site like for porn or mp3s or something, but strictly a discussion board).

4) Some folks are still saying $10 is not too much to ask. Do a search from a year and half ago, and look at the people who couldn't afford concert tickets at any cost. That is MUCH more significant an experience than belonging to a board...and now the cost is going to cut them out based on their financial situation? No one should be saying "there's no one that can't afford this." It's an individual's decision to decide what's worth it to them.

I think it's a mistake to go pay-for-play. I understand that the owners feel that there are no other alternatives, and this has clearly stopped being fun for them to deal with, which is why I still think it's best to just fade away.

 

[soman]

My Vote

Hello,

I just voted for the third option of both free and premium membership.

Let me explain why (my 2 cents):
I just started coming to this forum and kinda a newbie to the whole posting, trading and communicating process. (You may have even noticed that I posted instead of replying... Gawd, I hate being such a newbie at this!) It would have been pretty hard for me to commit to paying for this - I actually lurked around for quite a bit to try and figure everything out. I would not have even considered paying a premium for access, because I was not sure what was actually here...

When I finally decided to post I was immediately welcomed by numerous kind and generous people. I definitely received a sense of community and a meeting of like minded people... in terms of musical taste that is... I was amazed by people taking the time to share and advise. Maybe I'm a bit jaded and that happens when you work too long and too hard to try and make a buck and the news on TV is always bad. Thanks to those to have renewed my belief that music is an artform and it should be shared for all those who would listen. Plus, renewing a sense that a group of very different people can share a common interest and treat each other well.

Now, I wholeheartedly support paying a premium to help maintain and grow this forum... But I have two concerns, one is that it may take more money than can realistically raised - at a reasonable price for members who want to remain and the second is that a premium plan may scare some folks away to other forums and newsgroups... With the price of a retail cd being raised to about $20, maybe we might think about contributing more? Hard to swallow, but I value the ability to post and use this forum as a venue to communicate with others, more than the cost of one cd per year. The downside... the more you raise the premium, the more people will decide to leave. This would be a shame, because the people that have communicated with me are the true value of this forum, in my opinion.

I guess the key or answer may be convert more "lurkers" like I was and to help them realize the value of being a part of a group of people who enjoy U2. I just wish I had found this much sooner. Thanks to all! I would definitely skip a couple cds to keep this forum the same as it is today!

Jeff

 

[melon]

Melon: Even if those old backlogged threads don't take up much bandwidth surely they are clogging the servers big time. They have to be. How much of the money needed is going to keep literally hundreds of old unread threads stored on the server(s)? Especially a lot of the frivilous off-topic ones, and all those duplicate pics on PLEBA?

Server space is a static cost. I'm guessing Elvis invested in a decent server a while back, and that cost is no longer an issue at this point. Where the costs come in is the server transmitting server information; someone can own a server, but no individual owns the lines that connect the server to your computer. Hence, that is where the expense comes in, where Elvis must pay an ISP a subscription fee, based on the amount of bandwidth traffic. Now if lots of users suddenly started looking at these old threads, yes, this would constitute bandwidth. However, Elvis just stated that few people even look at these threads, meaning that this is irrelevant to the issue of bandwidth cost.

Now if Elvis was here stating that he needed a subscription to buy a new server, because this site had become too big, then, yes, deleting old threads would help. However, this appears to not be his problem, according to what he has stated in this thread.

Hope this makes some sense...

Melon

 

[Basstrap]

I have a question

I will vote option 3 I guess
even though I have no credit card..I'll find a way I guess

question:
does everyone from all countries pay 10 dollars or will that be converted to US money in which case I will have to pay almost twice as much, me being a canadian?

 

[hiphop]

No... what it shows is that when people have the OPTION to donate, but there isnt a requred fee, they will leech all they can until they can't any longer....

Exactly thats what I do. I?d rather donate my money, which I earn with hard work, to build a fountain for people who are dying of thurst, than to donate it to Interference, as valuable as it may be.

but if Elvis said i have to pay, well then i have to pay. Whereas 10 or 11 ? per year is just k by me, I would surely not pay the double.

 

[hiphop]

Server space is a static cost. I'm guessing Elvis invested in a decent server a while back, and that cost is no longer an issue at this point. Where the costs come in is the server transmitting server information; someone can own a server, but no individual owns the lines that connect the server to your computer. Hence, that is where the expense comes in, where Elvis must pay an ISP a subscription fee, based on the amount of bandwidth traffic. Now if lots of users suddenly started looking at these old threads, yes, this would constitute bandwidth. However, Elvis just stated that few people even look at these threads, meaning that this is irrelevant to the issue of bandwidth cost.

Now if Elvis was here stating that he needed a subscription to buy a new server, because this site had become too big, then, yes, deleting old threads would help. However, this appears to not be his problem, according to what he has stated in this thread.

Hope this makes some sense...

Melon

I am absolutely and totally against deleting any old messages. This forum is not a chatroom, and when I sit at my PC for hours to answer serious questions or to post sth. in FYM; I want that it stays on this forum forever. If my messages would be deleted after some time, I?d see no reason for writing them, thanks but no thanks, and then maybe even paying?

In my humble opinion (and don?t flame me) we could cut all the multimedia stuff. I mean, it was the big idea, right, sometime ago. But posting avatars and more avatars and changes of avatars and sigs with pics and sigs that take 300 times more space than a simple reply like "Yes" or "No", is totally unnecessary.

 

[melon]

1) I'm systems conversant as well, so I know full well that no, the archives of all the PLEBA, FYM, "trim the fat" areas of the board don't take up bandwidth. What does take up bandwidth are the avatars, animated smilies, pics in sigs, etc. I'm on cable, and it takes years for some of this to load. But if I had a dial-up I'd be more irked at how long it takes to load some pages. The pics should be links, not set into the posts themselves (like they do on youtwo.net). That's a waste of bandwidth.

I would agree with this statement in terms that it will save bandwidth. I would be curious to know how much bandwidth a month Interference.com generates, because I think this could help in generating ideas, such as, potentially, setting up the graphics in a separate, cheaper web space (?). Just some thoughts...

2) No, I don't come here to socialize and meet friends, although it seems a large portion of the group does. I come here on the outside chance there's some morsel of news that I haven't read somewhere else. So in that sense, yes, I can find what I'm looking for elsewhere.

3) Elvis wonders why some people are too cheap to pay, and feels that that these people are leeching off the system. The internet has been historically known for a free exchange of info. The sites that are pay sites are typically out to make a profit by and large, and typically provide a service or goods in return (porn, download files, etc). Let's say hypothetically (and generously) that 20% of the Interference members ante up the $10 a year. That's $20,000. Does it really cost that to maintain the boards for a year? Where's the excess going to go? Certainly not to the owner/mods, for that would go against the credo of profitting off U2. And if Elvis truly feels leeched off of, then it is definitely time to step down; it's no longer fun and enjoyable, and more of a task and a drain. Let's be serious, given that there are only $2000 in donations thusfar, 95%+ of this board were just called leeches.

I must admit that I found this board originally on the basis of an earlier genesis of Interference.com (anyone remember the old Etch-A-Sketch? ), and I do think that what is hurting is the fact that there hasn't been a main site for a long time now. Again, though, that comes back to the bandwidth issue. If Elvis *does* make $20,000+, then so be it! Considering the past expenses he's put into it, I think it is warranted, and this extra money could be used to expand the site.

Out of curiosity, I'd love to know how many other Interferencers pay to be a member of a message board (not a download site like for porn or mp3s or something, but strictly a discussion board).

Truthfully, I have visited some other message boards before, but then, due to a lack of emotional/social connection, I leave it. This is the only one I would ever consider paying for. This is ultimately why I chose #3, because I do think it is the right level to allow new people to be able to interact well in this site, and, if they get into it, perhaps they'll be more apt to want to subscribe. Your relationship with this board is certainly unique, and would not necessarily constitute a membership--and, subsequently, I doubt that you take up enough bandwidth to make a difference. Contrast that with much of the PLEBA crew...lol.

4) Some folks are still saying $10 is not too much to ask. Do a search from a year and half ago, and look at the people who couldn't afford concert tickets at any cost. That is MUCH more significant an experience than belonging to a board...and now the cost is going to cut them out based on their financial situation? No one should be saying "there's no one that can't afford this." It's an individual's decision to decide what's worth it to them.

I agree, and that is why I refused to say that. However, it appears that the main demographic here is 20-ish Americans with sufficient disposable income--or, at least, "sufficient" enough to spend $10 a year. And for those who are outside of this category who can't afford it--well, I understand. But, at least with #3, these individuals would still be able to post and interact. However, it is of my opinion that this is a minority.

Melon

 

[Lemon Meringue]

It would really be nice to see some more donations to come in NOW. Maybe we can get enough dough so we don't have to worry about it for another year or so. How about some Halloween treats for interference!

 

[LarryMullen's POPAngel]

Since this thread was posted, I've seen that tally on the upper right hand side increase. Granted, it's nowhere near as much as we need, but it's there. And I think that with the dire situation we're facing, hopefully more people will take into consideration what this place means to them. We still need exactly $2,909.50, we CAN do it!!! If I could rummage up a few bucks, being unemployed all of this year, then anyone can.


Look at all the friends many of us have made, the concert memories, all the romances that have sprung up as a result of the love so many people have for one little band. Never in my life have I seen so many people joined like this over one thing, but it happened here.


Just think of all this before you vote. I honestly don't think I'd go to Zootopia or any other U2 board if this place were to go, because the people are what made me want to stick around in the first place. Even if another site were free, it wouldn't matter. Interference is my home on the net. I love you guys, so let's save it.

 

[Sparkysgrrrl]

I just had a shit load of stuff typed out and the computer went belly up on me.

It is rather disheartening to hear so many ppl assume that $10 is not a lot of money. I would say that it expresses that many here do not have a lot of life experience with those in other economic standing but then I'd catch hell for dissing ppl on here. $10 IS a lot to some, me included...I have not paid for a movie in over a year, I have not bought a cup of coffee in about 6 months, I own 3 pair of pants, 4 shirts, a sweater, a cap and warm coat, I live in a residetial hotel where I don't have a shower or toilet, I have a bagel in the fridge to last me another week, and I'm saving my money for a pack of new socks thank you very much. I come to the local colleges computer lab and use their facilities for free when I need a break from my everyday life. I'm sure I'm not the only one who is in bad shape as far as money goes, but nobody else will say it, so I will. $10 is a lot of money.

Elvis has stated that server costs is a problem, so getting rid of a lot of the excess here would help.

Closing down FYM is ridiculous since U2 has a history of dealing with spiritual, social, and political ideas and it is important for the fans to have a place to disscuss those things. It is no less important than disscusing the finer points of Larry's ass in PLEBA.

And if Elvis truly feels leeched off of, then it is definitely time to step down; it's no longer fun and enjoyable, and more of a task and a drain.

I agree with what amybatt has to say.
If this truely is "the biggest U2 fan community on the web" (btw WHO GIVES A FLYING FUCK IF IT IS OR ISN'T???? Is that actually important ?) and If the numbers are true and there are over 11,000 members here, and let's say only half of those cough up the 10 bux, that's still a hell of a lot of money. Where is the excess money going to go?

And I have to ask...
Why is it so important that Elvis and the mods here are running the show? If it's this much of a problem, then why not just say "Ok, we understand, if it's coming down to monetarily putting you in a bad position, we don't blame you for stepping down." There are other places on the web to start msg. boards, it's not like this is the ONLY place we can come. If everyone just clicked on a different link we'd all end up in the same place, and it would be the same community, the same disscussions, etc. Nobody would die, nobody would lose their friends, no harm, no foul.

 

[sharky]

It would really be nice to see some more donations to come in NOW. Maybe we can get enough dough so we don't have to worry about it for another year or so. How about some Halloween treats for interference!

Lemon -- Not to be mean but where are you storing that avatar? I just downloaded four images from the server just for your avatar. That's four times more than the size of most avatars that are only one pictures. And if it was on the Interference server, it just cost more money and bandwidth. Its a cool avatar but when we're desperate for bandwidth, maybe it should be cut to one photo.

Elvis -- I know you invested alot of time into the redesign of this site but what if you turned off signatures for a week? no one could load a signature, no one would have a signature.

And for those of you that want to help out with cutting bandwidth, turn your view signatures option and view avatars option off and we can see if that helps.

 

[Sicy]

I agree with what amybatt has to say.
If this truely is "the biggest U2 fan community on the web" (btw WHO GIVES A FLYING FUCK IF IT IS OR ISN'T???? Is that actually important ?) and If the numbers are true and there are over 11,000 members here, and let's say only half of those cough up the 10 bux, that's still a hell of a lot of money. Where is the excess money going to go?

I give a flying fuck and so do a couple hundred others.

I dont think half of 11,000 members will be paying $10. If you look through the member list.. over half of that number of people have never even posted. I dont think there's going to be all this 'excess money'. And if there is so what?? Elvis has paid for the site for like 6 years by himself. Sorry you cant afford a cup of coffee but really, what are you bitching about? You would still be able to post and read for free if you dont want to pay. I dont get you people. I think Elvis should just do what he needs to, its his site and if you like it stay, if you dont leave. It's that simple. He's nice enough to ask for our opinions. Too nice if you ask me.

And I have to ask...
Why is it so important that Elvis and the mods here are running the show? If it's this much of a problem, then why not just say "Ok, we understand, if it's coming down to monetarily putting you in a bad position, we don't blame you for stepping down." There are other places on the web to start msg. boards, it's not like this is the ONLY place we can come. If everyone just clicked on a different link we'd all end up in the same place, and it would be the same community, the same disscussions, etc. Nobody would die, nobody would lose their friends, no harm, no foul.

So go ahead and go to other U2 boards. See how lame they are compared to this one. I've met some of my best friends because of this site. This is like a home to me, with family. I'm not the only one that feels this way.

 

[Angel]

$10 a year actually means more like $16 for me (stupid Cad) but WELL worth it. Even if I stopped coming in here half as much.

Good friends, good conversation, good U2 news. I would hate to see this place go. The premium membership seems like the way to go. You can satisfy your lurkers and your hardcore members all at the same time.

 

[Sparkysgrrrl]

And once again, what I post in mis-understood...

I'm saying I have a probelm with ppl on here excusing money like it grows on trees, when it doesn't. Just like Elvis has put in a lot of money over the years, he didn't just pull it out of the air, ppl can't pull money out of the air to pay their usage of a msg. board on the internet either.

Is it the pretty blue background that makes this place home?
Or is it the ppl.
I'm pretty sure it's the ppl. What I'm saying is, if this place was shut down and another msg baord was set up, it's very easy to just go to a new one, if everyone was informed of the location. No bodies going to lose their life if it's not on vBulletin with little avatars and smilies.

And I'm serious, why does it matter if this has some title of "biggest board blah blah" Does it look good on resumes? Is it a power trip? If it's really the ppl on here that make this place such an important place then who cares if ppl think it's the biggest best or smallest?

I don't get you ppl...thank you for the kind remark.
Elvis asked for feedback so why are the ppl giving "unpopular" feedback being shit on for it?

And please don't be sorry for not affording a cup of coffee, I have a roof over my head and my head on my shoulders that's more than a lot of ppl have.

 

[Screaming Flower]

sparkysgrrrl if you don't have the money DON'T DONATE. it's rather simple. no one is demanding that you do. but plenty of people here do have the money and can afford it. you've made your point but from the looks of the poll most people here disagree with you and believe that going to some other message board WOULD NOT BE THE SAME. a lot of people here have been coming here for a long time and have made friendships that are very important to them.

 

[hiphop]

Hey, Sparkysgrrrl, I understand your point of view. And ? am sure we all would love to keep you here, because imo youre already part of a community.

People: if we speak of being a COMMUNITY, shouldn?t ten of us step up and pay 10% of sparkys special membership? i?d do that. So that makes 11 ? plus 1.1 ? for sparky is 12.1 ?. Or ten $ plus 1 makes 11 $. Or how far does your thought of a community go?

Be sure I won?t pay a cent more. Especially no banking or transferring fees or shit like dat.

No quarrelling on this thread please.

 

[Sparkysgrrrl]

I think ppl would be more willing to pay %10 for me to shut the fuck up lol
I belive that's the 4th time I've been told to go elsewhere since posting to this friendly little community.

(and again, I was speaking about the general idea that $10 isn't a lot of money. Not just about $10 being spent on a msg. baord.)

 

[hiphop]

mah, you are so proud sparkysgrrrrrl

its not about the money. money is totally unimportant. BUT i think if theres no other possibility i would pay and stay on this board. you know why? because here the spirit was created that made us to a community. and i am very very loyal with spirit. and i believe another board just wouldn?t be the same feeling.

and actually i believe this would be a totally natural thing for a community to step up and pay your part for a weaker member. i mean, we had people saying here they wouldn?t mind if it was 20, 25 $ per year. but then you can?t pay 11$? regardless for whose fuckin membership they are? gimme a break.


edit: i am just realizing this is a great social experiment. some societies/ communities would keep a "weak" member and help him. some societies/ communities wouldn?t, because "the fittest survive".

 

[U2SavesTheWorld]

And once again, what I post in mis-understood...

I'm saying I have a probelm with ppl on here excusing money like it grows on trees, when it doesn't. Just like Elvis has put in a lot of money over the years, he didn't just pull it out of the air, ppl can't pull money out of the air to pay their usage of a msg. board on the internet either.

And please don't be sorry for not affording a cup of coffee, I have a roof over my head and my head on my shoulders that's more than a lot of ppl have.

I CAN'T TAKE IT ANYMORE!!!!!!!!!!

I HEREBY SWEAR THAT I WILL PAY FOR YOUR ENTIRE MEMBERSHIP.

Problem solved.

 

[U2SavesTheWorld]

Oh, I also wanted to say to Sparkysgrrl that at no point has anyone said that you should be forced to pay.

Anytime someone (myself included) has said that they would gladly pay for the use of Interfernce they have prefaced it with statement sounding something like, "Not everyone will be able to afford it". No one is assuming that the entire group can afford it.

Elvis is going out of his way to make this place accesible IN SOME WAY to EVERYONE!

Why are we making this so difficult for him????

 

[Sicy]

Yknow what.. no, dont pay for her membership. She called Elvis a nazi in one of her first posts. She should have been banned for that.

 

[Sparkysgrrrl]

there is a difference between "msg. bard nazi" and "racist killing machine nazi" and I'm a tad offended that ppl don't see the difference.

but that's a whole other topic, and if ppl have problems with me personally, then leave it out of this thread.

 

[U2SavesTheWorld]

She called Elvis a nazi in one of her first posts.

 

[HelloAngel]

there is a difference between "msg. bard nazi" and "racist killing machine nazi" and I'm a tad offended that ppl don't see the difference.

but that's a whole other topic, and if ppl have problems with me personally, then leave it out of this thread.

And that word has been offensive to millions upon millions of people for decades in any way of usage. So yes, we're offended that you even use such a terrible word when describing someone you do not even know.

 

[Sparkysgrrrl]

You also don't know me and my connections with that word, so don't get on any high horse anyone, please.

And again, IF ANY ONE HAS PERSONAL BEEF WITH ME LEAVE IT OUT OF THIS THREAD, I HAVE A PM BOX, FEEL FREE TO USE IT!

 

[Sicy]

You stated it publicly why shouldnt we discuss it publicy?

And there is no difference when using the word nazi here. Especially to describe the owner of the board. I'm bringing this up because I dont feel you deserve a free ride here.

 

[Sparkysgrrrl]

Alrighty, you're the mod, if you feel this is a good place to disscuss it then we can, I just think it's getting away from the subject of the thread.

(love how my questions are being ignored btw)

I'm not asking for a free ride, ppl seem to not be understanding what I'm saying at all.
I'm trying to point out to ppl to get it out of their heads that $10 is not a lot of money, and like I've already stated before, I don't mean it in regards to this board, I mean it in regards to anything. It's not a good assumption to make, that money is so easily thrown around. And I also am including the fact that Elvis has had to cough up a lot of dough for this place, he didn't just pull that money out of his ass so why do ppl have it in their heads that one can just get money out of nowhere...

god I hate repeating myself!

 

[U2SavesTheWorld]

I'm trying to point out to ppl to get it out of their heads that $10 is not a lot of money, and like I've already stated before, I don't mean it in regards to this board, I mean it in regards to anything. It's not a good assumption to make, that money is so easily thrown around. And I also am including the fact that Elvis has had to cough up a lot of dough for this place, he didn't just pull that money out of his ass so why do ppl have it in their heads that one can just get money out of nowhere...

god I hate repeating myself!

OK, fine. I will be the asshole to say what I think here and then get flamed for it.
I don't think $10 is a lot of money.

There. I said it. Here, I will go a step further and say that I generally lose $10 within the first hour at a bar.

I don't care if you think I'm an idiot or I don't understand the plights of the world or whatever you want to think.

And I DEFINITELY don't think $10 is a lot of money for Interference.

 

[Spiral_Staircase]

Is it the pretty blue background that makes this place home?
Or is it the ppl.
I'm pretty sure it's the ppl. What I'm saying is, if this place was shut down and another msg baord was set up, it's very easy to just go to a new one, if everyone was informed of the location. No bodies going to lose their life if it's not on vBulletin with little avatars and smilies.

Yeah, I thought about that too. But the question remains: Who's gonna pay for the bandwidth for the new msg board we all migrate to? I don't think it would really solve the problem. If we're going to have this place, or any other place to meet up, someone is going to have to pay for it. Yes, Zootopia is one option, as someone with deep pockets is paying for that one already. But it's my understanding that there is less freedom there (I don't know, I've only visited once). And that doesn't appeal much to me.