How much power do producers have?

[Miggy D]

I'm not super knowledgeable on music-making, so maybe some people can help me out with this:

Just exactly how much of the music is made by a band and how much is made/influenced by the producers?

For instance: would Achtung, Baby be Achtung, Baby without Eno?

Would POP be POP without Flood?

And what about Steve Lillywhite or Daniel Lanois? How big of a role do these guys have in terms of shaping the sound of an album? I remember for instance, Brian Eno being referenced as 'the fifth member of U2' (and here I thought it was McGuinness). How much say...how much power does he have in the studio?

And this new album, last time I checked the records, has 1.5 million producers, give or take. How much of HTDAAB is U2, and how much of it is based on the input of these guys? U2 gets credited with constantly changing its sound, and I'm definitely sure the decision to change their sound is their own, but how much of the actual transformation is because of the producer involved? I mean you can't help but wonder, after taking a listen through 'Passengers' just how much power Eno must have had in the recording of some of their 90s material.

Thoughts?

-Mike

 

[Bunbury]

A producer has a good degree of control, from all my years of listening to music, you can tell the difference from good and bad producing.

BTW, I think Flood was an engineer in most of U2's work.

 

[indra]

I think it depends on the band and the producer. Some have a huge amount of control and influence, others not so much. I remember hearing an album (don't remember who it was by -- I didn't care for it all that much) which all songs but one were produced by one person. The one song produced by someone else sounded so completely different that it almost seemed like a different band (unfortunately, a much better band than the rest of the album showed...).

 

[SmileyGladhands]

It's all relative. Too many variables involved to be able to form a "real" statistic, but, sure the producers have a large input into the sound, but in the ideal situation it always boils down to an idea that "everyone" can agree on. It's actually quite organic.

BTW - I think Nellee Hooper was a big influence in POP, but I could be wrong...my brain ain't working right now.

 

[Earnie Shavers]

It depends on the artist.

Put it this way, if ABC Records signs a new pop artist and somehow gets Pharrell Williams to produce their song, if Pharrell says "It should be done this way" and the artist says "I don't think so" the record company will say "Shut the fuck up and do it Pharrells way or else." However, for a band like U2, if a producer says "I think it should be done this way" and Bono says "No it should be done this way" then it gets done Bono's way.

It's all about control, and a band with a lot of control wouldn't pick a producer that they didn't respect and trust and they'd pick them because they felt that what they'd bring adds to the direction that they want to go anyway. You'd find in most cases it's a team thing, and the producer essentially becomes another member of the band. I mean, a dispute between Bono and the producer would be not too different to a dispute between Bono and the Edge in the way it's handled and resolved etc.

 

[U2girl]

I've always wondered this too.

I remember an interview in 2000 when Edge was asked what the difference was between working with Lanois and Eno and he said "Brian is more into exploring new sounds" and "Danny is more interested in the organic side, playing of the group".
(if you look at the album credits you'll notice Eno is often playing synthesizers/programming and Lanois is usually playing guitar, which confirms this observation)

IMO Joshua Tree and ATYCLB are more "Lanois" albums where UF and AB are more "Eno" albums. Also, Zooropa and Passengers are Eno influenced.

That said, what influences U2's music most is the band itself - it was the band's idea to work with Eno/Lanois on UF, it was their idea to explore American music on JT and it was their idea to reinvent their sound on AB.

It isn't like much of today's music industry where producers are kings.

 

[HelloAngel]

I'm going to move this to EYKIW because it's a really good topic, and I don't want it getting lost in a bunch o' "Vertigo"