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Old 04-04-2006, 03:35 PM   #31
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In order to have a "raw"sound,you need raw emotions.They had that in their younger days and it reflected in the music.
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Old 04-04-2006, 03:48 PM   #32
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Originally posted by u2fan628
In order to have a "raw"sound,you need raw emotions.They had that in their younger days and it reflected in the music.


That makes about as much sense as...

oh forget it.
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Old 04-04-2006, 04:23 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally posted by gherman


I think some people here should think about this statement a little more.

gherman, didn't get the meaning , what should we think about?

Also, I didn't expect my choice of virtuosos would be unpopular, ok, I'll give you hammett, but mustaine is pretty damn good, isn't he. I suspect Joe Satriani won't ruffle any feathers, if not, I'm out.
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Old 04-04-2006, 05:07 PM   #34
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Originally posted by u2fan628
In order to have a "raw"sound,you need raw emotions.They had that in their younger days and it reflected in the music.
Actually Supastar, this is a great point.

If 'raw' can be made to equate to 'untamed' it really makes sense. Back then, U2 were much less refined regarding their emotional presentations. This is because those wild displays are what set them apart, in lieu of their skill limitations.

Nowadays, the emotional presenation of their songs are more refined because they finally have the ability to mold their songs into whatever they want them to become. They are no longer at the mercy of just wild displays of emotion and the sometimes accompanying 'messiness' that comes with them.

It's debateable which method has yielded better results, but I don't think there's any doubt that U2 have found something within themselves over the last 2 albums that they've really enjoyed discovering and that enjoyment has been palpable. Particularly on ATYCLB. I don't see how anybody could expect an artist to be any truer to themselves than that. Particularly an artist 25 years into their career.
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Old 04-04-2006, 05:40 PM   #35
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Originally posted by Layton


Actually Supastar, this is a great point.

If 'raw' can be made to equate to 'untamed' it really makes sense. Back then, U2 were much less refined regarding their emotional presentations. This is because those wild displays are what set them apart, in lieu of their skill limitations.

I don't buy it for many reasons. First of all if it's real emotion it's "raw" or whatever you want to call it. Also history has proven that many bands have had raw sounds without any true emotion at all. Plus I can list many U2 songs and others till I turn blue that have raw emotion but not a raw sound.
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Old 04-04-2006, 08:23 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally posted by Layton


Actually Supastar, this is a great point.

If 'raw' can be made to equate to 'untamed' it really makes sense. Back then, U2 were much less refined regarding their emotional presentations. This is because those wild displays are what set them apart, in lieu of their skill limitations.

Nowadays, the emotional presenation of their songs are more refined because they finally have the ability to mold their songs into whatever they want them to become. They are no longer at the mercy of just wild displays of emotion and the sometimes accompanying 'messiness' that comes with them.

It's debateable which method has yielded better results, but I don't think there's any doubt that U2 have found something within themselves over the last 2 albums that they've really enjoyed discovering and that enjoyment has been palpable. Particularly on ATYCLB. I don't see how anybody could expect an artist to be any truer to themselves than that. Particularly an artist 25 years into their career.
Exactly. When U2 weren't an expert group of musicians, they had to rely on something else to write great songs. It is this "something else" that created the magic that produced some of the best songs ever written - by anyone. Songs like 'Pride', songs like 'Bad', songs like 'Where The Streets Have No Name' and 'With or Without You' and 'One'. Does anyone think they sat down and plotted out chord progressions for these songs? Or was it that they simply had the floodgates open because they had to let "God walk into the room" in order to write something ethereal? They were relying on trancendence, not chord progressions.

Now that U2 rely on musicianship, they no longer need to rely on that "something else". It's the tradeoff that they have worked hard for, yet the irony is that the real magic occured when they had far more limitations as musicians. Now, the songs aren't usually ethereal. They are very good. Now, they sound professional. 'City of Blinding Lights' is a good example. A quintesential U2 song without the transcendence of that "something else". But there are moments. The end of 'Miracle Drug', most of 'Kite', for example. But most of it is lost in the pre-writing and plotting of chord progressons.

But U2 is enjoying themselves right now.
We must give them that. They had to grow up one day. It was inevitable, and now they're discovering what they always wanted to be. They know what they are doing now....so it shouldn't be as surprising.
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Old 04-04-2006, 09:02 PM   #37
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Originally posted by Michael Griffiths


Exactly. When U2 weren't an expert group of musicians, they had to rely on something else to write great songs. It is this "something else" that created the magic that produced some of the best songs ever written - by anyone. Songs like 'Pride', songs like 'Bad', songs like 'Where The Streets Have No Name' and 'With or Without You' and 'One'. Does anyone think they sat down and plotted out chord progressions for these songs? Or was it that they simply had the floodgates open because they had to let "God walk into the room" in order to write something ethereal? They were relying on trancendence, not chord progressions.

Now that U2 rely on musicianship, they no longer need to rely on that "something else".

Sorry but I find this hilarious, especially based on the amount of "I wish U2 would rely on more musicianship" threads.
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Old 04-04-2006, 09:15 PM   #38
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Originally posted by Michael Griffiths
Exactly. When U2 weren't an expert group of musicians, they had to rely on something else to write great songs. It is this "something else" that created the magic that produced some of the best songs ever written - by anyone... Now that U2 rely on musicianship, they no longer need to rely on that "something else". It's the tradeoff that they have worked hard for, yet the irony is that the real magic occured when they had far more limitations as musicians.
I agree with most of your post; however, I would add that the change in U2's sound is also a reflection of certain internal impulses--perhaps more so than technical know how. Angst, ambition--these sorts of things. I don't think bands are consciously relying on that "something else"-- rather there's a restlessness that comes through in the music.

U2 has more experience as musicians now, but how much time actually goes into their song-writing and plotting of chord progressions even today?--I was under the impression that U2's creative process was more spontaneous and all over the place. Anyway, I think it has less to do with their maturation as musicians than your post suggested. I think that the difference is that U2 now knows where they are going--or rather that they've arrived-- not what they are doing. I still don't think they know what they're doing but they do it well so hey
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Old 04-04-2006, 10:38 PM   #39
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I don't think they've ever been "raw". I think this is what they might sound like if they went for that though, hope the link works.


http://s59. .com/d.aspx?id=1OD1EJNDBB2PP1H27NH7ABGCPL
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Old 04-04-2006, 10:46 PM   #40
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link no workie for me...
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Old 04-04-2006, 11:01 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar
link no workie for me...
I know, I couldn't get it to work after I posted and tried re-posting a couple of times

Anyway, if your interested, here's where I got it. This particular artist will let you download his entire catalog for free, that's right free and even someone like me who can't post a freekin link to a downloaded song was able to download and burn cd's from this site

The track I tried to post is called "Ashtray" from Spacegirl & Other favorites.

http://www.brianjonestownmassacre.com/mp3.html
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Old 04-05-2006, 06:13 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar



Sorry but I find this hilarious, especially based on the amount of "I wish U2 would rely on more musicianship" threads.
Why apologize? If you find it hilarious, you find it hilarious. All I can say is, I'm happy I brightened your day

Secondly, I am not too sure about these threads asking for more musicianship. I don't frequent this board as often as I used to.
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Old 04-05-2006, 06:34 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally posted by Achtung_Bebe


I agree with most of your post; however, I would add that the change in U2's sound is also a reflection of certain internal impulses--perhaps more so than technical know how. Angst, ambition--these sorts of things. I don't think bands are consciously relying on that "something else"-- rather there's a restlessness that comes through in the music.

U2 has more experience as musicians now, but how much time actually goes into their song-writing and plotting of chord progressions even today?--I was under the impression that U2's creative process was more spontaneous and all over the place. Anyway, I think it has less to do with their maturation as musicians than your post suggested. I think that the difference is that U2 now knows where they are going--or rather that they've arrived-- not what they are doing. I still don't think they know what they're doing but they do it well so hey
Oh, I agree with you that U2's internal impulses have definitely changed. And I don't think U2 ever consciously relied on that "something else" either. They simply were open to it out of necessity, and therefore allowed it in automatically.

As for how much time goes into pre-writing and plotting out chord progressions these days, U2 were the ones who stated that they do that for most of their music these days. There was a big article (was it in Rollingstone?) before the release of Atomic Bomb where the band were interviewed on their songwriting process, in which they said they don't have the time to jam out tunes as often, nor the energy, to wait until a chaos forms into a a perfect crystalization - which is what they used to have to do when they were less experienced - and so much of the writing is now done outside of the recording. In fact, Bono went so far as to say that ATYCLB was the first U2 album where they wrote all the music and words for the songs before recording them....instead of relying on the ebb and flow to enter into the recording process.

But I agree with you that U2 now know where they are going, or even how to get to where they want to end up. As Bono put it, never has the sound in their heads been closer to what comes out of the amplifier than it is now. This shows they are more precise musicians now, better technical players and songwriters. Now, they understand how the music works. But the real magic always happens outside of the technicalities, beyond the understanding. There are times when they can still get lost in it. Songs like 'Stateless', for example. Evocative. Ethereal, out of reach. Sublime. Pop melodies can come this way, too. So it isn't limited to the uncommercial. Take 'Mysterious Ways' or 'Pride'. It's simply the way it arrives.
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Old 04-06-2006, 12:01 AM   #44
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The most "raw"song that I've seen them play was EXIT. That song had so much emotion.They put everything they had into it!

Go easy it's my 2nd post!
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Old 04-06-2006, 01:06 AM   #45
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Quote:
Originally posted by u2fan628
Go easy it's my 2nd post!
no need to walk on eggshells--nobody will refute your opinion solely based on your newbie status (I don't think so anyway)

Quote:
Originally posted by Michael Griffiths
There was a big article (was it in Rollingstone?) before the release of Atomic Bomb where the band were interviewed on their songwriting process, in which they said they don't have the time to jam out tunes as often, nor the energy, to wait until a chaos forms into a a perfect crystalization - which is what they used to have to do when they were less experienced - and so much of the writing is now done outside of the recording.
interesting-- I guess I missed/have forgotten that write up. I am now tempted to ship them each a lifetime supply of vitamins, for increased energy.
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