Debate: Is it (HTDAAB) the third masterpiece?

[Sleep Over Jack]

A "masterpiece" certainly DOES NOT have to be "ground-breaking" ( a useless term anyway since all music is influenced by other music in some way) to be a classic album...look at The Stone Roses, Automatic For The People, Definitely Maybe, (Whats The Story)Morning Glory etc...nothing remotely new about those abums, yet they are definitely popularly perceived as classic albums. Even the mighty Beatles weren't doing anything particularly new with Abbey Road.

 

[teebee]

No, but ALL of the ones you mention share a stronger cohesion throughout all the tracks than this one does.

That's the difference. I am saying that in order to be a great album, you must have a singular theme throughout in order to qualify. I cannot think of ONE album I'd consider great not to have a running cohesion from first track to last. It's why James' Laid is a better album than Whiplash, to get a little random on you.

U2 has become a singles band, albeit a great one. The last three albums are singles albums with a dash of filler thrown in on Pop and ATYCLB. Achtung Baby had a unifying sound and theme from the first note to the last. So does OK Computer, Exile on Main Street, Sgt. Pepper's, Stone Roses, Interpol's first one, and on and on and on.

It's a byproduct of the iPod age. I'm not thrilled about it. There's not much incentive to make an album with a unifying theme, since most people will listen to tracks out of order and one at a time anyway.

 

[doctorwho]

No, but ALL of the ones you mention share a stronger cohesion throughout all the tracks than this one does.

You and I are polar opposites.

One of the biggest weaknesses I find on HTDAAB is the fact that it is SO cohesive! It reminds me of JT in that, barring a few exceptions, the songs blend together. It's too early to say what "image" is created by this album - and I also think it's too subjective. For example, I do NOT think of the desert when I hear JT - rather, I think of personal events in my life at the time. Same with AB.

I fully agree with Bono. I don't think we'll be able to judge if HTDAAB is truly a masterpiece until we had it for at least a few years if not longer. Does it stand the test of time? To my ears, "Pop" does not. ATYCLB has a chance. JT, even though it's not my favorite U2 album, is a masterpiece in most fans' minds. AB is definitely a masterpiece.

 

[Sleep Over Jack]

No, but ALL of the ones you mention share a stronger cohesion throughout all the tracks than this one does.

That's the difference. I am saying that in order to be a great album, you must have a singular theme throughout in order to qualify. I cannot think of ONE album I'd consider great not to have a running cohesion from first track to last. It's why James' Laid is a better album than Whiplash, to get a little random on you.

U2 has become a singles band, albeit a great one. The last three albums are singles albums with a dash of filler thrown in on Pop and ATYCLB. Achtung Baby had a unifying sound and theme from the first note to the last. So does OK Computer, Exile on Main Street, Sgt. Pepper's, Stone Roses, Interpol's first one, and on and on and on.

It's a byproduct of the iPod age. I'm not thrilled about it. There's not much incentive to make an album with a unifying theme, since most people will listen to tracks out of order and one at a time anyway.

Well I'd disagree that Morning Glory has a unifying theme, its just great pop-rock..the only unifying theme is in the production style, theres no great story being told there...to add, another classic is Neil Young's "After The Goldrush" a pure songwriter's album, quite conservative musically, and the songs don't necessarily inter-connect to form a lyrical theme either.

 

[teebee]

You and I are polar opposites.

I will admit that the cohesion probably isn't as obvious as it might be after a couple years.

But ...

vertigo --> miracle drug
love and peace --> city of blinding lights
COBL --> all because of you
ABOY --> man and a woman

you call that cohesion?

the second half of the album is pretty cohesive. that's probably why i like it better than the first half. the first half is six (potential) singles slapped together in a running order that is pretty arbitrary, i think.

 

[Sleep Over Jack]

I suppose it all comes down to whether you like cohesive albums or more individually strong songs that are less connected to each other.

 

[teebee]

fair enough. there's plenty of both to go around, even in U2's catalogue.

 

[Sleep Over Jack]

That is true. Having said that, I love AB (my favourite U2 album) and its very cohesive yet has a ton of individualy great tunes you can listen to outside of the album's context..I always thought it odd that ATYCLB was called an album of singles when the second half of the album is so weak.

 

[Layton]

It's a byproduct of the iPod age. I'm not thrilled about it. There's not much incentive to make an album with a unifying theme, since most people will listen to tracks out of order and one at a time anyway.

Personally, I don't know if it's a masterpiece or not yet. Oddly enough though, the above comment might end up being the strongest case for it being a masterpiece. We really are in the IPod age and masterpieces are usually defined by the supremacy of their art as it relates to its' age or era. HTDAAB could very well end up being one of the best of its' age, just as AB and JT are.

 

[teebee]

(offtopic) ... Midnight Oil's Diesel and Dust:

great songs, unifying theme, cohesive sound.

That is a masterpiece.

 

[Axver]

In judging whether this album is a masterpiece and a U2 classic, my tactic was to place it up against the past standard, and I'm using the two albums I consider to be masterpieces (UF, JT) along with the other album regarded by most as a masterpiece, AB.

So what makes them masterpieces?

UF - the flow and the atmosphere. It is a deep album in which you can become totally absorbed, and while some songs may be weak individually, they all come together to paint the most vivid landscapes ever painted by any U2 album. 4th Of July isn't even really a song by itself, but it cohesively pulls Promenade and Bad together in a way that is simply magic and enhances the atmosphere. UF is a real journey.

JT - I actually don't see much of a cohesive theme in this album, but rather a record full of strong songs. Every song is brilliant apart from Trip Through Your Wires, which actually does make sense within the context of its placement on the album after In God's Country.

AB - Yeah, it was a total reinvention of U2, but I find that it's not as great as some people like to think it is. This isn't my thread for bashing AB, though. A lot of you find a cohesive theme linking the whole album together (I don't see it), so I've run with that in my analysis.

In my opinion, Hut Dab has taken all the elements that make the aforementioned albums classic. It flows absolutely brilliantly, especially in the second half. CFYT --> OSC --> OOTS is magic on the scale of UF. Every single song is strong, just like JT - there isn't a bad or weak song on the record, they are all deep and have serious meaning, and they make a point. This is by no means a shallow record without direction; it is quite the opposite. And it seems to have a cohesive theme running through it - note the continual repetition of the theme of kneeling, and I think its best attribute is that it really does dismantle the atomic bomb. You go from a state of confusion and uncertainty (Vertigo) through to a sense of release (Yahweh). It's perfect. It dismantles the atomic bomb and leaves you as a better person. You need to sit back, lose yourself in it, and come to appreciate its intricacies.

If HTDAAB is not a masterpiece, I do not know what is.

 

[bonzo]

I concur on Pop getting only 4 stars with Rolling Stone. I think Howard Stern is on the cover. But the review RS wrote makes it seem as though they should have given it 5 stars.

 

[AEON]

AB - 4 1/2
Zooropa - 4
POP - 4
ATYCLB - 4
HTDAAB - 4

 

[U2DMfan]

AB - Yeah, it was a total reinvention of U2, but I find that it's not as great as some people like to think it is.

If HTDAAB is not a masterpiece, I do not know what is.

Apparently you don't know what is.