Joshua_Tree_Hugger
Refugee
I just thought what this guy said was so true I copied it over to here...
I?ve noticed a few people on here say in the last few weeks that Mick has done a good job with Ireland and why are us Irish complaining about him, well jammer gave his list so now here?s my reasons.
Previous Campaigns
Before this World Cup campaign McCarthy spectacularly failed in getting us to World Cup 98 and Euro 2000. I can accept the WC 98 qualifying not being crash hot despite facing no good teams in the campaign as it was his first effort as manager.
The same can?t be said for Euro 2000, which was a joke and should have resulted in him losing his job. First there was the great game with Macedonia at home. Play a counter attack all night long against the mighty Macedonians. Nick a goal when a Quinn header gets deflected in then pull eleven men behind the ball in case their superb attack that consisted of that Macedonian guy who had a season at Barnsley destroy us.
Then there was Yugoslavia away. Eleven men behind the ball all game long, even when we were losing. We had one attack in that whole game which resulted in us having a clearcut peno turned down, we could have at least drawn that game.
There was the great trip to Croatia. More of the same, eleven men behind the ball, if by chance Kenny Cunningham gets the ball he was to hump it to Quinny who was to hold it up for as many seconds as he could to delay the next attack. Unsurprisingly we conceded late on
And of course the magnificent Macedonia game. Somehow we went into that game needing a win to qualify. We attacked early on and scored inside ten minutes. Fantastic, score a couple more then knock the ball around in party fashion. Nope. Take off attackers with defenders. Stop attacking. Everyone behind the ball and pray that the side that was beaten 7-0 by Yugoslavia days before don?t tear us apart. Amazingly they score a last minute goal and we don?t qualify
How he wasn?t sacked I don?t know.
Celebrating Defeat
A 2-2 draw with the Netherlands in Amsterdam is a good result. If you are two nil up with minutes to go and you draw 2-2 it is a huge failure. We were beating the side that was probably second best to France months before in Euro 2000 (yes I know Italy came second). We attack them and play brilliantly for an hour and are deservedly two goals up. Then the oul pull everyone behind the ball trick that always pays off so richly for Ireland. Two late goals for the Netherlands and we threw the three points away. I was at that game and the mood in the stands at the final whistle was not good, we?d been robbed of two points. Imagine everyones disbelief when McCarthy runs on to the pitch celebrating like we?d won the World Cup. He congratulates the players on a magnificent result (it was a magnificent performance for 70 minutes, but a poor result.) As McCarthy was running around the Amsterdam Arena celebrating Ireland?s latest dismal last twenty minutes a certain Mr. Keane stormed off the pitch, annoyed at how Ireland had played. Roy Keane is a winner. McCarthy is a loser.
The rest of that qualifying campaign was a success and I commend Mick for that. We played good football but still as always were poor against weaker nations. Things like not picking Robbie Keane against Andorra because Mick figured we?d destroy them (like we would with Macedonia eh Mick?), and then refusing to bring him on even when we were being humiliated losing one nil at home to the worst team in Europe. Or the way after a sloppy first half against Estonia Roy Keane had to be the one to tell Gary Breen to cop on, still we were winning 2-1 at the time so everything else is irrelevant.
Humiliating Glen Crowe and the eircom League
I support Shamrock Rovers. Our biggest rivals are Bohemians. We hate and despise them. Think Celtic and Rangers except with no religious sh*te to get in the way of pure hatred. Despite that one Bohs player, Glen Crowe is brilliant. He p*ssed all over Aberdeen and Kaiserslautern in the Champions League and consistently scores 30+ goals in Ireland (our league?s ability is on a par with the England Division One with the exception of the smaller crudier teams.) For months people were demanding Mick gets on a plane to Ireland and take a look at Crowe. Mick continued to not pick him for competitive matches and friendlies despite our lack of goalscorers at the time. Eventually Mick decided to go to the bother of sendning his number two to see what all the fuss is about (You see Mick only comes to Ireland for the weekend of an Ireland match.) His no. 2 recommended Mick call him up for a pointless friendly.
In the end Mick relented. Glen Crowe was called up, but not to the main squad. Instead he humiliated him by putting Crowe in a one man ?Development Squad? !! He ?let? Glen Crowe train with the Irish team (whom he scored a brace for in a training match) but when it came to the friendly that meant nothing he didn?t even put him on the bench. Instead he said ?He was very impressed by Glen? and said he?ll look at him again (which he didn?t). What was the point in Mick doing that ?!
World Cup Warm Up
The Irish team went to Japan and Korea but before we went to Japan where we played all our group games the team spent a week in Saipan Island, Korea. Instead of having a weeks training the week was a ?week off? where the players got used to the conditions in Korea (although we were playing in much cooler conditions in Japan.) I?m not knocking this completely, other sides had ?group bonding? trips like England went to Dubai. But was it necessary to spend a week in Saipan? And in Saipan the Irish players had to train on a pitch compared to a ?car park? which resulted in injurys to key first teamers Steve Finnan and Kenny Cunningham. Now before people say that that was just Roy Keane moaning, Roy Keane brought the topic up with McCarthy on behalf of the players who asked him to as he is the captain.
The ?Keane Affair?
This has been debated a million and one times so I won?t make it as long as I could.
Roy Keane is something a little bit special. Only three or four Irish players of all time could consider themselves to be truly among the Worlds greats of their time, Johnny Giles, Paul McGrath, Liam Brady and Mr. Keane. These players were all vital to Irish teams in the past and all were extremely committed. In fact of all of them, Roy Keane probably excelled himself most in the Irish shirt. So why on Earth would a manager question his best players commitment and accuse him of faking injuries. Mick knew Roy has a terrible temper, and it was in the Irish teams interest for him to play in the World Cup. So why not take Roy into a room say what needed to be said about the conditions etc. and let Roy say what he wants to you. Instead Mick decides to hold a ?group meeting? knowing exactly how it would end, with Roy Keane being left with no option but to leave the squad. BTW Roy and Mick have hated each other since a fight in 1992 so that might have been part of the reason Mick wasn?t so pushed to convince him to stay. Also Mick didn?t even bother to try and talk Roy into staying after Roy said he was leaving. If your captain and best player says he?s leaving the team a week before a World Cup you?d think your manager might try and talk to him. Instead Mick says goodbye and calls up Colin Healy
Tactics
Steve Finnan was brilliant in the EPL last year resulting in him being picked as the best right back. Gary Kelly had been playing terribly for Ireland for a year. However going into the Cameroon game, Mick dropped Finnan for Kelly because ?Kells had been doing good in training?. who in their right mind would drop one of their star players because an average player was playing well in training!
Then there was Duff up front. Duffer is a winger, playing him on the wing would have caused teams a lot of trouble as was clear whenever Duffer moved out to the left side as he was getting no ball up front. Instead Duff and Keane found it hard to get any ball up front. Why wasn?t Quinn played to win ball for Keane and Duff supporting from midfield.
Stubborn
McCarthy is the most stubborn man in the world. For three years we played Ian Harte as a centre back in a 3-5-2 formation. None of the players knew what they were doing but yet because Mick didn?t want to be proven wrong he persisted and persisted and persisted with it.
He?s as stubborn with players. Just think, Mark Kennedy who?s been far worse for Ireland then Kilbane has been was picked ahead of Steven Reid for the World Cup. Perhaps it had something to do with the fact McCarthy was the one who brought Kennedy through the ranks at Millwall and Kennedy was babysitter to McCarthy?s kids Mick will now refuse to be wrong about the whole Duff up front thing and will continue to play him up front I?m sure.
Also during the WC, Ian Harte was a disastour. Mick must have known because in every game he substituted Calamity Harte. Yet in each new game Harte was back in the starting line up. Mick said today that he doesn?t care what the press say, he thinks Harte is our best choice at DL. So now instead of playing the two best full back in England (Carr and Finnan) he?s going to leave one out to accommodate Harte. Anyone else would play Carr at DR and Finnan DL. Also, once more Phil Babb was left out of the recent Irish squad. Babb has been voted the best defender in Portugal but still can?t oust Richard Dunne?s spot on the bench. Why? Because Mick had a fight with him. (The Harcourt St. incident can?t be the reason as Mick has forgiven Kennedy for it ) Also, Gary Doherty is the perfect replacement for Quinn up front. But Mick reckons Doherty is a centre back so there goes that chance.
Penalties
Don?t get me wrong, I?m very proud of how we did in the World Cup. But if Mick McCarthy had have taken charge against Spain I think we would have gotten to the World Cup final. Firstly when we were playing against ten men in injury time. Had Mick known this we surely should have gone on to attack and get the golden goal that we came close to anyway. Instead the players were informed after the game by RT? reporters. Mick himself didn?t even no.
Penalties aren?t pot luck as Mick now mentions every time he?s on TV. Professional footballers should be able to score from 12 yards. When they got to Japan Mick should have picked seven or so players to take them should we end up in a shoot out. Instead he simply said ?who wants one?? and allowed Kevin Kilbane and David Connolly to take some. Both are clearly confidence players. Both had little confidence going into the shoot out (especially Kilbane who missed an open goal from twelve yards earlier.) Neither player knew where to stick their penalty as you can see from the end result, a case of indecision if ever I?ve seen it. Whoever went up to take the penaltys should have known exactly where they were going and have practiced it a thousand times.
Retirements of Players
Name three great Irish players in the last ten years. John Aldridge, Dennis Irwin and Roy Keane. Mick McCarthy has driven the three to retirement due to his arrogance and stupidity. He?s also had fights a host of other players.
Stopping Gary Breen's career
Mick has said that Breen would only be the Irish captain if he stays in England. Breen was offered a chance to join Inter Milan and Parma, instead he has to play at West Ham as Mick said he needs to watch Breen every week, and Mick isn't bothered to go to Italy/tape a match. If Mick is willing to make Breen captain, why do you need to see him every week. Imagine Eriksson stopping Beckham going to Real Madrid because he needs to see his captain every week
Hopefully Mick will leave after Euro 2004 and Niall Quinn or someone (anyone!) else can take over.
Theres loads more reasons but I?ve gone over two thousand words and most of you will have stopped reading by now
....Taken from this thread and copyright 2002 Muller.
I?ve noticed a few people on here say in the last few weeks that Mick has done a good job with Ireland and why are us Irish complaining about him, well jammer gave his list so now here?s my reasons.
Previous Campaigns
Before this World Cup campaign McCarthy spectacularly failed in getting us to World Cup 98 and Euro 2000. I can accept the WC 98 qualifying not being crash hot despite facing no good teams in the campaign as it was his first effort as manager.
The same can?t be said for Euro 2000, which was a joke and should have resulted in him losing his job. First there was the great game with Macedonia at home. Play a counter attack all night long against the mighty Macedonians. Nick a goal when a Quinn header gets deflected in then pull eleven men behind the ball in case their superb attack that consisted of that Macedonian guy who had a season at Barnsley destroy us.
Then there was Yugoslavia away. Eleven men behind the ball all game long, even when we were losing. We had one attack in that whole game which resulted in us having a clearcut peno turned down, we could have at least drawn that game.
There was the great trip to Croatia. More of the same, eleven men behind the ball, if by chance Kenny Cunningham gets the ball he was to hump it to Quinny who was to hold it up for as many seconds as he could to delay the next attack. Unsurprisingly we conceded late on
And of course the magnificent Macedonia game. Somehow we went into that game needing a win to qualify. We attacked early on and scored inside ten minutes. Fantastic, score a couple more then knock the ball around in party fashion. Nope. Take off attackers with defenders. Stop attacking. Everyone behind the ball and pray that the side that was beaten 7-0 by Yugoslavia days before don?t tear us apart. Amazingly they score a last minute goal and we don?t qualify
How he wasn?t sacked I don?t know.
Celebrating Defeat
A 2-2 draw with the Netherlands in Amsterdam is a good result. If you are two nil up with minutes to go and you draw 2-2 it is a huge failure. We were beating the side that was probably second best to France months before in Euro 2000 (yes I know Italy came second). We attack them and play brilliantly for an hour and are deservedly two goals up. Then the oul pull everyone behind the ball trick that always pays off so richly for Ireland. Two late goals for the Netherlands and we threw the three points away. I was at that game and the mood in the stands at the final whistle was not good, we?d been robbed of two points. Imagine everyones disbelief when McCarthy runs on to the pitch celebrating like we?d won the World Cup. He congratulates the players on a magnificent result (it was a magnificent performance for 70 minutes, but a poor result.) As McCarthy was running around the Amsterdam Arena celebrating Ireland?s latest dismal last twenty minutes a certain Mr. Keane stormed off the pitch, annoyed at how Ireland had played. Roy Keane is a winner. McCarthy is a loser.
The rest of that qualifying campaign was a success and I commend Mick for that. We played good football but still as always were poor against weaker nations. Things like not picking Robbie Keane against Andorra because Mick figured we?d destroy them (like we would with Macedonia eh Mick?), and then refusing to bring him on even when we were being humiliated losing one nil at home to the worst team in Europe. Or the way after a sloppy first half against Estonia Roy Keane had to be the one to tell Gary Breen to cop on, still we were winning 2-1 at the time so everything else is irrelevant.
Humiliating Glen Crowe and the eircom League
I support Shamrock Rovers. Our biggest rivals are Bohemians. We hate and despise them. Think Celtic and Rangers except with no religious sh*te to get in the way of pure hatred. Despite that one Bohs player, Glen Crowe is brilliant. He p*ssed all over Aberdeen and Kaiserslautern in the Champions League and consistently scores 30+ goals in Ireland (our league?s ability is on a par with the England Division One with the exception of the smaller crudier teams.) For months people were demanding Mick gets on a plane to Ireland and take a look at Crowe. Mick continued to not pick him for competitive matches and friendlies despite our lack of goalscorers at the time. Eventually Mick decided to go to the bother of sendning his number two to see what all the fuss is about (You see Mick only comes to Ireland for the weekend of an Ireland match.) His no. 2 recommended Mick call him up for a pointless friendly.
In the end Mick relented. Glen Crowe was called up, but not to the main squad. Instead he humiliated him by putting Crowe in a one man ?Development Squad? !! He ?let? Glen Crowe train with the Irish team (whom he scored a brace for in a training match) but when it came to the friendly that meant nothing he didn?t even put him on the bench. Instead he said ?He was very impressed by Glen? and said he?ll look at him again (which he didn?t). What was the point in Mick doing that ?!
World Cup Warm Up
The Irish team went to Japan and Korea but before we went to Japan where we played all our group games the team spent a week in Saipan Island, Korea. Instead of having a weeks training the week was a ?week off? where the players got used to the conditions in Korea (although we were playing in much cooler conditions in Japan.) I?m not knocking this completely, other sides had ?group bonding? trips like England went to Dubai. But was it necessary to spend a week in Saipan? And in Saipan the Irish players had to train on a pitch compared to a ?car park? which resulted in injurys to key first teamers Steve Finnan and Kenny Cunningham. Now before people say that that was just Roy Keane moaning, Roy Keane brought the topic up with McCarthy on behalf of the players who asked him to as he is the captain.
The ?Keane Affair?
This has been debated a million and one times so I won?t make it as long as I could.
Roy Keane is something a little bit special. Only three or four Irish players of all time could consider themselves to be truly among the Worlds greats of their time, Johnny Giles, Paul McGrath, Liam Brady and Mr. Keane. These players were all vital to Irish teams in the past and all were extremely committed. In fact of all of them, Roy Keane probably excelled himself most in the Irish shirt. So why on Earth would a manager question his best players commitment and accuse him of faking injuries. Mick knew Roy has a terrible temper, and it was in the Irish teams interest for him to play in the World Cup. So why not take Roy into a room say what needed to be said about the conditions etc. and let Roy say what he wants to you. Instead Mick decides to hold a ?group meeting? knowing exactly how it would end, with Roy Keane being left with no option but to leave the squad. BTW Roy and Mick have hated each other since a fight in 1992 so that might have been part of the reason Mick wasn?t so pushed to convince him to stay. Also Mick didn?t even bother to try and talk Roy into staying after Roy said he was leaving. If your captain and best player says he?s leaving the team a week before a World Cup you?d think your manager might try and talk to him. Instead Mick says goodbye and calls up Colin Healy
Tactics
Steve Finnan was brilliant in the EPL last year resulting in him being picked as the best right back. Gary Kelly had been playing terribly for Ireland for a year. However going into the Cameroon game, Mick dropped Finnan for Kelly because ?Kells had been doing good in training?. who in their right mind would drop one of their star players because an average player was playing well in training!
Then there was Duff up front. Duffer is a winger, playing him on the wing would have caused teams a lot of trouble as was clear whenever Duffer moved out to the left side as he was getting no ball up front. Instead Duff and Keane found it hard to get any ball up front. Why wasn?t Quinn played to win ball for Keane and Duff supporting from midfield.
Stubborn
McCarthy is the most stubborn man in the world. For three years we played Ian Harte as a centre back in a 3-5-2 formation. None of the players knew what they were doing but yet because Mick didn?t want to be proven wrong he persisted and persisted and persisted with it.
He?s as stubborn with players. Just think, Mark Kennedy who?s been far worse for Ireland then Kilbane has been was picked ahead of Steven Reid for the World Cup. Perhaps it had something to do with the fact McCarthy was the one who brought Kennedy through the ranks at Millwall and Kennedy was babysitter to McCarthy?s kids Mick will now refuse to be wrong about the whole Duff up front thing and will continue to play him up front I?m sure.
Also during the WC, Ian Harte was a disastour. Mick must have known because in every game he substituted Calamity Harte. Yet in each new game Harte was back in the starting line up. Mick said today that he doesn?t care what the press say, he thinks Harte is our best choice at DL. So now instead of playing the two best full back in England (Carr and Finnan) he?s going to leave one out to accommodate Harte. Anyone else would play Carr at DR and Finnan DL. Also, once more Phil Babb was left out of the recent Irish squad. Babb has been voted the best defender in Portugal but still can?t oust Richard Dunne?s spot on the bench. Why? Because Mick had a fight with him. (The Harcourt St. incident can?t be the reason as Mick has forgiven Kennedy for it ) Also, Gary Doherty is the perfect replacement for Quinn up front. But Mick reckons Doherty is a centre back so there goes that chance.
Penalties
Don?t get me wrong, I?m very proud of how we did in the World Cup. But if Mick McCarthy had have taken charge against Spain I think we would have gotten to the World Cup final. Firstly when we were playing against ten men in injury time. Had Mick known this we surely should have gone on to attack and get the golden goal that we came close to anyway. Instead the players were informed after the game by RT? reporters. Mick himself didn?t even no.
Penalties aren?t pot luck as Mick now mentions every time he?s on TV. Professional footballers should be able to score from 12 yards. When they got to Japan Mick should have picked seven or so players to take them should we end up in a shoot out. Instead he simply said ?who wants one?? and allowed Kevin Kilbane and David Connolly to take some. Both are clearly confidence players. Both had little confidence going into the shoot out (especially Kilbane who missed an open goal from twelve yards earlier.) Neither player knew where to stick their penalty as you can see from the end result, a case of indecision if ever I?ve seen it. Whoever went up to take the penaltys should have known exactly where they were going and have practiced it a thousand times.
Retirements of Players
Name three great Irish players in the last ten years. John Aldridge, Dennis Irwin and Roy Keane. Mick McCarthy has driven the three to retirement due to his arrogance and stupidity. He?s also had fights a host of other players.
Stopping Gary Breen's career
Mick has said that Breen would only be the Irish captain if he stays in England. Breen was offered a chance to join Inter Milan and Parma, instead he has to play at West Ham as Mick said he needs to watch Breen every week, and Mick isn't bothered to go to Italy/tape a match. If Mick is willing to make Breen captain, why do you need to see him every week. Imagine Eriksson stopping Beckham going to Real Madrid because he needs to see his captain every week
Hopefully Mick will leave after Euro 2004 and Niall Quinn or someone (anyone!) else can take over.
Theres loads more reasons but I?ve gone over two thousand words and most of you will have stopped reading by now
....Taken from this thread and copyright 2002 Muller.
