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Old 09-06-2003, 10:06 PM   #46
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u2popmofo,

"Sting2, please provide some proof/evidence/sources for your arguements and numbers."

Could you be a little more specific? My main arguement has been that the standard retail price of a CD that is 19.99 today is cheaper than it was 5, 10, or 15 years ago when you count inflation. There for, this idea that the music industry is falling because CD's are "overpriced" is in fact false. CD's in 2003 have never been cheaper once you count for inflation.

I know this by simply taking the price of CD in 1988 or 1992, and then multiplying by the anual inflation rate. I get the standard retail price from copies of Billboard magazine that I still have from years ago and today. The inflation rate can come from multiple sources, but I get mine from the Encyclopedia Year Book that always reports the latest economic numbers from the following year. I have annual inflation rates from every year from 1975 to the present.

So I could site the yearbook sources that I have and the Billboard magazines that I have as well, for the inflation rates and standard retail prices for different years.

U2s royalty rate I got from Rolling Stone Magazine just as POP was about to be released.

The Industry numbers which show I decline in music sales starting around 2000 have already been reported here by others. I could go out and get the latest issue of Billboard magazine which will give the difference in sales from this week and this same week last year.

Is this what you had in mind?
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Old 09-06-2003, 10:11 PM   #47
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I'd just like something I could read for myself, not just having to take your word for everything.

Please give up on the inflation arguement too. It really doesnt make sense in this context. Honestly, when DVD's came out, they were $50. Now you can buy them for as low as $10. I'm guessing that's because of downloading too, right? I've honestly never even seen the music industry try to use inflation as a reason for their cd prices. It really seems off base, maybe it's just me. I dont know.
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Old 09-06-2003, 10:26 PM   #48
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Quote:
Originally posted by STING2
Yes, there are other expenses and yes the record company should and has every right to make a profit of of what they sell.
Yes, just like Nike has a right to make a $100 profit off shoes that cost $6 to produce.

Unfortunately for the record company, file sharing is here to stay, and will stay, because the while the labels have every right to make a profit, the consumers apparently also feel they have every right not to be ripped off.

The internet will be the downfall of these companies as time goes on, and you can blame us for freeloading (because surely you never, ever downloaded anything yourself), but then some blame has to go to corporate greed as well.
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Old 09-06-2003, 10:36 PM   #49
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Originally posted by STING2
I just thought of another interesting statistic. While the price of a CD today is several dollars less than it was 15 years ago, how about the price of U2 tickets?

The average price of a U2 ticket on the Joshua Tree tour was about 18 dollars. In todays money thats about 27 dollars. The price of U2 tickets on the Elevation tour was around 80 dollars which is about 84 dollars today.

So CD's today are about 20% cheaper than they were 15 years ago, but the price to see U2 has more than tripled. Now I have no problem paying the increased price to see U2. I'd rather see U2 make the money than ticket resellers. But what I find puzzling are those that are concerned about CD's that are cheaper than they were years ago being overpriced, but their favorite band is charging triple the price of admission, and they don't recieve nearly the level of flak that the record companies have been recieving for selling a product that is cheaper today than it was years ago.
Most people here did not pay $80 or more to see U2 the other year, most of us payed $45 for General Admission for an even closer experience being in the heart or outside the tip of the heart. Secondly the artists (U2) get most of the money from touring sales including merchandise sold at concerts this is why lot sof us don't mind spending money seeing them tour because we know the money we are paying is going into the artists pockets and not the rip-off record companies pockets. So by comparing cd solds to concert tickets sold you are comparing apples to oranges because the profits from each are not going to the same source.
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Old 09-06-2003, 11:03 PM   #50
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u2popmofo,

"I'd just like something I could read for myself, not just having to take your word for everything."

I can give you sources for the numbers I got on inflation and the retail prices of CD's. The rest is economics 101 and my opinion.

"Please give up on the inflation arguement too. It really doesnt make sense in this context. Honestly, when DVD's came out, they were $50. Now you can buy them for as low as $10. I'm guessing that's because of downloading too, right? I've honestly never even seen the music industry try to use inflation as a reason for their cd prices. It really seems off base, maybe it's just me. I dont know."

Please take a look at the inflation arguement instead of brushing it aside. I understand what you said about the DVDs and its true there is a natural decrease in price as technology comes on to the market, normaly about 5 years. CD's first came on the market in 1983. By 1994 they had completely cornered the market, and pushed out records and made Cassettes a tiny fraction of the market. At that point the techonology is common, and the reduction in price do to new technology becoming more available is over. This is in 1994, nearly 10 years ago when CD's were selling at retail for 16.98.

DVD's may be relatively new, but Compact Disk are not. Compact disk had filled up the market by 1994 in a way that DVDs have yet to do.

Anyways, my whole point with inflation is that CD's are not overpriced. Products typically get more expensive over time in order to keep up with inflation or stay just ahead. CD's by contrast continue to drop despite the fact that they have been around for over 20 years. The price of CD's which should be stable now, is not keeping up with inflation.

That simply shows that CD's are not overpriced. The other thing that shows they are not overpriced is the mass consumption by consumers of CD's in the years leading up to the decline which started in 2000.

The decline in sales coincides with certain technologies making it easy to copy and download CD's becoming widely available to the public. The past 3 years has seen an increase in the availability of this technology along with continued decline in Album sales.

Yes the economy is dull, but GDP has not dropped by 10%. In fact the only GDP decline in the economy happened in 2001 and it was less than 1%. The losses incurred by the music industry could not be explained by the current state of the economy because the losses in percentage terms are far greater.

There is no evidence that people listen to music less today than they did 6 years ago, so why are sales down to this degree? The only answer is that people are getting what they want for free through the internet instead of going to the store and buying it.
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