The 2007-08 NHL Hockey thread

[CTU2fan]

I really don't know who to root for anymore. I've lost all interest in the Leafs, who were my team when I was little, but I've got no attachment to them anymore since I stopped watching hockey altogether in the two or three years before the lockout, and now I've grown to dislike them. Not as much as I dislike the Senators and Canadiens, but I don't feel any compulsion to actively cheer for Toronto to do well. The only two Canadian teams I still could say I somewhat like are Calgary and Vancouver.

I find myself rooting against teams in almost every single game I watch rather than cheering for a team. It's a much better feeling when the team you're cheering for wins than when the team you're cheering for doesn't lose, if that makes sense.

When it comes to hockey, I wouldn't root for an American team unless I actually lived there. Any other sport, fine. But hockey = Canada. Period.

It feels almost like I'm picking a team from scratch. If someone held a gun to my head and told me to choose, I guess I'd go with Vancouver (I lived with 3 Calgarians last year, and they were pretty obnoxious when it came to the Flames). But I know absolutely nothing about them. As it stands though, I feel like I can't get into hockey as much as I'd like to without a definite team to cheer for.

This is a very weird situation to be in.

I hear ya. I'm from CT and was always a Whalers fan. But come playoff time, well you needed to root for somebody and all too often the Whale were out. I liked a lot of Flyers players (Hextall, Tocchet, Propp, Kerr, etc) so I would usually root for Philly come April. Then the Whalers left, but all of my old favorites on the Flyers were on the way out too...and the endless Bobby Clarke/Eric Lindros soap opera really turned me off. So here I sit with no team. I'm trying to get back into the Flyers...I suppose being in Florida now I could follow the Lightning but they just don't do it for me for some reason. I try to root for the Bruins but the Whaler fan in me just can't do it...so I guess I'll stick with the Flyers, but it's strange.

It's sad, because I love the sport, I grew up playing it and it really is my favorite. I know if the Whalers still existed I'd be just as into it; I was a total bleed-green diehard. But with them gone I can't quite fill that void with another club

 

[BoMac]

Is that what you 'out-of-the-blue' think of saying when you don't have an answer ??


What did I NOT respond to ??


I believe I addressed your points ... and very clearly too.

These are some of the statements that you have been posting recently:

But on a GREATER note ... the Thrashers AHL Wolves are beating the pants off ANY of the NHL teams ... Period !!

The Wolves have a perfect start for their team.
They are undefeated. So far, 5 games played and 5 games won, no losses.

Is their ANY other team (AHL/NHL) with a perfect record so far ??

I don't recall hearing about any with that kinda status !!

The Wolves have the BEST start in their AHL franchise history. How many other teams currently have that title on them ??

Bottom line is ... the NHL is a superior club over the AHL minors. But when you have an AHL team with a perfect starting record, and far more incredible stats presently than ANY of the NHL teams, you begin to wonder where the actual superiority belongs !!

And of course, the Wolves' record will NOT stay perfect until the end of the season. But, I think they're proving at the moment that pretty much it will be damn close.

If I take your comments literally, you're saying that because the Wolves started undefeated (with an overtime loss, mind you) that they're somehow SUPERIOR to NHL clubs that have a loss to their record.

I come to this conclusion because you say things like: " the Thrashers AHL Wolves are beating the pants off ANY of the NHL teams ... Period !!" and "But when you have an AHL team with a perfect starting record, and far more incredible stats presently than ANY of the NHL teams, you begin to wonder where the actual superiority belongs !!".

So I ask you, again, are you or are you not saying that because the Wolves have a perfect record in the AHL that they're somehow SUPERIOR to an NHL team that has losty a game or two.


The crux of my point is what I posted earlier:

Originally posted by BonoManiac
Had the Wolves gotten that starting record in the NHL then you would have had a point. But the Wolves play against AHL competition, which AS A WHOLE is INFERIOR to the NHL. Therefore, your argument is null and void.

But you started talking about how INFERIOR the Blackhawks are especially towards their fans. I wasn't talking from a customer service point of view, but from a competition aspect. The Wolves are a great team but within the context of the AHL. The Scranton/Wilkes-Barre Yankees finished with the best record in the AAA International League. Would you say that they're better than some major league teams who had less wins than they did? No, because AAA baseball is a step below the major leagues in terms of quality.

I'm really getting tired of this. Let's try and stick to the topic at hand.

 

[DaveC]

I hear ya. I'm from CT and was always a Whalers fan. But come playoff time, well you needed to root for somebody and all too often the Whale were out. I liked a lot of Flyers players (Hextall, Tocchet, Propp, Kerr, etc) so I would usually root for Philly come April. Then the Whalers left, but all of my old favorites on the Flyers were on the way out too...and the endless Bobby Clarke/Eric Lindros soap opera really turned me off. So here I sit with no team. I'm trying to get back into the Flyers...I suppose being in Florida now I could follow the Lightning but they just don't do it for me for some reason. I try to root for the Bruins but the Whaler fan in me just can't do it...so I guess I'll stick with the Flyers, but it's strange.

It's sad, because I love the sport, I grew up playing it and it really is my favorite. I know if the Whalers still existed I'd be just as into it; I was a total bleed-green diehard. But with them gone I can't quite fill that void with another club

I always liked the Whalers when I was little. And the Nordiques, too. The best teams are long gone, though.

Now, if the Winnipeg Jets were still around, there would be no problem for me at all

 

[DaveC]

As an aside, I think it's really hilarious that you two are arguing so hard about the AHL

 

[LarryMullen's POPAngel]

 

[Canadiens1131]

As an aside, I think it's really hilarious that you two are arguing so hard about the AHL

That's the thing, in the end it's still the fricken' AHL

 

[BoMac]

I know, I know......I can't believe I'm having this conversation either.

I think I'll let it go

 

[BoMac]

I always liked the Whalers when I was little. And the Nordiques, too. The best teams are long gone, though.

Now, if the Winnipeg Jets were still around, there would be no problem for me at all

One of the most intense rivalries in all of sport was between the Montreal Canadiens and the Quebec Nordiques.

I submit to you Exhibit A

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2UAvdsTarn8

I wish Quebec and Winnipeg was still around.

 

[LarryMullen's POPAngel]

Wow, the Nordiques and Jets.

I miss all the Canadian hockey teams.

 

[UberBeaver]

One of the most intense rivalries in all of sport was between the Montreal Canadiens and the Quebec Nordiques.

I submit to you Exhibit A

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2UAvdsTarn8

I wish Quebec and Winnipeg was still around.

lol, 1984 - and who's there playing? Chris Chelios. That guy is a friggin immortal. The shorts, however, are awful.





Minnesota has the coolest jerseys this year. I think I can name only one guy on that team (Sean Hill) but I want one of those jerseys.

 

[zoney!]

Minnesota has the coolest jerseys this year. I think I can name only one guy on that team (Sean Hill) but I want one of those jerseys.

Gaborik

I could pick you up one on Monday...I picked up tickets today to see the game that night against the Oilers. I am pretty excited. I have seen a Wild game in thre years or so (pre-strike - and with a few Interferencers at that).

 

[MsMofoGone]

Originally posted by BonoManiac
If I take your comments literally, you're saying that because the Wolves started undefeated (with an overtime loss, mind you) that they're somehow SUPERIOR to NHL clubs that have a loss to their record.

You know what, this IS getting ridiculous. I say one thing, and you say another. For the record, I NEVER once came 'flat out' and said
"Oh yeah, I'm comparing The Wolves to the NHL teams" ... the fact that you feel that was my interpretation is your issue, not mine. I have stated in SEVERAL other posts explaining my sediment here, and I have constantly mentioned how I'm NOT comparing The Wolves to the NHL teams because of my earlier remarks. Just because, I said how The Wolves' PERFECT starting record was SUPERIOR and was better than any of the other NHL teams, means just that. I was strictly basing it on the fact that there IS no NHL team that started with 6 straight games won. That is my point. I thought that The Wolves were indeed SUPERIOR to have a starting record of 6-0, and I was wondering if ANY other NHL team had a starting record that was like theirs. That's it ... nothing more was to be lead into this scenario. I was in 'no way' saying The Wolves have the BEST record by comparing THEM to the NHL teams. I said The Wolves have the BEST starting record in their AHL franchise history ... again, I did NOT comment anything about The Wolves with the NHL franchise history.

Originally posted by BonoManiac
I come to this conclusion because you say things like: " the Thrashers AHL Wolves are beating the pants off ANY of the NHL teams ... Period !!" and "But when you have an AHL team with a perfect starting record, and far more incredible stats presently than ANY of the NHL teams, you begin to wonder where the actual superiority belongs !!"

Again, I have specified what exactly I meant by my former above comments you stated.
Just because you misunderstood what point I was making is NOT my error.

Originally posted by BonoManiac
I'm really getting tired of this. Let's try and stick to the topic at hand.

I can agree with the fact that trying to continue this discussion is indeed with no reason.
I'll let it go as well now, since I feel I've made it absolutely clear what my point was. Hopefully, you will better understand too.



So, maybe you would like to comment now about what I said about the Chicago Blackhawks ??
You wanna talk NHL ... fine, I can do that.
I criticized the Hawks because of the way their organization treats their fans.
So, tell me, how does your NHL team and their organization treat the fans ??


And yes, I'm just trying to see if it's hereditary among ALL the NHL teams/orgs, or just a small minor few.

 

[RavenBlue]

Why would they? To trade him while he's hot so they can get some young blood?

The Leafs will have no chance at making the playoffs if they trade Sundin - it's a bit early in the season to be making drastic changes like this imo. The season's not a write-off just yet, esp. after their last couple games.

Meh, I guess I'm just completely sick of the Leafs. Part of me kind of thinks that a complete overhaul would do them good. Well, at this point, anything would do them good.



I enjoyed the AHL whilst it was here, then we lost the team. and well.. so much for that.

I wonder if Halifax could ever handle an NHL team It would be nice to have a team from the real 'east' of Canada.

 

[DaveC]

I enjoyed the AHL whilst it was here, then we lost the team. and well.. so much for that.

I wonder if Halifax could ever handle an NHL team It would be nice to have a team from the real 'east' of Canada.

Go Flames

NHL in Halifax

Wonder what the team name would be?

 

[BoMac]

Go Flames

NHL in Halifax

Wonder what the team name would be?

The Mooseheads?

I think that Halifax will get a CFL franchise before they get an NHL team, although it would be nice.

Right now it's the relative stability and profitability of the 6 Canadian franchises that is keeping the NHL in the black, so I think Bettman would be wise to add some more franchises north of the border, starting with Quebec, Winnipeg and maybe Hamilton. Then we can look at Halifax (and I think it would do well there, imo).

 

[No spoken words]

I live in the US, but it makes me sick that places like fucking Florida have franchises, but we're down to 6 Canadian franchises. I'd LOVE to see a Quebec franchise again, Winnipeg as well.

Thinking about old school Canadian teams made me think of my Islanders back in the day....used to worship Bossy, Trottier, Smith, Gillies, Potvin, Tonelli, Brent and Duane Sutter, Morrow, Nystrom, etc....

 

[DaveC]

If I ran the league...

I'd move Pittsburgh to Winnipeg, Florida to Quebec City, Nashville to Saskatoon, Carolina to Halifax, and Columbus to Seattle. Move Tampa Bay to Orlando and have them become the Florida Lightning. Detroit moves to the Eastern Conference.

This way every province in Canada has a team (thereby putting WAY more bodies into seats than you're going to get in their old cities and contracting 2 Florida teams that barely draw into one that will do decently) and the league looks like this:

East
North Division
Quebec City
Halifax
Boston
Montreal
Buffalo

Central Division
Toronto
Ottawa
Detroit
NY Islanders
NY Rangers

South Division
Atlanta
Florida
Washington
Philadelphia
New Jersey

West
North Division
Seattle
Saskatchewan
Calgary
Edmonton
Vancouver

Central Division
Winnipeg
Minnesota
Colorado
Chicago
St. Louis

South Division
Los Angeles
Anaheim
San Jose
Phoenix
Dallas

Better competition, more bodies in seats, less in travel costs, bigger TV audiences (in Canada especially). And some of those division rivalries would be unreal (VAN-SEA, QUE-MTL-HFX-BOS, the entire East Central, Sask vs. the 2 Alberta teams, WPG-MIN)...

But alas, I'm not Gary Bettman. And now that I think about it, that's a good thing.

 

[LarryMullen's POPAngel]

Get Detroit and Chicago in the East and bring back the Canadian teams and I'd be a happy girl.

Maybe even a glowing puck, too, while we're at it.













kidding

 

[DaveC]

Most of the shitty-drawing teams in need of contraction are in the East though. There's not a whole lot of room for movement from the West to the East so moving both Detroit and Chicago isn't really practical. Unless you send Toronto back to the West, in which case it destroys that awesome division and it doesn't make much sense to have Toronto West and Chicago East.

 

[LarryMullen's POPAngel]

Good point.

 

[U2ME3]

If I ran the league...

...and Columbus to Seattle

The Blue Jackets finally field a decent team and will push for a playoff spot and you want to move them!

 

[DaveC]

Yup. Good thing for you I'm not running the league and Bettman has no problem leaving extraneous teams in cities where they do much worse than they would elsewhere.

 

[BoMac]

If I ran the league...

I'd move Pittsburgh to Winnipeg...

I agree with you on almost all of your points save for this one. I think Pittsburgh is a great hockey city, and with a new arena on the way—and, not to mention a great young team—they should be a healthy franchise for years to come.

However, I think Winnipeg should get a franchise somehow.

This way every province in Canada has a team (thereby putting WAY more bodies into seats than you're going to get in their old cities and contracting 2 Florida teams that barely draw into one that will do decently) and the league looks like this:

Uh, I don't see a team from Moncton, Charlottetown and St. John's on your list.

 

[DaveC]

 

[RavenBlue]

New Brunswick, the province everyone forgets

 

[zonelistener]

Right now it's the relative stability and profitability of the 6 Canadian franchises that is keeping the NHL in the black

Is this opinion or fact? and if it is fact, prove it.

My views are similar to No Spoken Words. I believe there should be more Canadian teams, and seeing a team move from Winnipeg to Phoenix...but it is about the economics. Sask could not support an NHL team, and I am not sure Winnipeg could either.

 

[ladywithspinninghead]

Sask could not support an NHL team, and I am not sure Winnipeg could either.

Ooh, I don't know - I'm originally from Sask. and the fans are fanatical about their Roughriders, I can't imagine how they'd be with an NHL team!

 

[zonelistener]

Ooh, I don't know - I'm originally from Sask. and the fans are fanatical about their Roughriders, I can't imagine how they'd be with an NHL team!

I agree that sask has fanatical fans...but that does not mean success for an NHL franchise. Ticket prices are pretty high out there...and I cannot imagine such a small area supporting 40+ games with an average ticket price of 70USD.

I am not sure Saskatoon or Regina could support something like that.

 

[ladywithspinninghead]

Perhaps not now but if Sask continues down this same road in the next few years - i.e. discovery of more oil and other natural resources, flush Albertans coming to settle in the province and all around unprecedented economic boom - then perhaps it's a possibility in the future

 

[BoMac]

Is this opinion or fact? and if it is fact, prove it.

Yeah, perhaps I should have been more clear. My statements are both really, but they stem from an article I read recently (which I tried to Google unsuccessfully).

Basically, the article centred on two main points. One was that while Canadians have flocked back to the arena following the lockout, Americans not so much. Teams such as Detroit, Carolina, Florida, Columbus, Chicago, Boston etc....draw less than stellar crowds while Canadian rinks are filled to the brim.

Another important point was that Canadian franchises have never been healthier, and a big reason for that is the value of the dollar vs. the American greenback. Whereas previously a $US 1-million salary would cost Canadian teams approximately $1.6 million CAD, it's now almost even. Multiply that by 20-22 players and that's quite of bit of money thrown out the window.

Anyway, I think that US hockey will rebound, especially with good young teams in Pittsburgh, Boston, Chicago as well as Detroit, Minnesota, Carolina and finally a decent team in Columbus.