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Old 02-20-2006, 09:05 AM   #61
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Re: R.E.M.- Second Biggest Band in the World?

Quote:
Originally posted by Final Straw
or am i just dillusional?





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Old 02-20-2006, 12:38 PM   #62
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i love r.e.m., but you can't call them a big band anymore.
i saw them in detroit their last tour and i don't even think the place was sold out!
when i saw them in detroit during the monster tour, there was no question that it was a sold out show!

so, maybe 10-12 years ago you could call 'em a big band, but not anymore.
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Old 02-20-2006, 01:08 PM   #63
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Quote:
Originally posted by STING2


If your talking about an "All Time list" then yes. But thats not whats being discussed. The discussion is about the current popularity of artist that can still be considered as "active". The Beatles for the purposes of this list are not active, just like Led Zep, Pink Floyd, The Police etc.


Ok...but the rest of what I said still applies..

REM? I loved, loved their earlier work but I would say that they haven't had a relevant album in the past 10 years. Their heart and soul left the audition when Bill Berry left the band.

If you're just speaking of ticket sales..

The Who
Coldplay
Green Day
Franz Ferdinand
Wilco
The Rolling Stones
The Dave Matthews Band

all have more tickets buyers...


If your talking about bands that have released more relevant albums, I'd add

Arctic Monkeys
Keane
Oasis
The Brazilian Girls

to that list
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Old 02-20-2006, 01:57 PM   #64
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Quote:
Originally posted by Westport




Ok...but the rest of what I said still applies..

REM? I loved, loved their earlier work but I would say that they haven't had a relevant album in the past 10 years. Their heart and soul left the audition when Bill Berry left the band.

If you're just speaking of ticket sales..

The Who
Coldplay
Green Day
Franz Ferdinand
Wilco
The Rolling Stones
The Dave Matthews Band

all have more tickets buyers...


If your talking about bands that have released more relevant albums, I'd add

Arctic Monkeys
Keane
Oasis
The Brazilian Girls

to that list
Well, popularity is determined by both ticket sales and album sales.

As far as ticket sales, Franz Ferdinandn and Wilco would not have a chance against REM. REM can still play Arena's in the USA and they can still play some Stadiums in Europe, something those two bands can't do in either place.

As for the Dave Matthews Band, yes they would beat REM in in the United States in ticket sales, but they would get crushed by REM anywhere outside the United States. So in that case REM is the winner there.

Coldplay could beat REM in the United States by a small margin, but worldwide REM would still sell more concert tickets.

The Who, I'm not sure about because their tours over the past 10 years have focused primarily on North America. They also don't put out albums anymore, so I'm not sure I would even include them in the list.

The only artist on the list that could clearly sell more tickets than REM worldwide are Green Day and the Rolling Stones. But, all of those artist except for the Who and the Stones were able to sell more albums with their last released album of new material.
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Old 02-20-2006, 02:45 PM   #65
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can we get a number of tix sold instead of total money? cause it is much more expensive to see the older band then any one else.
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Old 02-20-2006, 05:25 PM   #66
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Quote:
Originally posted by allbecauseofu2
can we get a number of tix sold instead of total money? cause it is much more expensive to see the older band then any one else.
Not necessarily, many veteran artist charge what some young bands like Coldplay do today. Price is determined by DEMAND, not the age of the artist or the age of the fans. The greater demand there is to see a certain artist, the higher the price of the ticket.
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Old 02-20-2006, 08:45 PM   #67
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Quote:
Originally posted by STING2


Well, popularity is determined by both ticket sales and album sales.

As far as ticket sales, Franz Ferdinandn and Wilco would not have a chance against REM. REM can still play Arena's in the USA and they can still play some Stadiums in Europe, something those two bands can't do in either place.

As for the Dave Matthews Band, yes they would beat REM in in the United States in ticket sales, but they would get crushed by REM anywhere outside the United States. So in that case REM is the winner there.

Coldplay could beat REM in the United States by a small margin, but worldwide REM would still sell more concert tickets.

The Who, I'm not sure about because their tours over the past 10 years have focused primarily on North America. They also don't put out albums anymore, so I'm not sure I would even include them in the list.

The only artist on the list that could clearly sell more tickets than REM worldwide are Green Day and the Rolling Stones. But, all of those artist except for the Who and the Stones were able to sell more albums with their last released album of new material.

Sorry but you are wrong. REM can't sell out arenas in the U.S. They might possibly sell out ONE night at a specific arena but that is doubtful. I saw them a couple of years ago at the Greek Theatre in Los Angeles and there were empty seats and that capacity is a little over 6000. But it was a great show.

Coldplay can outsell REM in the U.S. at the moment by a huge, huge number.

Most teenagers in the U.S. don't even know REM. That alone shows you how much their star has faded. That can't be said for Rolling Stones, Coldplay, Green Day

REM is selling more seats than Coldplay is Europe? REM is still playing stadiums in Europe? You might be right but I'd love to see the numbers that support that argument.

The Dead can also sell more tickets...even with Jerry six feet under.

And the last bands that can smoke them in both album and seats sold is:

Bruce Springsteen and the E Street Band..

and after that:

in ticket sales:

Metallica, Rascal Flatts , Aerosmith, Bon Jovi, Van Halen


Even in their home state of Georgia and and in New York City (and possibly the rest of the country), I would say that that the Allman Brothers Band can sellout more nights and more seats than REM.


So the answer to your question at this moment in time is: No

That said...I still believe that if Michael Stipe can find his musical muse and if Bill Berry returned to the band...REM is a band that is one perfect album and one tour away from being the second biggest band on the planet. I wouldn't bet against that happening at some point.
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Old 02-20-2006, 11:34 PM   #68
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Who defines "big"? Peops are citing all kinds of arbitrary barometers, but this is a subjective m-f question.

I know she isn't a "band" but Madonna, according to Geldof at Live 8, is the Queen Bee of Rock and Roll.

What about some of the new kids on the block, will we even remember them in a few albums?

I'm sure into the Strokes and Killers now, but will they be there in 10 years?

Then there's Green Day. Radiohead. Pearl Jam.
Dave Matthews Band.

Isn't this just great rock and roll whether or not these groups hold the commercial zenith that the super-drowsy Stones and McCartney occupy?

REM rumors...Bill Berry has re-joined more than once, and there are rumors. . . . for . . . . more .. .

but to cut to the quick, REM are one of the great bands on any clock. They're peers with U2, to be certain.

That was the music that defined my teens and early twenties: REM and U2. U2 and REM. *Reckoning* wrecked me, and I was hooked, just like watching *Under a Blood Red Sky* a few too many times wrecked me.

Did I hear someone mention Guns and Roses? That's a different kind of big. A big . . . . I won't say what.

love, ANU
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Old 02-20-2006, 11:45 PM   #69
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Quote:
Originally posted by Westport



Sorry but you are wrong. REM can't sell out arenas in the U.S. They might possibly sell out ONE night at a specific arena but that is doubtful. I saw them a couple of years ago at the Greek Theatre in Los Angeles and there were empty seats and that capacity is a little over 6000. But it was a great show.

Coldplay can outsell REM in the U.S. at the moment by a huge, huge number.

Most teenagers in the U.S. don't even know REM. That alone shows you how much their star has faded. That can't be said for Rolling Stones, Coldplay, Green Day

REM is selling more seats than Coldplay is Europe? REM is still playing stadiums in Europe? You might be right but I'd love to see the numbers that support that argument.

The Dead can also sell more tickets...even with Jerry six feet under.

And the last bands that can smoke them in both album and seats sold is:

Bruce Springsteen and the E Street Band..

and after that:

in ticket sales:

Metallica, Rascal Flatts , Aerosmith, Bon Jovi, Van Halen


Even in their home state of Georgia and and in New York City (and possibly the rest of the country), I would say that that the Allman Brothers Band can sellout more nights and more seats than REM.


So the answer to your question at this moment in time is: No

That said...I still believe that if Michael Stipe can find his musical muse and if Bill Berry returned to the band...REM is a band that is one perfect album and one tour away from being the second biggest band on the planet. I wouldn't bet against that happening at some point.
1. If you would read my post more carefully, you'll see that I never stated that REM could sellout arena's in the United States, but that they could PLAY at them! They booked some arena sized venues around the country(USA) on their last tour.

2. I'm talking in terms of GLOBAL popularity, not USA popularity. Nearly 70% of all the albums and tickets sold around the world are sold outside the United States. REM is a global band.

3. Many of Coldplay's shows in the United States did not sellout. REM can still sell 40% to 50% of the number of tickets Coldplay can sell in the United States. But REM could make that deficit up on a GLOBAL scale. Overall Coldplay would win out easily because they sell 5 times as many albums worldwide, but when it comes to tickets worldwide, REM is still the more in demand artist, even though thats not the case in North America.

The Grateful Dead were only really popular in North America, and thats where they spent all their time touring. Jam bands don't sell in Europe or many other places, whether its the Dead, Phish, or Dave Matthews.

Bruce Springsteen is not a band.

Metallica could beat REM in ticket sales and album sales worldwide, but not by the margin you would think. Metallica's last album only sold 4 million copies worldwide, and many if not most of the Arena shows in North America did not sellout. Oh, and headlining a popular 5 band stadium line up does not count as ones own concert either.

Rascal Flats, Aerosmith, and Van Halen would be crushed by REM outside of North America. Van Halen has never come close to ever having one of their albums sell 1 million copies in Europe. Aerosmith has one studio album that sold 1 million copies in Europe over the past 12 years which was "Nine Lives" and thats it. Rascal Flats can't even be mentioned. In the United States, Van Halen's last studio effort only sold 500,000 copies and their last tour only soldout 4 shows in the United States. These three bands sell nearly all their tickets and albums in one market, the United States. While they may beat REM in that one market, REM sells enough around the world to be ahead of the them.

Bon Jovi is one of the more popular bands on the planet still, definitely in the top 10 do primarily to their strong concert drawing power worldwide.

So to sum up, in terms of both current Album and ticket sales around the world, REM has the following bands you listed beat:

Franz Ferdinand
Wilco
The Dave Matthews Band
The Who
Rascal Flatts
Aerosmith
Van Halen


These other bands that you listed would beat REM in terms of combined current album and ticket sales around the world:

Metallica
Bon Jovi
Rolling Stones
Green Day
Coldplay


Remember, what people like in North America VS. what the rest of the world likes can be the difference between night and day often.
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Old 02-20-2006, 11:48 PM   #70
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Quote:
Originally posted by Anu
Who defines "big"? Peops are citing all kinds of arbitrary barometers, but this is a subjective m-f question.

I know she isn't a "band" but Madonna, according to Geldof at Live 8, is the Queen Bee of Rock and Roll.

What about some of the new kids on the block, will we even remember them in a few albums?

I'm sure into the Strokes and Killers now, but will they be there in 10 years?

Then there's Green Day. Radiohead. Pearl Jam.
Dave Matthews Band.

Isn't this just great rock and roll whether or not these groups hold the commercial zenith that the super-drowsy Stones and McCartney occupy?

REM rumors...Bill Berry has re-joined more than once, and there are rumors. . . . for . . . . more .. .

but to cut to the quick, REM are one of the great bands on any clock. They're peers with U2, to be certain.

That was the music that defined my teens and early twenties: REM and U2. U2 and REM. *Reckoning* wrecked me, and I was hooked, just like watching *Under a Blood Red Sky* a few too many times wrecked me.

Did I hear someone mention Guns and Roses? That's a different kind of big. A big . . . . I won't say what.

love, ANU
Were using the strict definition of "current popularity" as judged by the music business which involves sales of the latest studio album of new material plus concert selling strength of the latest tour.
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Old 02-21-2006, 12:00 AM   #71
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R.E.M. isn't big by any standard anymore. This whole thread comes off like an attempt to will them into a higher stratum than they occupy.

I like them too, but they're not that popular anymore and they're not that relevant anymore.
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Old 02-21-2006, 01:08 AM   #72
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Quote:
Originally posted by STING2



These other bands that you listed would beat REM in terms of combined current album and ticket sales around the world:

Metallica
Bon Jovi
Rolling Stones
Green Day
Coldplay



You answered your own question.

R.E.M is the Seventh Biggest Band in the World.
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Old 02-21-2006, 02:12 AM   #73
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Quote:
Originally posted by Westport




You answered your own question.

R.E.M is the Seventh Biggest Band in the World.
No, there are other bands that would come before REM, such as the Red Hot Chili Peppers and Linkin Park. I was just responding to the bands you named, not making a comprehensive list.

Remember that REM's Around The Sun sold 2 million copies worldwide, and as a touring act, they are able to play arena's in most countries and markets where albums are sold. While they may not sellout in the United States, they sellout nearly everywhere outside the United States, and Europe they were able to play some of the big stadium size venues in the summer of 2005 even though they had done an extensive arena tour of Europe earlier in the year already.
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Old 02-21-2006, 12:44 PM   #74
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Quote:
Originally posted by STING2


Europe they were able to play some of the big stadium size venues in the summer of 2005 even though they had done an extensive arena tour of Europe earlier in the year already.
Totally agree, you can't base a bands popularity purely on their success in one country. I think what we've discovered(something i wasn't too sure about before being from Ireland but am now), is the fact that REM just aren't BIG anymore in America. In terms of elsewhere around the world I would at least have them in the top 10. They might only be playing to crowds of 6000 in the states but they played to over 80,000 in Hyde Park London last June.

As far as the quote that REM aren't even in the top 100 in the world!.........Oh please!
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Old 02-21-2006, 12:45 PM   #75
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Quote:
Originally posted by STING2


You must realize though that Radioheads last album only sold about 1.5 millioin copies worldwide which is a little less than what REM's album "Around The Sun" sold. In addition, REM can play to equal or large crowds in most parts of the world.

Radiohead never really got "Big" from a commercial standpoint, with the possible exception of the "OK Computer" album.
Are you sure your info is correct? Hail to the Thief sold close to a million copies in the US alone (900,000 or so). I find it hard to believe that it only sold 600,000 in the rest of the world, including the UK.
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