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Old 01-21-2008, 03:18 PM   #571
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I think if you asked 20 football fans who they'd rather have, 18 would say Eli.
Over who? Rex Grossman? I bet it would unanimous. I'd take Eli in that pairing too. Rex Grossman shouldn't even be in the NFL, whereas at least Eli is a mediocre NFL-calibre player.

But given the choice of quarterbacks not named Tom, Peyton, or Brett in the NFL, I can think of a half-dozen off the top of my head I would pick before Eli.
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Old 01-21-2008, 03:19 PM   #572
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^what about Philip Rivers?
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Old 01-21-2008, 03:20 PM   #573
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^what about Philip Rivers?
What about him?

He's just about on the same level as Eli, really. A great team around him (LT, Shawne Merriman, Cromartie), and he can play well when he gets hot, but more often than not he's mediocre at best.

For the record (because I know someone's going to mention him sooner or later), Donovan McNabb is (well, at least before this season - now he just plain sucks) in this group, as well.

If Eli Manning was at the helm of the (current) Eagles, he wouldn't have done any better than Chunky Soup did.
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Old 01-21-2008, 03:22 PM   #574
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Over who? Rex Grossman? I bet it would unanimous. I'd take Eli in that pairing too. Rex Grossman shouldn't even be in the NFL, whereas at least Eli is a mediocre NFL-calibre player.

But given the choice of quarterbacks not named Tom, Peyton, or Brett in the NFL, I can think of a half-dozen off the top of my head I would pick before Eli.
Would you take Carson Palmer over Eli? I might, based on stats. But, that dude's team keeps going 8-8 or worse, despite his gaudy stats and big mouth, while the Giants go to the playoffs. I guess we just disagree on Eli's merits.
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Old 01-21-2008, 03:25 PM   #575
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Would you take Carson Palmer over Eli? I might, based on stats. But, that dude's team keeps going 8-8 or worse, despite his gaudy stats and big mouth, while the Giants go to the playoffs. I guess we just disagree on Eli's merits.
Yes, I would take Carson Palmer over Eli if I were creating a team from scratch. Without hesitation.

That is exactly my point.

Great quarterback (before '07) + shitty team = the Cincinnati Bengals

Middling quarterback + great team = the 2007 NFC champs

ETA: Having a team that's not comprised of compulsive drunk drivers also helps the Giants, too.
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Old 01-21-2008, 03:30 PM   #576
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But the Bengals are not necessarily a shitty team. They have a great offense, but their defense has gotten worse since their playoff appearance 2 seasons ago. I think Palmer's a loser, and his shit attitude and lack of leadership qualities does not help an already shitty locker room.

You can't just ascribe a "good team" label using hindsight/their record.

But we could go round and round on this.

Pitchers and Catchers soon....
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Old 01-21-2008, 03:31 PM   #577
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I'd say Eli probably takes too much of a beating, all things considered, about 60% of which is because his name is Manning, and 20% of which is because he's playing New York, and 10% of which because he whined his way out of San Diego. That leaves 10% of legitimate criticisms.

He's good, not great.
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Old 01-21-2008, 03:33 PM   #578
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I'd say Eli probably takes too much of a beating, all things considered, about 60% of which is because his name is Manning, and 20% of which is because he's playing New York, and 10% of which because he whined his way out of San Diego. That leaves 10% of legitimate criticisms.

He's good, not great.
I pretty much agree with the above.
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Old 01-21-2008, 03:37 PM   #579
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This has to be one of the most civilized Manning (Eli or Peyton) conversations we've ever had in this thread
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Old 01-21-2008, 03:38 PM   #580
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I want to do more Palmer bashing.
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Old 01-21-2008, 03:53 PM   #581
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OK it's funny, but as I read this discussion the first guy I thought about comping Eli with was Rivers, and Philk got him, next was Palmer and NSW got him...just funny we thought of the same guys. Put it this way, if you were drafting NFL QB's how many guys get picked ahead of Eli? You have the obvious Tom & Peyton. Then there's guys like Palmer and Big Ben that IMO are ahead of Eli. Is Eli a top-10 QB in the NFL?
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Old 01-21-2008, 04:08 PM   #582
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Knowing what I know now, CTU2 fan, I'd NEVER draft Palmer ahead of Eli. Eli's stood up to a maelstrom of scrutiny and name calling, and has basically been above it all. Palmer, the colossal douche bag, calls out teammates and coaches with regularity, and has one playoff appearance to his credit. Eli, in 3 years as a starter, has made 3 playoff appearances.

I'd draft Peyton, Brady, Roethlisberger ahead of him.....maybe Brees......maybe Romo.....Favre is better but are you drafting for one season or for now and the future??.......I'm not sure who else....Rivers, maybe.....
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Old 01-21-2008, 04:24 PM   #583
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Would you take Carson Palmer over Eli?
In a heartbeat.

QBs are overrated. They may be the face of their team, but they only deserve roughly 5% of the credit. It's a team sport, and QB is just one position. Eli is still average; he just hasn't been making any horrible mistakes. Reminds me of Trent Dilfer when the Ravens went to the SB...
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Old 01-21-2008, 04:25 PM   #584
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In a heartbeat.

QBs are overrated. They may be the face of their team, but they only deserve roughly 5% of the credit. It's a team sport, and QB is just one position. Eli is still average; he just hasn't been making any horrible mistakes. Reminds me of Trent Dilfer when the Ravens went to the SB...
You'll never be more wrong than this.
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Old 01-21-2008, 04:26 PM   #585
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You'll never be more wrong than this.
What's next out of you, RB is an irreplaceable position? Most important positions are the lines. Every time.
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