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Old 04-29-2008, 12:14 PM   #856
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So would any number of others, and we'd likely get quality or even better in return.

I'm approaching this as someone who has watched them pretty much every game all year. I know you know the game but I doubt you've watched them to that extent?
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Old 04-29-2008, 12:21 PM   #857
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the raptos aren't exactly on very often... but to part with calderon would be foolish. i'm not a big stat guy, as they can be very over-rated... but assist to turnover ration is a very good stat at figuring out the efficency of a point guard.

assist to turnover ratios of NBA point guards
chris paul - 4.6 to 1
chauncey billups - 3.2 to 1
steve nash - 3.1 to 1
deron williams - 3.1 to 1
jason kidd - 3.1 to 1
kirk hinrich - 2.9 to 1
andre miller - 2.8 to 1
baron davis - 2.7 to 1
allen iverson - 2.4 to 1

am i suggesting that jose calderon is better than any of those guys listed? no. what i do know is this... the only guys on that list that are younger than calderon are paul and williams.

calderon's assist to turnover ration this season? 5.5 to 1... tops in the NBA.

and bargnani is waaaay too young to give up on at this point.
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Old 04-29-2008, 12:25 PM   #858
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Sports fans of Interland, please pay the proper homage to a contender:



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Old 04-29-2008, 12:37 PM   #859
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assist to turnover ration is a very good stat at figuring out the efficency of a point guard.

I agree...but I think it's the age of both of them is what is pissing me off at this point. I'm tired of being a 'growing/young team'. I'd like someone more experienced. I want to make it to the second round for fuck's sake, or at least go 6 or 7 games.
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Old 04-29-2008, 01:00 PM   #860
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Old 04-29-2008, 01:01 PM   #861
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I agree...but I think it's the age of both of them is what is pissing me off at this point. I'm tired of being a 'growing/young team'. I'd like someone more experienced. I want to make it to the second round for fuck's sake, or at least go 6 or 7 games.
well we have a vast difference of opinion then.

i like what toronto's doing with their young players. give them another year or two, but keep cap flexability so that you can add older guys later... if you can convince them to sign in canada with the tax issues that all.
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Old 04-29-2008, 01:07 PM   #862
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and just like that, i've started rooting for the suns to lose...

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Mike D'Antoni is on Donnie Walsh's radar for the Knick opening if D'Antoni is fired by the Suns after the first round, according to a source close to the Knick president.
-ny post
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Old 04-29-2008, 02:31 PM   #863
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if you can convince them to sign in canada with the tax issues that all.
they have some way around it, i forget how it works lol
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Old 04-29-2008, 03:24 PM   #864
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and just like that, i've started rooting for the suns to lose...

Why do you want D'Antoni? He's been ravaged by Suns fans for being terrible with adjustments/rotations, unable to get the team to play defense(granted the players themselves for the most part aren't great defensively), etc.

If he can't get any closer to winning with the Suns' roster, why on Earth would he do any good with the Knicks' roster?

Wait, let me guess, your standard answer when asked why any team might do well in the East: "Because the Eastern Conference is god-awful"...
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Old 04-29-2008, 04:22 PM   #865
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Hey, Nam, where you been?

The Raptors played as good of a series as they could, I'd hardly blame their problems on Calderon or Bargnani, Gabe. They had no one to contend with Dwight Howard, and when he gets going, everyone else around him plays better. They're probably one of the best all-around shooting teams in the league and can run with just about anybody, but don't have a great defensive presence to guard the paint.

And yes, D'Antoni would have success with the Knicks because the East is awful. There's no comparison to be made.

What do you guys think about Riley's retirement and Larry Brown in Charlotte?
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Old 04-29-2008, 04:47 PM   #866
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Hey, Nam, where you been?

The Raptors played as good of a series as they could, I'd hardly blame their problems on Calderon or Bargnani, Gabe. They had no one to contend with Dwight Howard, and when he gets going, everyone else around him plays better. They're probably one of the best all-around shooting teams in the league and can run with just about anybody, but don't have a great defensive presence to guard the paint.

And yes, D'Antoni would have success with the Knicks because the East is awful. There's no comparison to be made.

What do you guys think about Riley's retirement and Larry Brown in Charlotte?
I think it is obvious that Riley was only in it as long as the Heat had a shot at contending...they had a terrible season, and I think as soon as Shaq was traded, the Heat went into rebuilding mode, and I think Riley knew as soon as that trade went down that he wasn't coming back as coach next season. Fits perfectly with the way he came back in 2004...anybody really believe SVG quit for 'family' reasons(especially since he's coaching again now)?

As for Larry Brown....it totally baffles me why people continue to hire him. He has an absolutely gargantuan ego, he has a history of turning on/bolting from EVERY SINGLE TEAM he's been with when he gets bored/restless/whatever, he talks shit about his players to the press, is notorious for not wanting to give anyone under the age of 25/26 any playing time, has a history of not getting along with his 'star' players, refuses to admit responsibility when he makes mistakes, etc etc etc.

The guy has come off as an arrogant self-serving ass. But it would be one thing if he were actually the HOF coach everyone says he is, but he's not. He is among the most overrated coaches in NBA history.

In 23 seasons as a head coach in the NBA, he failed to qualify for the playoffs 6 times and he lost in the first round 7 times. That's 13 times out of 23 that he either didn't get into the playoffs or lost in the first round. 56.5% of the time, well over HALF the time, he either didn't get in or lost in the first round! He lost in the second round 5 times, so 18 times out of 23 he didn't get further than the second round. 78.3% of the time he didn't make it further than the second round! Only 5 times did he get deep into the playoffs - two ECF with the Pacers, the finals with the Sixers, and the championship and finals with the Pistons. 5 times out 23. 21.7%. Less than a quarter. The way the guy is hailed, you would think he's the winningest coach in nba history, but he's not even close, and he has ALL that baggage. I just don't understand why people continue to hire him, and to FOUR YEAR CONTRACTS, when history clearly shows there's a good chance of the guy wanting out before that time is up.
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Old 04-29-2008, 05:59 PM   #867
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I think Charlotte is a good fit for Brown. Where he excels is in an environment where there are young players that he can coach; he can make a crappy team into a competitive one. Where he has problems is when he tries to make a good team into a champion, because his ginormous ego clashes with those of the stars on that good team.

Don't get me wrong, I think he's an incredible douchebag in the Bill Parcells mold...I never understood why players who play the mercenary role are skewered in the media while guys like Parcells, Brown, and Riley are held up as icons.
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Old 04-30-2008, 12:39 AM   #868
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Wow, Phoenix choked big-time down the stretch.
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Old 04-30-2008, 01:31 AM   #869
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Can they really fire D'antoni? I can't see them finding a better coach.
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Old 04-30-2008, 08:24 AM   #870
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How much blame for this goes to D'Antoni? I honestly saw more poor execution than poor coaching, but firing the coach is the "easy" fix I suppose. Then there's the Dallas situation...not a great job by Johnson but that team IMO is flawed, and aging. The Hornets were clearly better...coaching didn't decide that.
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