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Old 12-04-2007, 08:58 PM   #46
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i think we need to bring back the idea of contraction. florida, tampa bay, pittsburgh, kansas city and minnesota... at least 2 of those teams need to go.
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Old 12-04-2007, 09:44 PM   #47
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how do ya trade your two best players and not even get one single proven major leaguer in return?

unbelievable
Its not that dissimilar to the Beckett trade. And that (Hanley Ramirez) worked out well for Florida.

But geez they gotta spend some money at some point don't they?
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Old 12-04-2007, 10:12 PM   #48
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The Tigers just became favorites to win it all.

It still comes down to pitching with this team. We're going to hit well enough (though we are still WAY too right handed and aging in several areas), but we still haven't ever seen a full season of dominance from Jeremy Bonderman and Dontrell Willis hasn't been good in 2 years. He could get shelled in the AL. Has Nate Robertson recovered from last season's drop off? Is Justin Verlander ready to carry this staff? Is Kenny Rogers roasted? Who's coming out of the bullpen to get key outs?

I've still got a few questions about this team.

Oh yeah, and we have decimated our farm system this year.

Have you ever gone on vacation and went crazy with your money knowing that if your car breaks down when you get home you're screwed? I feel like that with the Tigs.
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Old 12-05-2007, 09:34 AM   #49
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Who's coming out of the bullpen to get key outs?
I think that's going to be the key. They need to get Zumaya back ASAP, and they need to add a couple of reliable pen arms. Problem is, have you seen the FA deals relievers are signing? Not even talking about Rivera & Cordero's deals, but middle relievers like Linebrink & Riske are cashing in big time. Best bet is to trade for bullpen help, but as you said they just gutted the farm doing this Florida deal.
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Old 12-05-2007, 09:37 AM   #50
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i think we need to bring back the idea of contraction. florida, tampa bay, pittsburgh, kansas city and minnesota... at least 2 of those teams need to go.
I would actually go with Florida & Oakland. Those other clubs actually draw when they're halfway decent; the A's feature a half-filled stadium for playoff games. Contract the A's & Fish, move somebody to the AL, have a dispersal draft, and call it a day.

The Royals? They're playas baby, you see that Guillen deal? And they're in on Andruw Jones...they could potentially pay 30 million a year on 2 guys and have shit to show for it. $12MM is WAY too much for Guillen, and Andruw looked like crap last year...
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Old 12-05-2007, 09:47 AM   #51
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first thing i would do is disolve the pittsburgh pirates as they currently exist. merge the marlins and devil rays into one team and move them to pittsburgh to become the new pirates and give them a new owner, a mark cuban, someone who isn't afraid to spend money to make money. it's been proven that people will show up in pittsburgh if you put a competitive team on the field, and they're a long time franchise in baseball, rich with history.

i have more respect for oakland as a franchise than i do for minnesota or kansas city. they at least attempt to add players to stay competitive... they signed mike piazza, they signed frank thomas, etc. etc. not to huge mega contracts, but at least they take a chance on that aging vet that might push them over the top. as for attendence at oakland? first off they play in a football stadium... it's entirely too big for the second team in the market. secondly, oakland is not exactly a nice area. they have plans for a small stadium outside of oakland. i think they'll do well there.

the twins are no different than the expos at this point. they have a great farm system, let the talent play to the point where they're up for a renewel of their contract and then ship them out rather than spend the money to keep them. yes, they don't make the money that the yankees, red sox, mets, dodgers, cubs, etc. etc. make. but they don't even make an honest attempt to keep any of them, and it's disgusting.
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Old 12-05-2007, 03:07 PM   #52
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Oh I agree with you. My point is/was that KC & Minnesota (for example) aren't bad markets, they just have poor management. I'd give those cities/markets a chance with legit ownership if possible (what you proposed for Pittsburgh).

The thing about Oakland is they were good for a good run of years (when they had the 3 pitchers) and they still didn't draw. Yeah the stadium kind of sucks, and the area does too, but if you have a winning team a decent fanbase will support it.

I honestly think Miami as a baseball market is kind of like LA as a football market...there just isn't a passion for it and there's too much else going on for them to draw there. I could see them doing OK for a few years with a new ballpark but it seems like they'd really have to win year in year out to sustain any following. Look at Atlanta...they're OK, but as soon as they stop winning the division every year their attendance crashes.
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Old 12-05-2007, 03:36 PM   #53
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Here's the problem with the Marlins:

Their stadium sucks for baseball!

When it was decided the Marlins were going to become a part of MLB, a new stadium for them should've been on the horizon. Look at the Rockies. They join MLB the same year as Florida and two years afterward, they have a brand new baseball-only stadium. If the Marlins were given a new stadium two years after they entered the league, none of these problems would be happening. The fans would be coming out to a fan friendly facility and enjoying their experience at the ballpark. With more fans coming out, I'm assuming their revenues would be higher. Meaning, of course, they'd actually be able to keep their talented players. Which translates to, hopefully, a better team. Without a new stadium, the Marlins will never have a chance to be successful for an extended period of time.

I think the Marlins should relocate, not contract.
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Old 12-05-2007, 03:51 PM   #54
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Talking about contraction is a complete waste of time. It's not happening.

The Twins are the biggest joke of them all. They operate in the black and still refuse to keep a guy like Santana? You have the best pitcher in baseball on your team, and you are keen to get rid of him, in his prime? Yet, you have a new Stadium on the way and you fucking make money. Disgrace.
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Old 12-05-2007, 04:00 PM   #55
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Did the Phillies even attend the winter meetings?? Yeesh. Be nice if they at least looked like they were making an effort to improve the pitching.
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Old 12-05-2007, 04:05 PM   #56
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They all do it though. Twins & Pohlad are the most high-profile cheapskates because he doesn't really try to sugarcoat/deny what he does, but somebody (Gammons) was saying this morning that these small-market clubs take in $60mil a year in luxury tax/revenue sharing money before they sell a single ticket. It's a joke. What they ought to have done when they put the luxury tax in is put in a salary floor also. Not a hard floor (since the cap isn't hard or even a cap at all), but something like if your payroll is below X (say $40mil) for 2 years in a row you don't get a nickel in luxury tax money.

Granted most of the tax money comes straight from the Yankees, and everybody hates the Yankees so they don't care. But I'm a Sox fan and I dislike the Yanks as much as anyone, and I still think it's BS that these clubs are getting a welfare check signed by Big Stein (and the little Steins now I guess) and just sticking it in their pocket rather than putting it into their club.
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Old 12-05-2007, 04:06 PM   #57
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Did the Phillies even attend the winter meetings?? Yeesh. Be nice if they at least looked like they were making an effort to improve the pitching.
I read they have interest in Julian Tavarez

Seriously yeah the Phils have been quiet outside of the Houston thing awhile back. I did read something about them asking B'more about Melvin Mora, not sure if there's anything to that.
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Old 12-05-2007, 04:22 PM   #58
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The biggest news on their website, or the Philly sports blog I read, during the entire winter meetings period was about the new day uniforms not having red pinstripes.
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Old 12-05-2007, 06:33 PM   #59
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Talking about contraction is a complete waste of time. It's not happening.

The Twins are the biggest joke of them all. They operate in the black and still refuse to keep a guy like Santana? You have the best pitcher in baseball on your team, and you are keen to get rid of him, in his prime? Yet, you have a new Stadium on the way and you fucking make money. Disgrace.
Bill Smith read your post. Santana is staying put.

(And lets not forget the Twins offered Carlos Santana 20mil a year for 4 years and he turned it down).
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Old 12-06-2007, 12:08 PM   #60
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Did the Phillies even attend the winter meetings?? Yeesh. Be nice if they at least looked like they were making an effort to improve the pitching.


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Bedard in Philly? Metro as a Source?

I was more than a little surprised to hear the morning shows talking about a possible trade offer for Erik Bedard today, but even more so at their source being the Metro. The commuter paper reports that Pat Gillick has offered Kyle Kendrick and Shane Victorino, plus two unnamed prospects, for Bedard, who was arguably the best starter in the AL last year despite playing for the Orioles and against division rivals like the Yankees and Red Sox.

I'd love to see Bedard pitch in Philly. He's a strikeout machine and a lefty, and his game is on the rise. Losing a starter plus potentially the starting CF would be tough, but the rotation would be sick. It'd be a total win if the Phils pulled it off, and re-signed Aaron Rowand. Nothing against Vic, we all loved him this season. But Bedard is a bona fide #1 now, and they're hard to come by.

This is all still very much a rumor among many at the Winter Meetings, with no confirmation from Gillick that we know of. As Carl P. puts it, "Once you hear about an offer, you can assume it's dead. If it had a real chance - it'd be done by now." Still, if you're a baseball fan, this is why you love the Winter Meetings...

Meech has more, as does Daulerio at the Daily Examiner.

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Posted by Matt P in Phillies | Permalink | Comments (6)
I like this if they can manage to re-sign Rowand, otherwise there's nobody to play centerfield.

I like Kendrick and the Flyin' Hawaiian, but pitching is an absolute MUST if this team wants to beat the Mets again this year.

ETA: Now I read at mlbtraderumors that the Orioles have rejected the trade, "two prospects" not being enough to give up Bedard. And at philly.com today Gillick says signing Rowand is going to be a long shot, so if they aren't planning on keeping AR, there's no way they can get rid of Victo.
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