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Old 07-11-2007, 12:27 PM   #61
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I doubt Snape bluffed an AK in front of several DE's.

Pettigrew will replay the life debt he has towards Harry, right under Voldemort's nose. I can see Snape redeem himself, but the rat will die.

I'd like to see Lupin bond with Harry some more. At least someone from the Marauders ought to survive.

A lot of people say R.A.B. is Sirus's brother...but that just seems too obvious and too easy. I think R.A.B. is someone we haven't met yet.
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Old 07-11-2007, 05:21 PM   #62
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I don't believe this. I started an HP thread THREE days ago in anticipation of the book and the film, and nobody bothered to reply to it--and it's still up there close to the top. Just because I don't frequent this part of the site (I post in Free Your Mind). I spent a CONSIDERABLE amount of time posting, sharing my experiences as a staff member at a bookstore doing the book parties for Books 4 and 5, my thoughts on seeing the series end, HP's place as a work of literature, my experiences seeing the origional Star Wars series in the theater as a kid in 1977-83, and comparing that to the HP book releases, and my predictions for Book 7.

And nobody really bothered to reply. I was so excited and wanted to know what you thought. If you go check my thread, "For Harry Potter Fans", you'll see what I mean. It's a VERY long post. But I guess I'm a stranger here and I'm not important. Sorry to be such a grouch but I'm too tired to post all that again. Sorry I wasted my breath.

For that, before I get my two Sickles in this thread, (*I* don't care about replying in a thread started by people I don't know), I'm going to share my thoughts on Film 5.


It goes without saying that these are













*************MASSIVE MOVIE SPOILERS****************


So read at your own peril!!




*************************





I went to a midnight screening last night ans was going topost a review but was too tired. I bought my tix 4 days ago but when I got there 2 hrs early, there must have been 400+ people in line already. The theater was in a mall so there was room for huge lines. They opened up 4 theaters and they all sold out! All adults too. Not even any preteen kids there you could keep up past midnight. I judged that I was halfway through the line. Luckily I had tix in the first theater sold so I managed to get a seat very close to where I wanted.

The film was great, I'd say it was one of the two best, In fact I'd say it WAS the best one, I'd say that Yates took up where Cuaron left off, except for one or two glaring flaws. Here are some random thoughts.

THE GREAT:

1) The battle at the Ministry. This, along with the Yule Ball, is one of the two best scenes of the whole series so far and IMO, it ranks as one of the best film scenes of the decade. I predict this scene will become famous--at least until 2010, when we see Film 7 and the final battle of the war. Yes, the Graveyard scene was great too, scary and powerful, but it was too short and in some parts Voldemort sounded too much like, well, Ralph Fiennes.
But here Fiennes fully realizes his part. He has grown into Lord Voldemort, just as Daniel Radcliffe has at last fully grown into Harry. Which brings me to the other great thing about this scene and the film: Dan's acting. There is a scene towards the end which is incredible, spellbinding, and it truly shows Dan's potential as an actor to become one of the future greats. I ABSOLUTELY willnot say any more, but the huge color pic in yesterday's New York Times review is a clue. You've seen the picture; now here's the scene. The music is incredible in this scene too--a very "Fellowship of the Ring"-death of Boromir effect, remeniscent of Howard Shore's score for the last 20 mins of FOTR. If only the whole score could have been like this....

2)The Order of the Phoneix. Yates does a good job of presenting them, their history, etc. And it is BEYOND COOL seeing them in action. Coolest thing of the whole film: you know how the Death Eaters appear coming swiftly downards from clouds of gray smoke when they are called by Voldemort in the Graveyard in GOF? Well, Yates has the Order appearing at the Ministry battle in the same way, but in clouds of white vapor. This got cheers in the theater and I must say it was awesome to see Mr. Weasley appear in such fashion. Mr Weasley kicking butt! And Micheal Gambon behaving more like Dumbledore was great too.

3)The visuals. The Ministry has a creepy Orwellian look no doubt inspired by Fritz Lang's black and white 1927 silent classic, "Metropolis." If 1984 were ever put on film again, it would be inspired, hopefully, by this. Yates hired a celebrated Polish cinematographer and it shows. The whole film is presented in what I'm calling a "Matrix" palette. If you remember, in "The Matrix", all the scenes in the Nebuchednezzar (the real world) were in dingy blue, gray, black, with drab interiors; and all the scenes in the Matrix were lush and colorful. But, as you recall, the Matrix was the place of comfortable slavery, while in the real world you lived a life of hardship but you were free and fighting for freedom. That's the gist here. The only color in the film is in scenes with Umbridge, with her office being the biggest splash of color of all. (Her office: I won't give this away. It's priceless.) Oh, and when they're not in their school robes, the kids all wear colorful clothes, esp Ron and Hermione. The overall effect is jarring, to say the least. More than any other film, the borders between the wizarding world and our own seem to vanish, but instead of this presenting a charming effect, (like Fudge's servant using his wand to snuff out a car alarm at the Leaky Cauldron in POA) it's downright creepy. Yate's purpose is to cement the political parallels between Book 5 and our own world, and it succeeds brilliantly. Stun me for saying it, but I can see why some of the critics are nitpicking about the lack of whimsy and wonder here.

4) Evanna Lynch. The critics ARE right; she's wonderful as Luna. I'm hoping against hope that Yates puts the Quidditch back into Film 6; Quidditch has no place here and thank God it didn't get in. Ron and Hermione are set to largely domiate Film 6 just as Harry dominates Film 5, but just as in Film 5 when the last 20 minutes yank the drama up another 10 notches, I predict that The Cave will change everything--just as it does in the book. I thoight nobody could do The Cave better than Cuaron, but this guy just might be able to do it even better. So Ron and Hermioner'going big in Book 6 is just fine. And to that end, if Quidditch comes back, I HOPE we see Luna doing the commentary. PRICELESS.

5) Snape and Harry. The Occlumency scenes were even better than the book, IMO, because of the unique way Yates presents the flashbacks. It's not easy to describe; you have to see for yourself. Alan Rickman is BRILLIANT (to quote Ron) and this has me chawing at the bit for Film 6 and 7! The tension and electric feeling in the air during every scene Snape is in are fanstastic. And the scene Snape is in with Doleres, when she "evaluates" him, is priceless.

THE GOOD:

1)The Thestrals. Flawlessly realized. Luna's scenes with Harry and the thestrals (sp?) are touching and beautiful. Note to Yates though: if only some people are able to see them, why can everyone ride them?

2)Grawp. He's adorable. And the forest scenes are great--esp with Umbridge! This got a lot of cheers in the theater. Dragged on a bit too long though. And I miss Grawp saying "Hermy!" He doesn't here. Hagrid does briefly tell the tale of going to the giants--but sadly Olympe is not mentioned.

3)Harry and Cho's kiss. Perfect, and the Mistletoe effect was charming. But there is not enough dialogue between Harry and Cho and the audience never really sees just what Harry sees in her. There's some discussion of Cedric but not enough to develop their relationship in general.

4)The twins joke shop business is presented and the Extendable Ears are great. We see the Skiving Snackboxes in action (LOL) and the escape from the school is great (no swamp though!) but the giant "W" in the sky is a bit corny.

5) Apparition. We see people Apparate but they just appear. But there is no *CRACK* sound and I have to say I'll never HEAR Apparition sound the same way again. This really bugged me for some reason.

6)Sirius. His scenes with Harry are perfect. You see how he is pained at haivng to treat Harry as an adult and how he can't have his best pal back. I have to say though: is that tattoo on his chest Gary Oldman's, or the Sirius character's? You do get a sense of how Sirius must have been the HOT swinging bachelor before he was taken to Azkaban, and how Azkaban changed him. Darn, I want to email Jo and ask for a pic of Sirius at 23!

7)Finding out what everyone's Patronus is. I won't give this away! Hm. What would be my Patronus? An Arabian horse. That's a good question actually. What would you like your Patronus to be if you could have one?

8) Contrary to rumors, we DO see Mr Weasley getting attacked by Nagini and we "see" it through Harry's eyes. It's quite gruesome and Yates does this brilliantly. THis more than anything proves Harry is a Horcrux! However, we do NOT see him recuperating it St Mungo's. I was really bummed at St Mungo's not being shown--out of all the places in the Wizarding world I wanted to see the hospital onscreen but I can see why it wasn't there--it did not fit the mood of the film and would have been too cutsie. However, not seeing Neville and his parents is an unforgvable omission--but we do see Neville talking about it later on, as we are presented with a closeup of the old Order pic and we see what they used to look like.



The UGLY:

And I'm sorry to say, there are a couple of GLARING flaws. These are unforgiveable and I'll have a hard time getting over them

1) Snape's Worst Memory. This is presented merely as a "reverse flahsback" during the Occlumency scene, and it whizzes by in something like 15-20 seconds. We see glimpses of the Murauders, mostly James, but WE DO NOT SEE LILY. Or if we do, it's only in the background of the pack for 2 seconds and she NEVER SPEAKS. Honestly, it'll take a couple of viewings for someone to tell if she's even there. Only a couple of lines, from James. Snape never speaks either. We do not see Lupin hardly either. Apart form the unforgivable lack of dialogue from Snape and LILY, this scene has less of an impact to the overall story arc when it is presented as just another of the film's many flashbacks. It would be more effective if it was shown for what it was: a very imprtant memory hidden in the Pensieve. The non-fan has no idea how important this memory is to Snape,. and thus Film 7 is going to be a problem. I'm hoping this is b/c Steve Kloves, the scriptwriter for the other films, is not on this one; he'll be back for the others. If Harry has walked to the Pensieve and seen the memory like in Film 4 when he saw the trial of Karkaroff, that's the way it was supposed to be shown; and at a similar pace.

2) the Courtroom for the trial did not have a menacing enough feel. There's no cinematic continuity between it and Film 4. The book says that Hary was tried in old Courtroom 10, a dungeon, ie the same courtroom Karkaroff was tried in. Harry recognized it from the Pensieve. But this room is not menacing enough. The floor is done out as two Eyes though, a brilliant metaphor by Yates. And Mrs Figg looks different.

3) the score. And this is a big one for me, perhaps the biggest of all. The music for the Minstry scene was everything I hoped it would be, big and grand and dramatic, but the lack of it, and of lietmotifs or strong cues in general, was a sore disappointment to me. With this film's political themes it was an opportunity for some grand Ennio Morricone style stuff (too bad he's gone!) but there is hardly any music in the first half of the film. Umbridge;s theme, the only real motif is juanty and strikes a decent note and the only reminder that this is supposed to be a kid's film, but inother places Hooper strikes all the wong notes. The Dumbledore's Army scenes are accompanied by lighhearted, sweet flute peices that are all out of joint and ruin Yate's supposed purpose of showing a dramatic secret student rebellion in the making. It makes the Room of Requirement scenes too cutsie for me. And I'm sorry, this bothers me b/c I can visualize how someone like Howard SHore could have scored this. Yates contrasts the ROR scenes with Umbridge's growing "reign of Terror" but the cute music lessens the effect. Hooper is good at scoring the "horror" scenes but little else. The abscence of John Williams's work does not bother me as much as some critics, but there's nothing in its place. The score for GOF was GORGEOUS and the Harry/Cho theme (in the owlery) and the Yule Ball were so great (esp as you hear it over the closing credits) were so great I went around humming it for days. Absolutely magical. SO good I thought Williams had written it and I was flabbergasted to find out he didn't. Hooper said it was hard to follow JW but he didn't try hard enough.

I'm a huge fan of Film scores and place great emphasis on film music in general. Lots of otherwise bad films have been rescued by great music. Conan the Barbarian for one. I guess this goes back, again, to the impact the Star Wars scores had on me seeing them in the theaters as a kid. You have no idea what hearing that music for the first time in a theater did to an 8 yr old kid. Howard Shore for LOTR had a similar effect.





*************END MOVIE SPOILERS******************




As to my hopes for the book--I'll reply more in future but my big hope for Book 7?A big dramatic 4 pg long death scene for Snape where he sacrifices himself to save the cause and Harry. A big tearful confession from Snape to Harry as he dies in Harry's arms, about how he loved Lily And how he took an Unbreakable Vow to destroy the moster who murdered the girl he loved and the only one who was ever kind to him. Harry suddenly does not wan t him to die. LIke Luke not wanting Vader to die at the end of ROTJ. And we find out later that Snape's sacrifice was in vain b/c it was not enogh,it only weakened Voldemort but not fatally.


Yes, I'm in the "Harry will die" camp. On Mugglenet.com, the big HP site, there was an interview with JO (VERY FUNNY!) posted where she talked aobut writng the last chapters of the book. One of the last chapters, she started "howling") and got drunk on a bottle of champagne at the hotel mini-bar and staggered home with mascara running down her face, still crying. What could have set that off? Killing Draco or Hagrid?I don't think so! She also said Book 7 was going to be "a bloodbath" but then tooit back. HA HA. . That gave it all away!
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Old 07-11-2007, 06:08 PM   #63
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Quote:
Originally posted by Teta040
I don't believe this. I started an HP thread THREE days ago in anticipation of the book and the film, and nobody bothered to reply to it--and it's still up there close to the top. Just because I don't frequent this part of the site (I post in Free Your Mind). I spent a CONSIDERABLE amount of time posting, sharing my experiences as a staff member at a bookstore doing the book parties for Books 4 and 5, my thoughts on seeing the series end, HP's place as a work of literature, my experiences seeing the origional Star Wars series in the theater as a kid in 1977-83, and comparing that to the HP book releases, and my predictions for Book 7.

And nobody really bothered to reply. I was so excited and wanted to know what you thought. If you go check my thread, "For Harry Potter Fans", you'll see what I mean. It's a VERY long post. But I guess I'm a stranger here and I'm not important. Sorry to be such a grouch but I'm too tired to post all that again. Sorry I wasted my breath.



Dude, get a grip. If you had taken thirty seconds off the hour you took to write your thread, you would have found this thread. It's never been further back than the first or second page, so it's not like you'd have to search hard. Or you might have noticed the three threads dedicated to the movie on the first two or three pages of the Zoo Station section of the forum.

It's all fine to be "new" and not know the structure of a forum (i.e., your movie review belongs in the Zoo Station thread), and to be disappointed that no one replied to your thread....but it's something different entirely to get insanely pissed off at people who decide to post in an already-established thread.

Honestly, I wouldn't even be replying to this post if you didn't act like somebody had killed your firstborn child.


Anyway, thanks for your thoughts. Harry Potter rules.
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Old 07-11-2007, 06:10 PM   #64
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Alfonso Cuaron set the new standard for making Harry Potter films, btw.
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Old 07-11-2007, 06:16 PM   #65
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Originally posted by LemonMacPhisto
Alfonso Cuaron set the new standard for making Harry Potter films, btw.

Absolutely. I'm seeing 5 tonight and I'm psyched. Not having seen it yet, however, Azkaban is by far the best of the four.
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Old 07-11-2007, 06:29 PM   #66
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I can't even watch Sorcerer's Stone or Chamber of Secrets anymore, they're nothing to shake a stick at.

Azkaban isn't just a great Harry Potter film, but a great film period.
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Old 07-11-2007, 06:38 PM   #67
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Emma Watson shines in Azkaban. I love when she says, "You're dying.....both of you." In Goblet, she, like Dumbledore, were made to be too over-the-top and underappreciated. I think she's the best actor of the three....I'm hoping she shines again in 5.
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Old 07-11-2007, 06:43 PM   #68
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Me too, she's my favorite of the kid actors.

I still don't buy Michael Gambon as Dumbledore, especially when he manhandles Harry during one scene in HP4. That really bothered me.

This is probably too far fetched, but Peter O'Toole could've been great as Dumbledore 2.0.
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Old 07-11-2007, 06:54 PM   #69
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Quote:
Originally posted by Teta040
I guess I'm a stranger here and I'm not important. Sorry to be such a grouch but I'm too tired to post all that again. Sorry I wasted my breath.

For that, before I get my two Sickles in this thread, (*I* don't care about replying in a thread started by people I don't know).


ok....as the person who started this thread I don't take kindly to the way you make it sound as if I've turned anyone against you. Get a grip. It's not like I've gone through threads and said not to post in your thread, so chill out.

It's definetly NOT my fault that people in another part of the forum didn't respond to your thread, nor is it anyone else's fault in this thread, so stop playing a victim to something that's no ones fault.

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Old 07-11-2007, 06:58 PM   #70
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Quote:
Originally posted by LemonMacPhisto
I can't even watch Sorcerer's Stone or Chamber of Secrets anymore, they're nothing to shake a stick at.

Azkaban isn't just a great Harry Potter film, but a great film period.
I totally agree especially with that last part. I thought this whole time that I was crazy to think that was the best so far. (well....I've not seen OOTP yet, so we'll see.

anyway......doesnt anyone find it sort of strange that Wormtail and Snape are found together at the same cottage at the beginning of HBP? I've been waiting for someone to bring that up...but it just seems strange to me.

That and....what if maybe Dumbeldore made Fawk's a horcrux. Did I say that already? hmmm...I dont think so....anyway it's just a thought I had. Maybe he really is living through Fawks now.


and sorry for my little rant above
but I don't like being made to feel that I did something wrong when I started this thread a few weeks ago and his was only started 3 DAYS ago.
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Old 07-11-2007, 08:17 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally posted by LemonMacPhisto

This is probably too far fetched, but Peter O'Toole could've been great as Dumbledore 2.0.
Yes! He reminds me so of Richard Harris. I have never gotten used to Michael Gambon.

Or they could have just transferred Ian McKellen from LOTR to Harry Potter...
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Old 07-11-2007, 08:26 PM   #72
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She didn't touch on the mirrors in HBP, and I don't expect that they're gone forever.
Didn't Harry smash his mirror by throwing it inside his trunk at the end of OoTP, when he realized it wasn't working? Or maybe I just shouldn't read when I'm almost asleep.
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Old 07-11-2007, 08:52 PM   #73
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Yes! He reminds me so of Richard Harris. I have never gotten used to Michael Gambon.

Or they could have just transferred Ian McKellen from LOTR to Harry Potter...
Christopher Lee's apparently on standby for any huge fantasy movie series, too.

If Alec Guinness were still alive, he'd be the perfect Dumbledore, too.
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Old 07-11-2007, 09:58 PM   #74
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After watching Film 5 yesterday and seeing the scene towards the end where Voldermort enters Harry's body and speaks through him (spooky green eyes and all), Iwas thinking that Book 7 will have that happen again to a much larger extent, and then Harry's 'followers' will have to face the prospect of having to destroy Voldermort by killing Harry as well.... yikes....

Undoubtedly there is a connection between Harry and Neville - I like the idea that the prediction is really about Neville and that Harry is kind of like a 'decoy' (and a pretty damn good one at that!) for Neville to assume the true prophecy.

Perhaps Harry's scar is a Horcrux??? Apparently the very last word in Book 7 is "scar" ....

And yes, us lucky Aussies get the book at 9 am on Saturday morning, so we have the entire weekend to digest it, but I thought that it was being released simultaneously around the world? It doesn't seem fair if it isn't. I won't divulge anything before others have had a chance to read, though. I'm a 6th grade teacher and may have to be "sick" on Monday if I haven't finished it, as my students will surely read the final chapter and spoil it for me!

I honestly can't wait... I haven't been gripped by a suspence and apprehension like this for years!!
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Old 07-11-2007, 11:16 PM   #75
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Didn't Harry smash his mirror by throwing it inside his trunk at the end of OoTP, when he realized it wasn't working? Or maybe I just shouldn't read when I'm almost asleep.
True---I'd forgotten that. I still wonder, though, if they may come into play somehow.


Just saw the movie, and I now have these two predictions based on the film (assuming that JKR had these moments put in, which it did seem to me):

1). Sirius WILL be back. Harry's last conversation with Luna was different & I think significantly so. In the book, she's posting signs for her stolen stuff, says it'll come back in the end; she then talks about how her dead mom's still around because of the voices behind the curtain (through which Sirius dies). In the movie, she says something along the lines of "Sorry about your godfather..."......and a bit later, something like, "The things we lose always seem to come back to us in the end, just not in the way we expect them," and it pans to a shot of her shoes hanging from the ceiling. The way they scripted that bit of the conversation, it seemed to be a pretty heavy metaphor for Sirius. Somehow, the lost Sirius will come back to Harry, but not in the way Harry expects. Perhaps as a ghost (as he seems to turn into a ghost in the film instead of falling behind the curtain)?

2). I am deathly afraid that Ron and Hermione are going to die. I had never really put any support into this theory in the past, but now I'm worried. In the book when Voldemort possesses Harry, Harry thinks of the love of his parents & Voldie leaves him. In the movie, Harry thinks of his friends. He tells Voldemort how he pities him because he'll never know friendship and love. Voldemort leaves him & says the "You will lose everything" line. JKR originally said she was killing two people in the 7th book; more recently, I've heard her say she's killing three. The placement of all the friend stuff and the "lose everything" line in the film makes me worry that Harry will indeed lose Ron & Hermione. I still don't really buy it----I still say it's going to be Voldemort plus any of Wormtail/Snape/Hagrid/Harry/Fred or George/anyone else , but I'm a little more worried than I had been......
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