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Old 02-04-2007, 11:31 PM   #226
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Old 02-04-2007, 11:40 PM   #227
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Bissel Kitty Half Time Show (Animal Planet)

http://animal.discovery.com/beyond/?...bclid=36994943

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Old 02-04-2007, 11:41 PM   #228
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Old 02-04-2007, 11:47 PM   #229
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Originally posted by Liesje
OK so help me out here. Why are the UK and US almost opposite when it comes to the indoor/outdoor debate? Here, you cannot adopt a cat if you have outdoor cats or would let the cat outdoors. In this city, roaming cats are a violation of leash laws and the owners are fined. I've heard that in the UK, you have to have a yard for the cat so it can go outside or you can't adopt one.

What's up with this? Who is right?
Don't know about the US/UK thing - but here in Australia, at least where i live there are no rules about cats not being allowed outside - every now and then the local council brings it up, but the debate only ever lasts about 5 minutes and is forgotten again.
As for my 2 - they would go INSANE (Columbus in particular) if he had to stay in all day - he's gone outside since he was only a couple of months old. I hope they don't bring in laws saying you have to keep your cat in - i think that would be horrendously unfair to cats who have always spent time outside!
Personally, I think that well looked after cats don't stray anyhow - I know the furthest my 2 ever go is the house across the street, or next door, where there are cats too - they have no reason to stray any further than that, and 99% of the time they both just hang out in our front yard
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Old 02-05-2007, 02:19 PM   #230
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Originally posted by Liesje
OK so help me out here. Why are the UK and US almost opposite when it comes to the indoor/outdoor debate? Here, you cannot adopt a cat if you have outdoor cats or would let the cat outdoors. In this city, roaming cats are a violation of leash laws and the owners are fined. I've heard that in the UK, you have to have a yard for the cat so it can go outside or you can't adopt one.

What's up with this? Who is right?
I'm not sure about the UK, but in Holland it's normal to let your cat outside, and I"m sure mine would turn crazy if she had to stay in all day!
she's a bit odd tho, in the morning, she usually goes outside to drink rain water, and then goes back in ... no matter how often I clean her water inside, she always prefers the rain water!

I loved your pic of Posh in the laundry basket btw... perfect fit!
Miep lately sleeps on the tablecloths draped over a bookcase, which she is doing right now...
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Old 02-05-2007, 02:42 PM   #231
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Bissel Kitty Half Time Show (Animal Planet)

http://animal.discovery.com/beyond/?...bclid=36994943


I loved that.

The Puppy Bowl was pretty cute, too.
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Old 02-05-2007, 07:38 PM   #232
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Don't know about the US/UK thing - but here in Australia, at least where i live there are no rules about cats not being allowed outside - every now and then the local council brings it up, but the debate only ever lasts about 5 minutes and is forgotten again.
As for my 2 - they would go INSANE (Columbus in particular) if he had to stay in all day - he's gone outside since he was only a couple of months old. I hope they don't bring in laws saying you have to keep your cat in - i think that would be horrendously unfair to cats who have always spent time outside!
Personally, I think that well looked after cats don't stray anyhow - I know the furthest my 2 ever go is the house across the street, or next door, where there are cats too - they have no reason to stray any further than that, and 99% of the time they both just hang out in our front yard
Yeah, I'm wondering what accounts for the huge differences in opinion? I'm not going to say either is right or wrong. It came up on another board where we were talking about cats. A girl from Germany said she's never taken her cats to the vet and doesn't think that is odd. Here, this would be considered neglect for several reasons: 1) an outdoor cat that is not harnessed or secured in an enclosure is a violation of leash laws, 2) in this area, rabies vaccinations are required, thus the cat HAS to see a vet minimum once every three years, 3) not seeking routine medical care and prevention can be considered misdemeanor or felony animal cruelty depending on where you live and what kind of shape the animals are in.

I'm just wondering if there are compelling reasons why a cat needs to be outdoors. We've had 7 cats in the past two years, three of which were feral outdoor cats before we got them (Maximus, Keena, and Eden). None of them ever went crazy or acted out because they were confined. On the contrary, all three developed into very content lap cats. One of them (Eden) died because of infections and a fatal disease she contracted from being allowed outside. It's a disease with no good vaccination and is ultimately fatal. Another still likes to go out on occasion, but he is harness trained and supervised.

I think the problem is people never consider what is the right way to care for an indoor cat - they have to have scratching posts, perches, and toys so that they can act like cats while they're indoors. Just like dogs, they need exercise and stimulation from people playmates.

Personally, I can't find any concrete evidence, either in my experiences or scientifically, that proves that keeping cats indoors or training them to be indoor cats is mean/drives them crazy. Maybe others can add some insight?
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Old 02-05-2007, 08:06 PM   #233
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I think some of it might be just the personality of the individual cat. I've only ever had indoor cats. We had one that always wanted to escape to go outside. We'd have to watch the door when going out to make sure he didn't sneak out (although the furthest he'd ever get was under a car in the carport).

Worf's never had any interest in even trying to get outside. You could leave the door wide open and all she would do is sniff at the air .

I know that there are 3 outside cats in our neighborhood that are pets (I'm not sure how feral they are, but I know that they "belong" to people and are fed kitty food). I guess there isn't a leash law for cats where we live (there is one for dogs though).
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Old 02-06-2007, 01:29 AM   #234
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Some more pics of a few of my cats.

Miss Myrrh. She's little but kinda chunky. And she doesn't put up with any shit from anyone!



Oscar on the left and Rickenbacker Straticaticus (Ricky) on the right. They look like best buddies.



Ricky and Alex (of the blocked urinary tract fame). Just like two peas in a pod. You can see the shaved part on Alex's leg where he had his IV. Alex also tends to like to stick his tongue out a bit.

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Old 02-06-2007, 01:33 AM   #235
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Old 02-06-2007, 05:57 AM   #236
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I'll add my bit to the indoor/outdoor discussion.

I like my cats to be able to go outside, at least for a few hours most days. And for most of my life (until about 18 months ago), I lived in an area where they could do just that very comfortably and safely. It was a rural area and we lived well back (800-900 ft at least) from the lightly traveled gravel (and then tar & chip) back road. There weren't many people around and our dogs kept other dogs and other predators mostly off the property.

Not all my cats wanted to go back outside once they got in the house (all were strays and all but one were adults when I got them), and there were a couple I could never get to be comfortable inside. The ones outside had a barn they could go into or they could hang out on the porch (which was quite large and deep). I made them little houses on the porch which had nice fleece beds and I had a microwaveable heat disk I would warm for them every night for each cat.

Most of the cats would be in the house at night as I figured they would get into more trouble outside at night and then could go outside in the morning. Oscar loved to hang out in the fields and hunt all day. Alex liked to hunt too, but he wasn't as obsessed with it. Some of the older cats (like Max and Loki) loved to go out and sleep in the sun, or on very hot days, under the forsythia bushes. They were very happy, contented cats.

I moved to a urban area about 18 months ago and I can't let my cats out here (Max and Mitzi -- my two oldest -- on rare occasions when they are closely watched can wander around the back yard for a little while. They can't really move very fast, so they aren't going to dash off and we watch them the whole time). These cats grew up in the country -- they aren't wary enough to go out here. I doubt I'd let them out anyway as we are close to a pretty heavily traveled road and cars just move too fast on that street. Plus with more people about there is more chance that they could encounter people who aren't nice to cats, and I don't want that either.

It's been quite an adjustment for the cats that were used to going out every day though and I think many still pine for the outdoors. All of the cats (except Max who has hyperthyroid problems) who used to go outdoors, even just to sleep in the sun, have gained weight since we've moved. The house is pretty good sized and they are allowed free roam of it most of the time (and they tear aound like crazy cats in the middle of the night), but that can't compare to being able to run around in fields and woods and up big trees and such. The lack of exercise and eating from boredom is an issue.

If I was in an area where I could let the ones that want out safely, I certainly would. I think it can make for much happier cats, especially for the one which are used to that freedom.
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Old 02-06-2007, 10:57 AM   #237
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Quote:
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LOL I love this one


As for the indoor/outdoor debate. I am one that feels cats should be kept indoors. Especially if you get them as kittens or young kitties, they will never know the difference if you keep them inside and they can lead perfectly happy, healthy and SAFER lives inside. Once you let them out once or twice, they will always want to go out. My guys have no desire to go outside.

However, I do understand the other side of the fence, if you live in a big country or rural area and the cats are already used to going outside, it can be a big adjustment to start keeping them indoors. And I can see how they would love to run around in the fields and whatnot. I also live in the city though and would never ever let mine outside. I've seen too many of my feral cats dead in the street.
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Old 02-06-2007, 07:40 PM   #238
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I have a orange and white tabby female. Her name is Dewey.
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Old 02-06-2007, 07:49 PM   #239
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Cruzila -- I love that you have a cat named Erskine!

So many cute cats in here I just want to squeeze them all!
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Old 02-06-2007, 08:07 PM   #240
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Cool pics!
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