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Old 03-19-2007, 10:03 PM   #31
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Big Red


Good for about 8 minutes of , then crap.
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Old 03-19-2007, 10:09 PM   #32
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That's a huge list. I am sorry for all the animals that might get sick from this I can't believe Iams and Eukanaba and some of the bigger more expensive brands are made by the same company that makes all the off brand stuff. Makes you wonder if the off brand stuff is better than you think or the expensive ones worse?? My cats will only eat Friskies, wet and dry, so that's one thing that's not on the list.

Even so Bono had kidney trouble a few weeks ago. The vet (one I don't usually go to) said his kidneys were huge and he thought he was going to die. He didn't even want to give him medicine until I asked for it. I also gave him Pet-tonic. He was real run down and skinny for about 4 days then he started perking up. Now he's healthier than ever. I don't know what it was or what caused it.
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Old 03-19-2007, 10:24 PM   #33
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That's a huge list. I am sorry for all the animals that might get sick from this I can't believe Iams and Eukanaba and some of the bigger more expensive brands are made by the same company that makes all the off brand stuff. Makes you wonder if the off brand stuff is better than you think or the expensive ones worse?? My cats will only eat Friskies, wet and dry, so that's one thing that's not on the list.

Even so Bono had kidney trouble a few weeks ago. The vet (one I don't usually go to) said his kidneys were huge and he thought he was going to die. He didn't even want to give him medicine until I asked for it. I also gave him Pet-tonic. He was real run down and skinny for about 4 days then he started perking up. Now he's healthier than ever. I don't know what it was or what caused it.

Thank God!
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Old 03-19-2007, 10:31 PM   #34
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we got calls all day about this
luckily we don't carry any of the recalled brands
but regardless every client of course said
"my pet is drinking more"
hmmm... and the fact that they're actually monitoring it's water intake...and the fact that it's been over 80 degrees last week never seems to cross their mind.
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Old 03-19-2007, 10:34 PM   #35
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Whew neither of the brands I feed my dog are on the lists, Pedigree Little Champions pouch or Cesar Canine.

Sad tho really, what a waste of an awful lot of product! I hope no more pets get sick from this.
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Old 03-19-2007, 10:42 PM   #36
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I was surprised to learn how many dog owners do prepare their dog's food. I can't even prepare healthy food for myself, so I'd probably kill a dog, but there are many who do. I imagine it takes some time and consultations with the vet to determine the right balance for the particular dog, but it can only make the dog healthier.
I'm sure you'd do just fine...just hold back on the Kraft Mac n' Cheese

It's actually a great idea to do a consultation like you mention. My Mom's German Sheppard could be a good example of doing this. For the first few years of her life, she was constantly having seizures. On top of that, she was an extremely picky eater, and consequently, underweight for a dog her size. After a chat with a vet, we put her on a tuna and rice diet...along with some carrots mixed in, from what I recall. Almost immediately, the number of seizures diminished, and her weight went up. She's very healthy today; she has a more 'normal' dog diet now, but I think mom still mixes in things to increase the nutritional value.

Diet really does make a difference, and maybe especially so in an animal's first years, or when their health is compromised by illness.
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Old 03-20-2007, 02:21 PM   #37
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Something else to be very careful about if you have a dog

By Sharon L. Peters, Special for USA TODAY

A sugar substitute found in a variety of sugar-free and dietetic cookies, mints and chewing gum is proving highly toxic, even fatal, to snack-snatching dogs.

Xylitol, popular in Europe for decades but a relative newcomer to the U.S. alternative-sweeteners market, can be "very, very serious" to dogs when ingested, says Dana Farbman, spokeswoman for the Animal Poison Control Center of the American Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals.

"It doesn't take a whole lot (of xylitol), and the effects are so rapid that the window of opportunity to treat the dog is extremely small," Farbman says.

The ASPCA sent an advisory to veterinarians last August warning them about the potential for serious harm or death. Veterinarians have used a variety of means to get the word out, including posting signs in their offices and making copies of the bulletin for clients to augment the caution the ASPCA has posted on its website.


Concerned that millions of people are still unaware of the risk, veterinarians with forums for widespread public announcements are spreading the word that way as well. Among them: Miami veterinarian Patty Khuly wrote about the problem on her doolittler.com blog, and Colorado Springs veterinarian Anne Pierce devoted her entire weekly newspaper column a week ago to xylitol.

Within 30 minutes of consuming a small amount of a xylitol-sweetened product, the ASPCA says, dogs can experience a dramatic drop in blood sugar, and they usually begin vomiting, become lethargic and can have difficulty standing or walking. Some have seizures, develop internal hemorrhaging and lesions and suffer liver failure. As few as two or three sticks of xylitol gum could be toxic to a 20-pound dog, the ASPCA says.

Immediate and aggressive veterinary treatment, which includes glucose drips and IV fluids, has proved effective in many cases.

The ASPCA's poison control unit is aware of 10 dog deaths from xylitol since 2002, and it has received scores of reports of dogs becoming gravely ill. But only a fraction of veterinarians and consumers alert the ASPCA when a dog becomes ill or dies from toxins, and there is no national clearinghouse tracking xylitol-suspected toxic reactions.

Moreover, it's not always entirely clear what caused the problem when a dog arrives at a veterinarian's office with seizures or liver failure. "I suspect that there are more cases than we know about because they come in with liver failure, and the owner is not aware of what has been ingested," Pierce says.

She believes that xylitol ingestion is "an emerging problem" and that the number of cases probably will increase with time, "depending on how widespread xylitol as a sweetener becomes."

Xylitol is an all-natural sugar substitute derived from beets, birch tree bark, corncobs and other natural sources. It's as sweet as sugar but has 40% fewer calories. Unlike sugar, xylitol does not require insulin to be metabolized.

Right now, xylitol is used mostly in cookies, candies, cupcakes and other sweets developed for people who have diabetes. It's also sold in bags of crystals for baking. Because of its bacteria-killing properties, it is put into some oral care products, including Tom's All Natural and Biotene toothpastes.

It also is beginning to be used in a broad assortment of products intended for the general public. Among them: Jello sugar-free puddings and a wide variety of sugar-free gums, including Trident, Orbit, Stride, Icebreakers and Altoids.

Makers of products with xylitol say their products are designed for people, including diabetes patients, who are seeking an alternative to sugar; they were never recommended for dogs and were never intended to be ingested by dogs. Owners should be careful because some dogs, Khuly says, "get into just about everything and eat everything they find."

There is no indication that any of the other sweeteners on the market adversely affect dogs. And there is no evidence so far that xylitol is toxic to pets other than dogs. But cats, for example, don't scavenge for sweets as dogs do, so it's possible there are risks that have not yet been discovered. For now, veterinarians advise pet owners to keep xylitol away from all animals.
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Old 03-20-2007, 03:44 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally posted by angelordevil



It's actually a great idea to do a consultation like you mention. My Mom's German Sheppard could be a good example of doing this. For the first few years of her life, she was constantly having seizures. On top of that, she was an extremely picky eater, and consequently, underweight for a dog her size. After a chat with a vet, we put her on a tuna and rice diet...along with some carrots mixed in, from what I recall. Almost immediately, the number of seizures diminished, and her weight went up. She's very healthy today; she has a more 'normal' dog diet now, but I think mom still mixes in things to increase the nutritional value.

Diet really does make a difference, and maybe especially so in an animal's first years, or when their health is compromised by illness.


And German Shepherds often respond really well to home cooked diets, given their size, coats, and energy levels.


What's interesting to me is on a dog forum I go to, this recall has produced several threads in various subforums where people are now debating various pet foods. The recall has put everyone on edge and buttons are definitely being pushed! Most of the foods on this recall list are no where near premium or super premium quality foods and are basically junk food for dogs, lacking what is essential and containing too many by-products that are unnecessary or don't really get used by the dog's body. As a general rule, any pet food you can easily find at supermarkets and Petsmart are not premium (there are a few exceptions). A dog can be "healthy" on cheaper foods, but consult a vet about changing to a more premium quality or homecooked, give it a try, and soon you can see the difference just in the quality of their coats and the amount of shedding what a good diet can do for a dog (of any size or breed).
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Old 03-20-2007, 03:47 PM   #39
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I don't think I will be mixing the wet dog food with the dry anymore even though it wasn't on the list of foods. It still make me nervous and my dog is only 1. Last night I mixed in peas and turkey and he loved it.

Maybe its my cooked leftovers from now on. Honestly, I don't know what to do I want to do the right thing.
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Old 03-20-2007, 04:11 PM   #40
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I don't think I will be mixing the wet dog food with the dry anymore even though it wasn't on the list of foods. It still make me nervous and my dog is only 1. Last night I mixed in peas and turkey and he loved it.

Maybe its my cooked leftovers from now on. Honestly, I don't know what to do I want to do the right thing.
I don't have a dog right now, so I'm not up on dog food, but this has good info:

http://www.dogfoodproject.com/index....e=labelinfo101

Nutro is a decent mid-grade food, if you can't find or can't afford premiums, but I think it was part of the recall. I've been told many times that the best dog foods are usually sold in smaller shops (run by pet owners, not big chains like Petsmart) or feed/stock/tack stores.

Some others I've heard are good (maybe not super premium, but better than your supermarket kibble) are Innova, Natural Balance, Eagle Pack, Blue Buffalo, Canidae, Chicken Soup, Timberwolf.

If you are already supplementing his food with home ingredients (like the turkey and peas), that's really good. It's very healthy for the dog as long as it's not too much in addition to his food, but replacing some of it.

The two no-nos that I'm aware of are Purina and mostly Pedigree (which is ironic considering their partnership with the AKC). Those are like having fries and shake every day. You'll feel full/satisfied and aren't going to drop dead, but eventually you will get fat and it will catch up to you...
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Old 03-20-2007, 04:50 PM   #41
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I've tried Innova, Merrick, and Wellness and they gave him well you know the big D.
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Old 03-20-2007, 05:24 PM   #42
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I've tried Innova, Merrick, and Wellness and they gave him well you know the big D.
Yeah, I've read that about Innova, unfortunately. Based on the current threads surrounding the recall, it seems like the consensus is that Canidae and Chicken Soup are the best starting point as far as good dog brands. Like I said, I don't have a dog so I can't vouch for any of them. I don't remember what kibble we use for my uncle's dog, but she also gets human foods.

In the end, whatever works is what will work. My cats (particularly the one with the sensitive stomach) have responded better to mid-grade foods. Sure I'd like to give them something better, but Beckham barfs and they all get diarrhea. Also, since I don't free-fed, the cats are very unhappy unless they have a sense of being full. The mid-grade/less dense food allows me to give them a bit more. If they don't feel "full" they will howl miserably for hours. It's not that it inconveniences me, but I hate to see them just howling nonstop and not doing cat things like playing and sleeping. Right now they're getting a mix of three different brands and it seems to be the best compromise between quality, no barf or diarrhea, and happy cats.
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Old 03-20-2007, 08:11 PM   #43
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I know what you mean about being happy, Riley used cry because he must have had stomach cramps and when I rubbed his belly it seemed to help. If its not the kids it's the dog!
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Old 03-21-2007, 10:38 PM   #44
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Some good information here...

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This is the most up to date info I could find on the details of the pet food recall from a veterinary website,Veterinary Information Network.

* Friday March 16, 2007: large pet food recall announced by Menu Foods: http://www.menufoods.com/recall/
Recall PDF
Canine Products PDF
Feline Products PDF
* Thus far the only information on the FDA website can be found here.
* While no further concrete information was forthcoming, VINners shared information on:
o News reports and personal experiences/opinions
o Reports of suspected cases seen
o Reports of states affected – all indications are that this is a national/international issue

After speaking with many colleagues, we have begun to piece together the chronology and facts known. All VINners should remember that we are in the period of CONFUSION associated with any crisis. Historically, information collected and distributed during the early phases of any crisis proves to be partially or totally wrong. Therefore caution should be exercised when examining such information. VIN has attempted to provide the most accurate information available, and will continue to update this information as new evidence comes to light. The questions and answers, as we understand them, are:

Q: Why are so many different brands of pet food affected?
A: Menu Foods manufactures "cuts and gravy” type dog and cat foods for many brand name and private label pet food lines, including several companies VINners believed produced all of their own foods at their own facilities. The explanation provided by VINners familiar with the pet food industry is that the equipment needed to manufacture these foods is very specialized and that Menu Foods manufactures the foods to the specifications of each individual company using ingredients specified and, in many cases, provided by the company contracting with Menu Foods.

Q: Which foods are affected by the recall?
A: Only canned and pouch foods appear to be affected. Dry foods are not manufactured by the same process, and are manufactured at different facilities. There is no indication that dry foods are affected. The recall is restricted to canned and pouch foods.
Specific dog foods affected.
Specific cat foods affected.

Q: When was the problem first noticed?
A: There are conflicting answers to this question.
The version we've heard most consistently is that at the end of February, a new flavored pet food produced by Menu Foods, for an undisclosed company, was undergoing feeding trials and several cats in the feeding trial developed renal failure.

Q: Why was the recall not initiated at that time?
A: Since the renal failure was observed only in cats on the as-yet-unreleased trial diet, Menu Foods believed this "problem” was isolated to that single new food that was not yet on the market. This food was withdrawn from further testing and never marketed. There was no indication at that time of a more generalized issue.

Q: Why did it take another month for the problem to recognized and reported to the FDA and the recall initiated?
A: The details of this timeline are sketchy. One scenario that seems plausible is that the wheat gluten suspected of being the source of the offending agent did not enter the manufacturing process until December and that it takes up to three months for pet food to reach store shelves after manufacture. This explains the lag time between initial detection in the laboratory setting and the general population.
This timeline is contradicted by information provided in this Associated Press story that claims Menu Foods had reports of pet deaths in mid-February.

Q: What is known about the cause of the problem?
A: WE DO NOT KNOW THE CAUSE OF THE PROBLEM.
The cause at this stage remains unidentified. Substances that have been preliminarily ruled out include:

* ethylene glycol
* cholecalciferol
* other glycols, including diethylene glycol, propylene glycol, etc.
* heavy metals
* ochratoxin
* several solvents and cleaning products known to be used on the machinery used in the production of these foods
* several pesticides

Mycotoxins have not been ruled out, although preliminary testing failed to identify the presence of mycotoxins. However, some mycotoxins are extremely difficult to identify. Investigations are currently under way in an effort to identify a cause.

Q: Will a cause be identified?
A: While it is hoped that a cause will be identified soon, it is possible that no cause will be found, or the inciting agent will remain unidentified. Remember that we do not know why grapes or lilies are nephrotoxic and these have been studied for much longer.

Q: What is the basis of the implication of gluten as a cause?
A: Gluten is not nephrotoxic. However, Menu Foods observed that a new gluten source or batch was used in December, when the recalled food was manufactured. Thus, they suspected that the offending "agent” may be associated with this particular batch of gluten. However, without knowing the "toxin” involved, it may be difficult to definitively determine the source.

Q: What signs do affected animals show?
A: Colleagues at IAMS reported that the cats receiving the diet in laboratory settings demonstrated a severe and peracute reaction. Affected individuals often vomit soon (1-12 hours) after ingesting the food, some become anorectic and lethargic. Some salivate and have oral ulcerations. Weakness and hematuria has also been reported. Blood values for BUN/creatinine and phosphorus are greatly elevated (often requiring dilution of the sample to get a value). However, other colleagues are reporting confirmed exposure to the diet with a much wider spectrum of presentations where some individuals affected exhibit signs of mild renal insufficiency, developing after days or weeks, while others rapidly exhibit signs of acute renal failure.

Q: Are dogs and cats equally affected?
A: Currently, most clinical cases have been cats. However, several dogs have been reported as affected, and one dog has reportedly died after ingesting an implicated food. . Small breed dogs and cats are more likely to consume the types of foods implicated (canned, pouch foods), than large breed dogs, who are usually fed dry foods which cost less. Both cat foods and dog foods have been recalled.

Q: Is the toxicity dose-dependent?
A: We don't know. Without knowing the toxin involved, it's difficult to make generalizations. In feeding trials, only some of the animals exposed to the contaminated diet developed clinical problems. The determinants of susceptibility are unknown at this stage.

Q: How should affected individuals be treated?
A: Colleagues at IAMS have suggested that almost all the affected cats respond to standard supportive fluid therapy and recover, despite severe azotemia and uremia at the onset of treatment. This toxicity is not as uniformly lethal as ethylene glycol toxicity or the Diamond Pet Foods-associated aflatoxicosis that caused hepatic failure. Animals treated aggressively, even those with severe azotemia, appear to have a fair prognosis, based on the evidence to date.

Q: Which patients should have renal function tested?
A: There are no specific guidelines. Options include:

1. All patients who have consumed recalled foods (see list)
2. All patient who have eaten recalled foods and are showing clinical signs
3. All patients

Currently, it would seem reasonable to test all exposed patients. We do not at this time know how many of the recalled foods are truly a risk. We'd love to hear input on this question and all other aspects of this summary (see below).

Q: If I suspect I have a case, how should I proceed?
A: First of all, do not panic! Many cases of renal failure may be unrelated to any pet food consumption. Be sure to rule out other causes of acute renal failure (e.g. antifreeze poisoning, pyelonephritis, urolithiasis, acute-on-chronic decompensation). While this problem may be widespread, our clients require us to exercise clear and rational judgment. Unless more specific therapeutic recommendations are forthcoming as more is learned and more cases are treated, the most rational choice is to follow standard therapeutic strategies for acute renal failure. Some VIN resources on acute renal failure can be found here:

1. Associate chapter on Acute Renal failure
2. Lecture notes on Acute Renal Failure
3. Proceedings notes from BSAVA on Acute Renal Failure

Collect Information, so that subsequent studies may help determine the extent and nature of the problem. Collect data on diet history and, when possible, ask clients to bring a sample of the foods fed including a can or package with the product codes identifying the lots and date of manufacture. (How to read product codes)

Record the information and ask clients (to the extent possible), to keep unopened packages of food. If possible, store the fully identified (client, patient, etc) product for the client.

Do not repeat rumors, gossip or innuendo. This does not serve the public or our patients and clients. The reality of the current situation is that we do not know what the cause and extent of the problem is. If questioned by reporters, clients, or anyone, resist the temptation to speculate about or repeat information that you are not confident is accurate.

Advise clients to not feed any foods on the affected lists. If you have a client email list for your clients, alert them to the situation in a cautious and professional manner.

Share what you learn with your colleagues on the message board discussions listed at the beginning of this article. If you have breaking news or strong concerns about this or other information circulating that you want to disseminate rapidly
The saddest part of this whole thing is that the ingredient causing the problems isn't even the meat, just the crappy additives pets shouldn't be eating.
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Old 03-21-2007, 10:45 PM   #45
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Thanks for the information, I think it's so important to stay on top of this. My fear is that they will find more foods that have been contaminated and it will be what I've been feeding my dog.
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