Canada just got ROBBED!!!!

[The_Sweetest_Thing]

sula--finally! Someone besides me who remembers old figure skating...whoo hoo!
(I've got 94/98 on tep..I'm obsessed

)
For the record, Natalia Mishketonek and Artur Dimitriev WERE FANTASIC. I thought they even desrved the gold again in 1994. 'Course, I'd be hard to agree now that Sergei Grinkov is dead, so he and Gordeeva rank sentimental points. They were quite good as well though.

All these block judging problems....and we're surprised that this is happening now?

[This message has been edited by The_Sweetest_Thing (edited 02-12-2002).]

 

[Peaseblossom]

Glad I'm not the only one that feels so passionately about the crime that occured last night. But to look on the positive- the Canadians can now retire and make suitcases of money doing exhibition shows, while no one will want to have anything to do with the Russians. They were good too. Just not as magical as Canada.

 

[scatteroflight]

Originally posted by Peaseblossom:
Glad I'm not the only one that feels so passionately about the crime that occured last night. But to look on the positive- the Canadians can now retire and make suitcases of money doing exhibition shows, while no one will want to have anything to do with the Russians. They were good too. Just not as magical as Canada.

I dunno...I'm not sure no one will want to have anything to do with the Russians. They are still great skaters. It was hardly their fault, but they probably aren't feeling too great about how things turned out right now. I hope they aren't.

I wonder if Sale and Pelletier will retire? They could certainly go on for at least another year or two, I think. But something like this is pretty disheartening.



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Love was never a single emotion

-ACROB@T

 

[sulawesigirl4]

Originally posted by The_Sweetest_Thing:
sula--finally! Someone besides me who remembers old figure skating...whoo hoo!
(I've got 94/98 on tep..I'm obsessed

)
For the record, Natalia Mishketonek and Artur Dimitriev WERE FANTASIC. I thought they even desrved the gold again in 1994. 'Course, I'd be hard to agree now that Sergei Grinkov is dead, so he and Gordeeva rank sentimental points. They were quite good as well though.

All these block judging problems....and we're surprised that this is happening now?

gahhh! Finally someone else who agrees with me on that!

You are my new best friend. I was the ONLY one watching the 94 Games that thought Gordeeva and Grinkov deserved the silver and not the gold. In the end, I suppose it comes down to the whole "apples and oranges" thing because G&G's style was completely different than M&D. But give me emotional, flowing theatrical M&D over simplistic, classical G&G any day.

btw, I have the 92 and 94 Olympic figure skating on tape (but not Nagano because I was living at a college dorm and didn't have a VCR) and am taping these Olympics as well. *geek*

And no, I'm not surprised about the block judging...just disappointed. I thought that perhaps it would be a thing of the past.

It seems to me that a competition should be judged as to who is the best team/skater ON THAT PARTICULAR NIGHT. Not a reflection of who the judges think is the best overall. Conceivably, the Russian pair (not even going to TRY spelling their names. lol) is the better team, but last night they were not. And that is what the marks should reflect.

Anyways, nice to know I'm not the only skating freak around here.

-sula

 

[*Stormy*]

Originally posted by The_Sweetest_Thing:
sula--finally! Someone besides me who remembers old figure skating...whoo hoo

Me too, hey I have everything since the '84 Olympics on tape! Politics always comes into play and it makes me mad! I remember back in '84 my brother and my boyfriend rooted for Katarina Witt over USA's own Rosalynn Sumners because they said Rosaylnn's hair was too short and ugly and Katarina had long hair and a prettier dress, (especially when it flew up) It seems like they always rotate which 'bloc' the gold metal skater is from- 1976 Dorothy Hamill(US) 1980 Annet Poetch (old East Germany which was Communist then though USA's Linda Fratienne was better) then Katarina won 2 in a row, then you had Kristi Yamaguchi, then Oksana (unfairly over Nancy) then in '98 Tara Lipinski won. That's why I worry now for Michelle Kwan, because an American won last time, they will likely try to give it to an old 'eastern bloc' girl this time. I am not predicting but I will not be surprised if she is robbed as well. Maybe not though, it is her home field and with all the patriotism it would be a good story, plus I'm sure no other US skaters will be medaling.

Good luck tonight to Elvis, I hope he finally gets his gold.

I too am SO happy to find other skating freaks to talk to, this Olympics is going to be fun! Just this morning I was afraid I'd start a skating thread and it would drop with no responses. Thanks to all you who want to discuss skating, we can do this after every event now.

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"I was born a MacPhisto"

[This message has been edited by *Stormy* (edited 02-12-2002).]

 

[sulawesigirl4]

*sigh* Yeah, it was sad to watch the KING place so low last night. Another deduction for Elvis might have come on his footwork into triple lutz sequence. He held an edge for long enough before the jump that the judges may have marked off for that. Still tho, I was pretty shocked at the 4.9.

I would have thought more like mid 5's. But then again, in my memory, the judges have never been overly fond of Elvis. That's what comes of skating to your own drum, I guess.

I do think of the two Russian guys, I prefer Yagudin over Plushenko...and I would be surprised if he doesn't walk away with the gold. Great to see Goebel do so well tho, hey? That kid can jump! And what a huuuuuge grin. lol.

My guess...Yagudin wins the gold, Goebel or Honda flip out under the pressure and miss some jumps leaving it open for Plushenko to get on the stand somehow probably with a bronze. Also Abt could prove to be the dark horse if any of the guys in the top 3 fumble.

I miss Victor Petrinko.

 

[Mrs. Edge]

I LOVE Yagudin.

 

[jezebel]

wow, sula, you should be a judge

very impressed by your knowledge!

I have to admit, all three Russian skaters are very good and have loads of personality in their skating.....plus they are all so cute

I really, really liked the snowboarders!!!!

 

[sulawesigirl4]

lol jez. Strangely enough that's what one of my friends who is herself a figure skater has told me.

But alas, I am only an armchair analyst and besides...what would I do without Scott Hamilton?

kobesan brought these cartoons to my attention...thought you all might find them amusing too.

 

[*Stormy*]

I just heard on the nightly news that there will officially be an investigation into the alleged fixing, and that the Canadian Olympic team will ask that a duplicate gold be given to their team. An American referee reported that he heard the French judge was voting for the Russians in exchange for a vote for the French Ice Dance team. It is now a scandal. I'm glad the shit hit the fan. If you just sit there and take it, nothing will ever improve. Someone needs to make a stand! As the Who and Twisted Sister would say, 'we're not gonna take it!'

------------------
"I was born a MacPhisto"

 

[The_Sweetest_Thing]

I heard the same Stormy. I hope the Cdn. Team DOES ask for a gold..*sigh*

Life was so much easier w/ Kurt Browning.

 

[IvanClaytonJnr]

So much for so little ... Common people it's over , judges always helped USA and canada , time for others

, see no big deal

 

[sulawesigirl4]

Originally posted by IvanClaytonJnr:
So much for so little ... Common people it's over , judges always helped USA and canada , time for others

, see no big deal

uh-huh. You obviously have never watched a single figure skating competition in your life.

 

[anitram]

I think we've all mourned, but that Canadians need to now redirect their energy. We have a legend on the ice in the form of Catriona LeMay Doan who broke the Olympic record tonight, and quite possibly may break the world record (her own!

) tomorrow. She's won 17 of 18 races in the 500m and holds the 8th fastest times in the 500m ever. She's a wonderful representative of our country, the best ambassador for her sport, and let's all watch our O Canada hopefully to be played tomorrow.

Good luck!

[This message has been edited by anitram (edited 02-13-2002).]

 

[scatteroflight]

I heard about the investigation too...and whatever the end result, I just think it's so sad that a great competition with such great skating generally all around--even some of the flawed performances by not so good pairs were great to watch--should end up with all this ugliness. Because I think that mainly it's going to be remembered as a really ugly incident.

The reality of the Olympics always ends up being so far from all those ideals everyone claims to espouse at the opening ceremonies. Even if it's the fault of only a relatively small number of people, it's the truth.



------------------
Love was never a single emotion

-ACROB@T

 

[PopFly]

I'm a pro wrestling fan, and so it bugs me when people say they don't like wrestling because "It's fixed." Oh yeah? Take a look at figure skating.

The stuff about the ice-dancing conspiracy is interesting, and it will result in boffo ratings. If the judges actually vote the top five the way that it's been predicted to go, they will look like the biggest fools on earth and set themselves up for investigation.

------------------
"You gotta love living, baby, 'cause dyin's a pain in the ass."-- Frank Sinatra

Adam: Look guys, I got a Springfield spoon for my spoon collection.
Edge: Oh boy, here we go...
Bono: Wow, how many is that now Adam?
Adam: Nine. If I didn't have my spoons, I'd go insane.
Bono: Can I see it?
*adam gives bono the spoon, bono throws it away*
Adam: My spoon!

 

[The Blunt Edge]

Well, I'll probably get in trouble for this, but I see figure skating to be judged not by how well you perform the athletic requirements such as jumping, spinning, footwork, etc., but by how well you wave your arms in the air, smile and grin like an idiot, and wear the most ridiculous looking puffy shirt in the closet. These guys are athletes, no doubt, but if the "artistic merit" (read: arm waving) is a bigger factor than doing a jump better than the next guy, I have trouble calling it a "sport".

As for the judging, it's happened before, and it'll happen agian until something serious happens. Don't just ban the judge for a year, ban 'em for life. Game over. Furthermore, teh country from which the judge is from should also be banned from sending judges to international events since the judge is ultimately responsible to that country's federation. And the ban should be one with teeth, something in the order of 5 years minimum so it'll really show that this "sport" has some credibility. If nothing else works, the IOC should drop all figure skating events from the Olympics (although this'll never happen since it generates tons of cash) until they get the judging in order.

That's just my humble opinion, and I'll get off my soap box now.

 

[*Stormy*]

SALT LAKE CITY, Feb. 14 ? France?s Olympic chief said the French figure skating judge was ?manipulated? into voting for the Russians in the pairs competition, and NBC News has learned that according to the referee, the judge felt pressure from her own figure skating federation. Sources within the investigation told NBC News that the referee said French figure skating judge Marie Reine Le Gougne revealed the information at a routine, post-competition judges? meeting Tuesday.

HOWEVER, DIDIER GAILHAGUET denied any wrongdoing on the part of the French skating federation in what has become the biggest story of the Winter Games.
?Some people close to the judge have acted badly and have put someone who is honest and upright, but emotionally fragile, under pressure,? Gailhaguet said of judge Marie-Reine Le Gougne. ?She is a fragile person and I think she has been somewhat manipulated.?

Astounded by the original admission, American referee Ronald Pfenning of the United States wrote to Ottavio Cinquanta, the president of the International Skating Union, to inform him of the possible cheating in the judging of the pairs final, NBC News learned from sources inside the investigation.

Meanwhile, in a highly unusual move, the International Olympic Committee told the figure skating union to quickly settle the judging dispute that has consumed the Winter Games for two days.
On Thursday, Cinquanta said the ISU would not alter its timetable for the investigation, however.
Questions of improper judging have centered on Le Gougne, one of five judges who favored the Russians despite the couple?s obvious technical error. Elena Berezhnaya and Anton Sikharulidze edged Canada?s Jamie Sale and David Pelletier 5-4 in the free skate Monday night.
?We cannot continue to let our judge be lambasted in this way,? Gailhaguet said. ?What is true is that Marie-Reine has been put under pressure, which pushed her to act in a certain way.
?We have no fear,? Gailhaguet said, speaking as president of the French skating federation. ?Contrary to the accusations, there was no collusion with the East European nations.?

 

[IvanClaytonJnr]

I still think medals should be not taken from Russians , after all thier program was excellent and it will be very unfair and bad thing to take it away from them . Judges must be punished , but not innocent sportmans .

 

[sulawesigirl4]

Originally posted by IvanClaytonJnr:
I still think medals should be not taken from Russians , after all thier program was excellent and it will be very unfair and bad thing to take it away from them . Judges must be punished , but not innocent sportmans .

Ivan, no one is proposing to take the medals away from the Russians. What IS being suggested is that if it is found that there was intentional collusion between the judges that Sale and Pelletier be awarded a second gold medal and that they would be co-champions with the Russian pair.

 

[IvanClaytonJnr]

Bullshit , it's a stupid hysteria to me , it's just one medal and besides Canada isn't good at this kind of sport , maybe this pair was good enough for Titanic , Oscar or Playboy but it's a pro/sport , but nooo all people acting like it's a Cold war era or something . Blah !

 

[anitram]

Originally posted by IvanClaytonJnr:
Bullshit , it's a stupid hysteria to me , it's just one medal and besides Canada isn't good at this kind of sport ,

This is typical Russian attitude of "We know skating and nobody else does. We don't care about world rankings, we are the best, we own, and we are entitled to the gold."

Saying that Canada "isn't good at this kind of sport" is both ridiculous and insulting, particularly in light of the fact that Sale and Pelletier, not Berezhnaya/Sikharulidze are world champions.

 

[The_Sweetest_Thing]

Originally posted by IvanClaytonJnr:
Bullshit , it's a stupid hysteria to me , it's just one medal and besides Canada isn't good at this kind of sport

Canada not good at figure skating?
Kurt Browning, Sonia Henie, Elvis Stojko, Brasseur and Eisler, Underhill/Martini, Bourne/Kraatz

All have an world, if not olympic medal under their belts...and there's more. I just can't name them all. Don't talk about sports if you don't understand them.

 

[sulawesigirl4]

Ivan, if you think that, then it's blatantly obvious that you have absolutely no clue about figure skating. Sale and Pelletier are the current world champions, so it's not a case of them not being "as good" as the Russians. It's potentially a case of corrupt judging, of judges trading marks with each other for other figure skating competitions, and THAT is wrong and unfair to the athletes. Canada isn't "whining", they are demanding fair play...something that is a cornerstone of the Olympics and of sport in general.

 

[IvanClaytonJnr]

Still , there is too much noise about this whole thing , gold medals are taken , and if canadians will receive another pair , now that's what i call unfair case . Thank god , today Hockey will start .

 

[The_Sweetest_Thing]

Originally posted by IvanClaytonJnr:
Still , there is too much noise about this whole thing , gold medals are taken , and if canadians will receive another pair , now that's what i call unfair case . Thank god , today Hockey will start .

There's noise b/c this has been happening for years in skating. This is the first time it's publicly been admitted that a mistake was made.
If you look at everyone's posts, we are saying that gold medals WILL NOT be taken. Canadians may receive a duplicate gold, that's all. Stop trying to pick a fight.