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Old 04-29-2002, 04:44 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally posted by kobayashi:
pat quinn is a great coach. he definetely has his drawbacks in that he can be ignorant and stubborn. but overall players generally enjoy playing for quinner. he made an honest and stupid mistake on two consecutive nights. one they won, the other they narrowly lost(though the reason why could be attributed to many, many factors ). leafs fans thank you for your opinion on what should happen to quinn. i for one am quite happy with him. though they are certainly not there soley because of quinn they wouldn't be there without him. i am a leafs fan. i like the guys that make up the team and will be disappointed when/if they get knocked out of the playoffs. MBH, i grew up with this team and my father taking me to maple leaf gardens on saturday nights to watch wendel clark and the very few other leaf greats of the time . obviously these experiences can cloud judgement but i feel i am able to sufficiently detach myself from such. corson, tucker, webb, peca. they are all on the same mission. they want the cup. they play playoff hockey which tends to be rough. if jonsson and peca hadn't gone down it might have been mccabe and mogilny. it is certainly unfortunate that this is the mindset with which the game is played as kenny jonsson will in all likelihood forever be shadowed by that hit.

the events, to me, are certainly not outstanding or unbelieveable. it sounds crude, but it happens in the playoffs.
I'm sorry if you found the capitalization rude or condescending. The frustration of losing 2 top players for a team that I follow passionately(attended 25+ games this yr. alone) got the best of me.

Your frequent mention of rough play, everyone hits in the NHL and your attitude that the events are not unbelievable or outstanding are not only inaccurate, but insulting. I acknowledged that Webb et al have performed some questionable and/or dirty plays and you could do the same. Ignorance and fans speaking w/their heart is a frustrating exercise. Objectivity is all but lost in sports.

As for Jonsson: the rule states that a player is to be thrown out(match penalty) of the game if the player that is hit shows a HEAD or Neck injury.

Jonsson was down on the ice barely conscious for approximately 5 minutes and his movement was minimal. That is clear evidence of an injury to the head. Roberts should have been tossed. In fact, the NHL, on Saturday, acknowledged that Roberts should have been tossed. It is now water under the bridge. In fact, I am surprised that Roberts dished out that hit since he is a good veteran player and suffered a similar hit a few years back.

Remember, just b/c it is playoff hockey, does not mean that violent play is acceptable by ANY team.

IMA, the 3 game suspension of McClaren is a joke. He should be banned for the rest of the playoffs, fined a significant sum and banned for the 1st 15 games of next season. The stricter the penalty, the less dirty play may occur. Without these penalties, this garbage will continue....
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Old 04-29-2002, 05:57 PM   #17
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in either game 3 or 4 in new york, i remember at the end when tucker was in the penalty box he had the most demonic expression on his face, it disappointed and scared me. im serious. peca was talking to the ref about some penalties and tucker was irate. he seriously looked like charlie manson.

and then i wondered what hed do to peca. hmm, well ok, thats what he did. its terrible. im all for intensity, you have to be intense to play anywhere near the top of your game, but tucker seems to think the future of his familys life is at stake.

its rather sick to me. after what ive seen of tucker, i do believe he was intending to injure. and not just cause peca told reporters that tucker told him that personally, but because of what i saw from the comfort of my living room.

its terrible for the game.

the game i say.

its a game.

its not life.

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Old 04-29-2002, 07:10 PM   #18
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by kobayashi:
[B]MBH, if the tape which laviolette says he has showing corson 'kicking' cairns does exist, i'm sure we can both agree that is dirty.


The tape?!? Did you watch the game? Corson got his ass kicked by Cairns and cleary kicked Cairns out of frustration. Breaking News: Corson has been suspended for Game 7. It is ironic that the Leafs get suspended for their most most minimal foul. I think the league is just trying to make up for the fact that they dropped the ball by not severly penalizing Tucker, Roberts or McClaren for earlier actions.

Personally, I think that Corson's skills have diminished greatly and he has changed & become even more aggresive and even dirty as he nears 36 years of age(it's a shame really b/c Corson was a hell of a well-rounded player; in fact, I believe the Isles tried to obtain him from Montreal in the 90's b4 he went to Edmonton).

and from what i've read the isles fans were not very friendly last nite: booing the anthem, chanting USA during it, and shame on the coliseum staff and the nhl officials for allowing tucker and the fans to bark at one another in the box.


Yes, the fans booed the Canadien Anthem(sung by Jamie Lynn Sigler aka Meadow Soprano from the Soprano's on HBO). As I said in a previous post, that is a disgraceful act. It is a select minority who does the booing and I hope the booing is directed toward the leafs and not the anthem. Either way it is a disgrace. However, I hope you don't dislike all Isles fans or America b/c of a few stupid fans.


As for the staff at the Coliseum: I work at the Coliseum part time as an usher(hence, my attendance at every game) and personally know much of the security staff there. I can assure you that they do an excellent job of controlling the crowd. I realize that a few fans were hitting the glass surrounding the penalty box when Tucker was in there near the end of the game. A security guard directed the fans to lay off. Remember, 100 security guards(appx.) cannot control over 16,000 fans. Especially when booze is involved. I can't speak for all of the idiotic fans who do stupid things(and all fans of all teams have fans like this), I can only defend my own actions.

By the way, what is the word in Toronto regarding the hits? I assume it is considered acceptable. Every town is biased toward there teams.

Look forward to game 7.

[This message has been edited by MBH (edited 04-29-2002).]

[This message has been edited by MBH (edited 04-29-2002).]
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Old 04-29-2002, 07:21 PM   #19
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I'm a Leaf fan, I live in Toronto, I support the team. I don't necessarily agree with the nasty hits that have ravaged this series. It's not OK for anyone to go out and purposely cause injury to another. I think it is a sport that has alot of contact good or bad. I'm going to game 7. Hope it's a good game. I hope it's not ugly. Will it stop me from watching - most certainly not - I wouldn't be a Canadian if I didn't love hockey - warts and all.

Of course don't mean any disrespect to any Cdn who might not enjoy hockey like the rest of us - had to add that in as I don't want to be flamed by fellow Cdns - heck that would be as bad as booing our anthem

[This message has been edited by WhackaMole (edited 04-29-2002).]
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Old 04-29-2002, 07:28 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally posted by WhackaMole:
I'm a Leaf fan, I live in Toronto, I support the team. I don't necessarily agree with the nasty hits that have ravaged this series. It's not OK for anyone to go out and purposely cause injury to another. I think it is a sport that has alot of contact good or bad. I'm going to game 7. Hope it's a good game. I hope it's not ugly. Will it stop me from watching - most certainly not - I wouldn't be a Canadian if I didn't love hockey - warts and all.

Of course don't mean any disrespect to any Cdn who might not enjoy hockey like the rest of us - had to add that in as I don't want to be flamed by fellow Cdns - heck that would be as bad as booing our anthem

[This message has been edited by WhackaMole (edited 04-29-2002).]
Since hockey is the 4th sport here in the states, I am curious to know the intensity of hockey in Canada.

I realize that it is the #1 sport and most people love it. Is Toronto truly a bigger hockey town than Montreal? Are the Leafs front page news? Which is the least popular Canadien team?(Vancouver?); Is Canada resentful b/c the US now was awarded some Canadien teams in the late 90's(Winnipeg, Quebec)

Just curious.

Tomorrow the Isles will seek revenge for '78....
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Old 04-29-2002, 09:47 PM   #21
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MBH,

I can't speak for the rest of the cities in Canada, but here in Vancouver, the Canucks have been front page news ever since last month while they were on there winning streak. Yeah, hockey is THE sport in Canada. In Toronto and Montreal, it's pretty much their religion. Out here on the West coast, we're a little more laid back than those in the East, but we do take it to heart. It's always a topic of discussion (when they're in the playoffs, anyway), and we are proud to have the NHL and the Canucks in our city.

So yeah, hockey is the biggest sport in Vancouver, too. Every NHL city in Canada loves their team, from the Oilers to the Senators. If I had to pick the two biggest hockey cities in Canada, it would be Toronto and Montreal, hands down.

Oh, by the way MBH, in English Canada we spell it "Canadian," not Canadien.

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Old 04-29-2002, 09:56 PM   #22
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On a side note, I was truly impressed with the class that our city showed during the US national anthem in game 6. All the fans cheered. And one of the commentators (for HNIC on CBC) said he'd never heard any crowd -- in the 25 years he's been at hockey games -- ever sing Oh Canada as loudly and passionately as they did on Saturday night at GM Place. So, yeah, I guess that answers the question whether Vancouver is a big hockey town.

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Old 04-29-2002, 10:11 PM   #23
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haha, I'm following you around here Michael....

But just to add...the Montreal crowd cheered quite loudly for the U.S. anthem, too.

Granted, they had to have 2 hockey players (Gilmour and ???) ask the audience in english and french to respect and appreciate the anthems. But it seems to have worked!
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Old 04-29-2002, 11:52 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally posted by MBH:
Your frequent mention of rough play, everyone hits in the NHL and your attitude that the events are not unbelievable or outstanding are not only inaccurate, but insulting. I acknowledged that Webb et al have performed some questionable and/or dirty plays and you could do the same. Ignorance and fans speaking w/their heart is a frustrating exercise. Objectivity is all but lost in sports.

As for Jonsson: the rule states that a player is to be thrown out(match penalty) of the game if the player that is hit shows a HEAD or Neck injury.

Jonsson was down on the ice barely conscious for approximately 5 minutes and his movement was minimal. That is clear evidence of an injury to the head. Roberts should have been tossed. In fact, the NHL, on Saturday, acknowledged that Roberts should have been tossed. It is now water under the bridge. In fact, I am surprised that Roberts dished out that hit since he is a good veteran player and suffered a similar hit a few years back.

Remember, just b/c it is playoff hockey, does not mean that violent play is acceptable by ANY team.

IMA, the 3 game suspension of McClaren is a joke. He should be banned for the rest of the playoffs, fined a significant sum and banned for the 1st 15 games of next season. The stricter the penalty, the less dirty play may occur. Without these penalties, this garbage will continue....
MBH, i really don't think we differ on all that much here in opinion, aside from who want to win tommorow night

i never said violent play was acceptable. i said it was unsurprising. that is the direction that the playoffs, and hockey in general, is headed. i also never said it pleases me. i already acknowledged corson knew what he was doing. i also conceded in my second post that he probably should have gotten the game. i can sufficiently identify when my own team is playing dirty.

please stop assuming i luv the hooligans game. nothing is further from the truth. as i said earlier the hits corson, webb, domi, and maclaren toss out there are problematic. the hooliganism quinn and laviolette come to the rink with and the threat to take out top players by michel therien are problematic. they are systemically problematic within the game. the whole of the nhl suffers from it. take one look at the florida panthers, the debatable leaders of hooliganism this season past, and you have to wonder if the fans of miami will ever enjoy real hockey. i don't know how to fix it, and i'm sure it is a seemingly insurmountable task, but i would think it has to start from the bottom and the top: the nhl'ers have to gain respect(and maybe reduce their pad size) as do the tykes.

btw, i did watch the game but had not seen the kick. i was told by a friend, who works in a toronto newspapers sports department that laviolette claimed he had a tape showing corson kicking. hence the 'if the tape...' comment. that is all i meant. there was also a missed headbutt by cummins if i remember correctly.

oh and i never meant my depiction of part of the new york crowd to portray Isles or their fans, NYC, NY, or the States. **edit: i am all canadian, but my mom is american. i have spent much time in your nation and enjoy its people and places, thus am very fond of it. however i am much fonder of my own your city kicks ass, though not as cool as montreal.

once again enjoy tommorow nights match

[This message has been edited by kobayashi (edited 04-30-2002).]
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Old 04-30-2002, 08:01 AM   #25
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Being from Toronto and being a Leaf fan - well hockey season is very stressful I must say. I live and breath hocky come the playoffs in this town. Of course the Raptors are taking some of the heat off of the Leafs but I can understand why alot of players can't take the pressure that the media and the people of the city give them. They jump on and off the bandwagon so many times in the span of the playoffs it gets a little humorous after awhile. I don't think Leaf fans, during the playoffs know what's going on in the world other the who the next matchup will be All kidding aside, Toronto is a hockey town - we love our hockey and win or lose we'll still be Leaf fans - looking for the cup - and everyone calling us losers but hey we love the game

As for the Corson suspension - he and Darcy should go to an anger management session or take some Dr. Jekyl meds cause there is absolutely no reason to play like they have being playing. I know they play with emotion and they play with grit and if they could just keep the anger in check I think we'd do alright.

Peace and on the Game 7...Habs looked mighty fine last night...but wish Gilmour was wearing Blue and White...
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