Ellipse lottery no luck needed?

[MysteryGirl]

Whenever you're all ready to stop hypothesizing and listen when NUMEROUS different tour staff tell you the truth, you will continue to line up in vain at 3am thinking that somehow gets you a better chance into the ellipse.

FOR THE FIFTEENTH BILLION TIME:

Your TICKET is either an ellipse ticket or it is not, there is no magical lottery program running and - I love this funny one - storing winning numbers locally on the laptop so that when the person comes back and scans again they get Vertigo. For each show, there is a very simple database downloaded onto the laptop. It lists the elllipse ticket upc codes and the floor ticket upc codes. Your ticket is read, noticably on THE BAR CODE. The number is matched against the database. If your ticket is an ellipse ticket, you are in. If it is not, you are on the floor. Why do you think they scan THE BAR CODE??? Your ticket bar code was already scanned for entrance validity, if they were running some ad-hoc lottery algorithm locally on each laptop, they WOULDNT need to actually scan the BAR CODE, they could scan the frickin date on the ticket and it wouldnt make a difference.

I recieved final confirmation on the fact that this is the way it works in Buffalo. Cant tell you how, you can just trust me or not trust me. I have no reason to lie, believe me. I've been in the ellipse more times than is morally acceptable LOL.

All lining up does is help you gain better position in either the ellipse or the floor.

You were either lucky or unlucky the day you (or the person whom you bought your ticket from) bought your ticket. Which was many months ago.

Although many people would consider themselves lucky just to be at a U2 show period.

I don't give a flip how they do it, it's the fact that they do it in the first place that I don't like. Yes, I line up early so I can have a rail to hang on to, wherever it may be, because of my balance/equilibreum challenge (in the middle of the crowd, if I get bumped into, which WILL happen, there's a 95% chance I'll lose my balance...do y'all want me to bring my walker-on-wheels-with-a-seat and take up more space in the middle of the crowd? Frankly, I would rather not!)...my "issue" with not being close to the stage is that when I'm on the outside of the rail I can only see the guys when they are on the catwalk, which is maybe 5-10 percent of the show. Now, if they are letting people in that Ally selects, then I wish I'd have had a chance to hand HER the doctor's notice I had with me in Boston! Showing it to venue staff accomplished, to quote a friend of mine, "a whole lotta nada!"

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

i have no complaints.

i had GA for this tour 5 times. i was in the ellipse 3 times, on the rail outside the ellipse once, and one time just hung back by the soundboard. all 5 experiences were amazing and i'm happy just to have been there.

 

[MysteryGirl]

I don't know. While it's nice in theory for people who really can't get out of work or school, etc. I think (should they go the GA route again next tour) they should just go back to first come, first served. People are still going to camp out for hours on end, and even if they're getting a lot of the same faces in there night after night, if you're devoted enough to spend 12 hours in line, I don't think you're going to be a drag, even if it is the 10th show someone has gone to on the tour and they know the setlist inside and out.

AMEN!

I also think skipping out on the line for hours on end is sketchy. Did I bend the rules a bit by having my line buddy join me in line an hour or so after I got there? I guess, but I asked the people behind me and nobody seemed to mind. That's a far cry from showing up at 8am and having your line buddy show up at 5pm, or being in a city where you're expected to wait in line all day, getting a number bright and early and disappearing for most of the day. But, what can you do? People are going to try to cheat in every city, at every show. At MSG 11/21, the GA line went down to see Bono when he came to sign around 4, and when we returned to our spot in line, there were mysteriously twice as many people in front of us. While they tried to reorganize people, some people refused to go back to their spot numerically, and the folks with the list didn't seem particularly intent of fixing that.

Hmmm...must have been more non-numbered people than numbered there!

 

[*Ally*]

Now, if they are letting people in that Ally selects, then I wish I'd have had a chance to hand HER the doctor's notice I had with me in Boston! Showing it to venue staff accomplished, to quote a friend of mine, "a whole lotta nada!"

heehee... i read this and at first thought you were talking about me and not Allison!

btw, if i was in charge of the scanners, i promise i would've let you in!

 

[MysteryGirl]

No...I've heard her called Ally, LOL!

And thanks for the thought!

Just want to mention that in no way would I ever show up an hour before showtime and expect to be let in because of my physical challenges. I get there early (camp out most of the time) because of the fact that I want to best position I can get because of my physical challenge. At any GA show I've ever been to, be it U2 or a local band here in Nashville, I'm there as early as it takes.

 

[daygloeyes2]

The computer randomizes it, not the ticket itself. And yes, multiple people can get in in a row and it's still a random process.

That happened on December 4th. It seemed alot of the 1st 200 people who were getting their tickets scanned(myself included) were getting scanned into the ellipse.

 

[partygirl2u]

All I have to say is that I was in Bufflao and Cleveland this weekend , arrived at each show between 6:45- 7pm and there was no scanning at all!! How's that for a kick in the teeth! I guess it's just the penalty you have to pay because you had to wait for ppl to get home from work and then drive an hour and half in snow to even make it to the show! I have the right to be scanned just as those who waited in line all day.



and btw at those who abuse the system!

 

[Chizip]

i'd be willing to bet that up to half of the people with GA tickets never get their tickets scanned. because most people actually show up at showtime, as craaaazy as that sounds.

 

[oliveu2cm]

That happened on December 4th. It seemed alot of the 1st 200 people who were getting their tickets scanned(myself included) were getting scanned into the ellipse.

Yeah I noticed that too, something like every other ticket was scanning.

 

[kso]

The scanning is definitely more weighted toward the front of the line now. Back in the spring, I was at the Anaheim shows and there were maybe 10 people in the ellipse while outside the ellipse was two deep.

 

[U2Fanatic4ever]

EDIT: not only that, but what about the following situation? What if, and this has happened for me personally a couple of times, person a. has two or three people with them, the first person in the group scans, and the rest jump and down, and dont even bother to scan? There is potentially two or three more ellipse positions to be 'given away'. I imagine that happens quite a bit. So there is room for giving away ellipse passes ie margin of error number, people who havent shown, precoded tickets that never bothered to scan etc etc.

This happened to me at LA2. I was with 2 other people. They were in front of me so their tickets were scanned and mine wasn't. One of the people I was with got Vertigo and so they didn't bother to scan mine. Same with Vegas2. I was with 2 other people and the first guy scanned and they didn't scan ours (me and my friend).

 

[MysteryGirl]

In Denver, on my birthday, my line partner scanned in which means I got to go in, and someone said, "Scan hers too!" They did. It didn't beep, but at least they scanned it.

But that was in the Spring.

 

[mcranston]

Notably, most of the bitching is being done by a minority, the GA line elitists who feel they have have some special 'hardcore fan' right to be in front of U2 for all 20 of the shows they went to this tour

This statement in itself is such a trite generalization. Firstly, how many hardcore fans (20+ shows) are at each show? Barely any. And secondly, the majority of people I have spoken to for the four GA lines that I have been in all unanimously oppose the lottery system. I'm not professing to have conducted an official survey of all U2 fans, but I can say the logic of first-come-first-serve is much more congruent than the lottery system. But my point is, lots of people bitch about the lottery, whether they go to one show or thirty.

Does anyone believe in good vibrations and positivity? I do. I never complained about the u2.com membership. I told people to relax about the pre-sale. I didn't cut lines, harass people who had a friend showing up a bit later. Tried to be a good linemate whenever my circumstances allowed me to line up. When I couldnt line up because of working, stood whereever felt comfortable on the floor and had an amazing time. Gave my spot up to girls who couldnt see around me. The few times I had a sign, tried to keep it small and not block others view for more than a very few seconds per show. Let many others get at the band to the point of even being pushed out of my own chance when we met the band outside venues (didnt even get a single autograph or picture until Saturday, even tho I've met them plenty) Gave away tickets to complete strangers who had no way else to get in. Didnt complain about setlists. Tried to help people with rides, rooms, made a hell of alot of friends. Went on sheer blind faith in some people. This tour worked out wonderfully for me.

Okay, I applaud your optimism, but surely recognize that everbody is not going to always be this positive, especially when an excess of money is involved. When I paid $40 for my u2.com membership, I expected presale tickets. And during that initial debacle, I can say I was furious. At the time, I had paid $40 (and been charged) yet I recieved no letter in the mail and didn't get the presale email until hours before the sale. It was terribly organized and felt like all the fans were being given the middle finger.I thought u2.com cheated the fans in the initial presale and was quite resentful. Now, my sentiments towards u2.com improved once they rectified the situation for the 3rd presale (which was conducted very well).

As I said, people have expectations, especially when money is involved. We all pay a good amount of money for these tickets, and the disappointment comes when expectations aren't met. (I'm not speaking personally, the four shows I saw were phenomenal).

I would be lying if I said I agreed with the lottery system. I think it's a silly way of doing things. While I understand why some people may like the system, I truly do not comprehend how people believe it is a more "fair" system than first-come-first-serve.

I do however, understand the argument, "lottery is in effect, suck it up". And unfortunately, it feels like the backbone of the system.

Mike

 

[gvox]

We all pay a good amount of money for these tickets, and the disappointment comes when expectations aren't met.

Um....I dont consider $49.50 to be alot of money.

Not compared to other bands.

 

[Bono's Tart]

That happened on December 4th. It seemed alot of the 1st 200 people who were getting their tickets scanned(myself included) were getting scanned into the ellipse.

erm no we had numbers in the low 50's and there were 3 of us so according to others on here higher odds of getting in none of us scanned in.

 

[bigwali]

Um....I dont consider $49.50 to be alot of money.

Not compared to other bands.

I think U2 should sell those front row ellipse spots for $500 each and you have to pick them up at will call at 7 PM the day of the show with identification. Funny how it's a random process but the same regulars are showing up in the same spots for every show they go to. Coincidence or luck of the draw...I don't think so....

 

[PoPrika]

I have seen it argued here on the boards that it is next to impossible for everyone up to the last person entering to have an equal chance, statistically, because that would mean the last person would automatically have to get in. I understand that, although it is pure semantics.

Everyone could have an equal chance to get into the Ellipse if the bar codes did indeed determine/pre-determine entry into the Ellipse (as I have always believed and continue to believe that they do). I don't know the floor/Ellipse capacity numbers, but to keep the arithmetic simple, assume there are 1000 floor tickets and 200 Ellipse spots. Then if 100 tickets (half of 200 since those selected get to take 1 person in per official rules) are pre-selected to scan Vertigo, every ticket from first to last has a 1 in 10 chance of scanning Vertigo. Of course, in reality, it's not quite that simple...groups of more than 2 get let in on one Vertigo scan, and so on...which results in the Ellipse being full before all tickets are scanned.

Erika (still smiling from Gloria live Saturday night!)

 

[ljclary]

I think the lottery system is the only way to go. I magine if indeed it was the first come first served mentality-how much do you think scalpers would get for those tickets?
I myself had a great time. I was set not to be scanned in but was making my experience amazing. However I do not see how it wouldn't be not being in the ellipse. I have sat in the back row (literally behind the stage in the dead last row) and it still rocked!!
Also didn't they switch to the lottery b/c the band was getting tired of seeing the same people in the first rows night after night. I beleive it is PAul McGuiness (?) that says this on the Chicago DVD documentary. He also says the fans had no surprise b/c they always knew what was coming next.

 

[tryan101]

superman has a hard time believing this, considering how you have to show your ticket to an usher at the door and then again to the people at the scanning table.

one would think they could tell the difference between numbers and letters. superman certainly can.

who cares whether you believe it or not. but I will explain it. this was LA2 on 11/2/05. I went with my buddy who had a GA - they looked at his and assumed mine was the same. the first handheld scan at the door only determined if the ticket was valid. after that then its up to the venue people to actually look at the ticket. they get lazy after looking at hundred of tickets and they didn't bother to inspect it. they were more interesting in marking the back of the ticket to show its been through the system. no less than 3 people actually handled it, but they didn't notice. now it didn't work the night before, but it did this time. and it beeped us in, so there's no way it can be pre-determined - reserved tickets would never be stored as such.


.

 

[MysteryGirl]

Also didn't they switch to the lottery b/c the band was getting tired of seeing the same people in the first rows night after night. I beleive it is PAul McGuiness (?) that says this on the Chicago DVD documentary. He also says the fans had no surprise b/c they always knew what was coming next.

Yes he said that and I see red every time I watch it, which is why I now skip over it.

Nothing like basically being punished for loyalty. If the staff at my local Walmart got tired of the same customers coming in over and over, and discouraged it, how long do you think they'd stay in business? Personally, I'd start considering going to Target! And I think my U2 loyalty - and being a music fan in general - is out of spite as well as the fact that it's fun. The "spitefulness of my being a music fan comes from having worked in the music business and seeing a general negative attitude towards fans (er - customers). I work for the government now, and I've seen less politics there!


P. S. BTW. Superman, were you at the Chicago May 10 show? I saw a guy with a Supoerman shirt on, a few people behind me, and I also saw them interviewing you, while I sat under a nearby tree stuffing my face and then there's the guy with that shirt on the DVD.

 

[Superman]

Superman was out on a hot date with Lois Lane on that day.

Superman is interested to know who this imposter was though

 

[Superman]

who cares whether you believe it or not. but I will explain it. this was LA2 on 11/2/05. I went with my buddy who had a GA - they looked at his and assumed mine was the same. the first handheld scan at the door only determined if the ticket was valid. after that then its up to the venue people to actually look at the ticket. they get lazy after looking at hundred of tickets and they didn't bother to inspect it. they were more interesting in marking the back of the ticket to show its been through the system. no less than 3 people actually handled it, but they didn't notice. now it didn't work the night before, but it did this time. and it beeped us in, so there's no way it can be pre-determined - reserved tickets would never be stored as such.


.

superman is still rather suspicious, but seeing as superman does not care, superman will not argue further.

 

[ramblin rose]

I can only assume Superman is Octagon's cousin.

 

[MysteryGirl]

Superman was out on a hot date with Lois Lane on that day.

Superman is interested to know who this imposter was though

Well, he's on the documentart part of the Vertigo Cicago DVD, go see for yourself!

 

[popacrobat]

i showed up around like 7:30 last week and there was no scanning going on sunday night. what good is a lottery if thats going to happen? i waited outside a lot of the day 10/17 in philly to not get scanned in, and i didnt even get my ticket scanned on 12/4. so i guess ive been on both sides of the lottery screwings.

however i did get into the ellipse on 12/5, and had (essentially) a rail spot 5/28 in may. 1-5 on the ellipse, but i was happy to have seats the other 19 times.

 

[Mrs. Edge]

It was first come first served for Elevation and I certainly didn't notice any difference in what the scalpers were charging as opposed to now.

In reading through this thread, the strongest supporters of the lottery seem to be the ones who have been scanned in more than once!! Of course they will be happy with the system. It totally sucks for real fans who did their time in line and NEVER got in and I know quite a few people who are in that situation.

The same fans still get in the front row, so as far as I'm concerned, the system failed miserably.

I think the lottery system is the only way to go. I magine if indeed it was the first come first served mentality-how much do you think scalpers would get for those tickets?
I myself had a great time. I was set not to be scanned in but was making my experience amazing. However I do not see how it wouldn't be not being in the ellipse. I have sat in the back row (literally behind the stage in the dead last row) and it still rocked!!
Also didn't they switch to the lottery b/c the band was getting tired of seeing the same people in the first rows night after night. I beleive it is PAul McGuiness (?) that says this on the Chicago DVD documentary. He also says the fans had no surprise b/c they always knew what was coming next.

 

[gvox]

It totally sucks for real fans who did their time in line and NEVER got in and I know quite a few people who are in that situation.

But thats the rub - they were encouraged NOT to 'do their time in line'. Everyone chose to ignore the intent of the system whereas what would have happened if people just lined up at 4 or 5pm the day of the event? Sure, the people who never got in would still never have got in, their ticket determined that, but they'd be alot less upset about it if they didnt wait all that time, dont you think?

 

[ramblin rose]

But thats the rub - they were encouraged NOT to 'do their time in line'. Everyone chose to ignore the intent of the system whereas what would have happened if people just lined up at 4 or 5pm the day of the event? Sure, the people who never got in would still never have got in, their ticket determined that, but they'd be alot less upset about it if they didnt wait all that time, dont you think?

As far as I'm concerned the lining up has almost nothing to do with the ellipse, it's the 1st come 1st serve outside ellipse policy and forces the lining up.

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

i waited all day, from 8 in the morning, once... my first show, 5/14 in philadelphia.

i didn't get scanned in, but ended up with a rail spot outside the ellipse on adam's side... the show it's self was fantastic... bono spent a lot of time right in front of me on the ellipse. the only problem was that after the show i was physicaly exhausted from waiting all day and being sunburned to all hell, considering that the weather all week said it was going to be overcast and rainy, so i dressed accordingly, it it turned out to be sunny with not a cloud in the sky. so after the show all i wanted to do was get back to the hotel and go to bed as fast as possible. and of course my room key didn't work and the room wasn't in my name... so unfortunatly angry headache made an appearance.

all the other GA shows i went to i didn't wait in line, and was actually coherent, excited, and ready to party after the shows... which is the way i like it. oh... and before the shows too, which is also the way i like it

 

[Mrs. Edge]

But Gabriel, regardless of if you line up or not, it's the getting IN that is the issue here. I don't think it's fair for deserving fans to get shut out of the ellipse at ALL. And if you don't line up, you end up far back behind the crowd, and whether or not you like the soundboard, you are still losing a lot of intimacy. The soundboard for me would never be the same as a rail, especially if I were short. People are doing their time in line either way, I still think everyone should have at least one chance to get in.

But thats the rub - they were encouraged NOT to 'do their time in line'. Everyone chose to ignore the intent of the system whereas what would have happened if people just lined up at 4 or 5pm the day of the event? Sure, the people who never got in would still never have got in, their ticket determined that, but they'd be alot less upset about it if they didnt wait all that time, dont you think?