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Old 08-18-2016, 11:10 AM   #256
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US swimmers 'damaged petrol station door' - BBC News

And the IOC response:



32-year-old kids.



In fairness, Bentz and Conger are 20 and 21.
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Old 08-18-2016, 11:15 AM   #257
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Sure. Still, a 20- or 21-year-old tourist destroying property in NYC and then reporting a ficticious crime to NYPD would not receive a "Let's give these kids a break" response.
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Old 08-18-2016, 11:33 AM   #258
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I'm so confused by the pronunciation of Tori Bowie's last name as "boo-wee" rather than, well, like David "bow-ee". Whenever the commentators mention her I have absolutely no idea who they mean.
In the US at least I commonly hear it pronounced as Boo-E or Bow-E (not like Bowie, David). The latter at least I think is how I remember people pronouncing it in Fort Worth.
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Old 08-18-2016, 12:24 PM   #259
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If Lochte et al had been doing something stupid, why would they even say they got robbed? Or were they, like, robbed by a prostitute? Did he tell his mom and she blabbed and then a white lie became a big lie? Or is Rio just hypersensitive about protecting its reputation, apparently unaware that it has a really bad reputation?

I'm so confused by the whole thing.

Which is probably how Lochte feels most of the time.
Um, no, they really are lying.

US swimmers Jack Conger and Gunnar Bentz pulled off plane in Rio - CNN.com
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Old 08-18-2016, 12:38 PM   #260
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What a disgrace.
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Old 08-18-2016, 12:42 PM   #261
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Sure. Still, a 20- or 21-year-old tourist destroying property in NYC and then reporting a ficticious crime to NYPD would not receive a "Let's give these kids a break" response.

i'm not going to defend that response, or any sort of "boys-will-be-boys" attitude, and of course the four of them are subject to the laws of Brazil. but if this were to happen in New York, i hardly think the NYPD would have started an international incident by peeling petty vandals off an airplane.

what i think is going on is touched upon in this latest update from the NYT:

Quote:
The episode has also touched on sensitive issues of sovereignty and nationalism around the Rio Olympics, while focusing enormous scrutiny on the perceptions of danger in a society where many Brazilians themselves often lament their exposure to alarming levels of violent crime and police corruption.

“This incident has caused so much damage to Rio’s brand abroad that I think Brazilians deserve a clear, consistent account of what happened,” said Brian Winter, vice president for policy at Americas Society and Council of the Americas.

The entire episode, Winter said, “has tapped into one of Brazilians’ biggest pet peeves — gringos who treat their country like a third-rate spring break destination where you can lie to the cops and get away with it.”
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Old 08-18-2016, 12:47 PM   #262
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and here we have the story, i think:

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An Associated Press report says Jack Conger and Gunnar Bentz have confirmed that the story of a gunpoint robbery in Rio was fabricated.

Conger and Bentz were with Jimmy Feigen and Ryan Lochte early Sunday morning when Lochte said they were robbed at gunpoint.

But Brazilian police have alleged that no robbery took place, but that the four were involved in an altercation at a gas station that led to damages to the gas station bathroom.

Conger and Bentz were pulled off of their airplane home from Rio to speak to police about the incident. And now the Associated Press is reporting that the two confirmed that the robbery story was made up.

According to the AP report, Lochte first lied about the robbery when speaking to his mother. She then told the story to reporters, which is when the story became widely reported in the media.

Brazilian police say the swimmers stopped at the gas station to use the bathroom, but broke the door upon finding it locked. There are allegations of other damages to the bathroom as well. The swimmers were confronted by a security guard who was armed, though there are conflicting reports as to whether or not he took out his gun while dealing with the swimmers. You can read several of the differing accounts here.

Lochte is currently back in the United States, while the other three remain in Brazil until the situation is resolved.

https://swimswam.com/report-conger-b...ry-fabricated/
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Old 08-18-2016, 12:59 PM   #263
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i'm not going to defend that response, or any sort of "boys-will-be-boys" attitude, and of course the four of them are subject to the laws of Brazil. but if this were to happen in New York, i hardly think the NYPD would have started an international incident by peeling petty vandals off an airplane.

what i think is going on is touched upon in this latest update from the NYT:
Really? If NYPD had asked for someone's passport pending the investigation of a crime and that person tried to leave the country, you think border patrol would have let them leave?
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Old 08-18-2016, 01:08 PM   #264
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Really? If NYPD had asked for someone's passport pending the investigation of a crime and that person tried to leave the country, you think border patrol would have let them leave?

i don't think the NYPD would ask for a passport to begin with based upon what seems to have happened. these aren't comparable situations.

seems some Aussie swimmers were robbed last night as well.
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Old 08-18-2016, 01:37 PM   #265
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security cam footage is here:

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Old 08-18-2016, 03:23 PM   #266
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you can't see at all what actually happened but it's pretty easy to infer what really did rather than just hand-wave it away with some vague accusations and irrelevant rumors about australian swimmers being robbed "as well", or mentioning their ages "to be fair" as if being 20 years old cuts you some slack for drunken rampaging vandalism. i get that they're american swimmers which for whatever reason seems to make people super-special to you, but you're trying to let them off the hook for being too drunk and legitimately fucking stupid to realize that they needed to go inside the gas station to get the key for the outside bathroom door that was just on the other side of the shipping container and hulk-smashed it in before trying to hightail it, throwing some cash at the gas station owner when he catches them, going on to file a completely false police report that they were robbed at gunpoint by criminals impersonating police (for whatever fucking reason), then attempting to flee the country before anyone could put two and two together. how can you defend something so asinine?
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Old 08-18-2016, 04:21 PM   #267
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you can't see at all what actually happened but it's pretty easy to infer what really did rather than just hand-wave it away with some vague accusations and irrelevant rumors about australian swimmers being robbed "as well", or mentioning their ages "to be fair" as if being 20 years old cuts you some slack for drunken rampaging vandalism. i get that they're american swimmers which for whatever reason seems to make people super-special to you, but you're trying to let them off the hook for being too drunk and legitimately fucking stupid to realize that they needed to go inside the gas station to get the key for the outside bathroom door that was just on the other side of the shipping container and hulk-smashed it in before trying to hightail it, throwing some cash at the gas station owner when he catches them, going on to file a completely false police report that they were robbed at gunpoint by criminals impersonating police (for whatever fucking reason), then attempting to flee the country before anyone could put two and two together. how can you defend something so asinine?

what have i defended? i've put together what seems like the actual story, that's it. and i've touched on some of the cultural issues at play, which to me is much more interesting than what actually happened.

here, the NYT has built it out further, and it supports what i've been saying:



Quote:
After watching video and hearing testimony from witnesses, the Brazilian police said they determined the incident involved damage to a bathroom at a gas station where the swimmers stopped in the early hours Sunday on the way back to the athletes’ village from a party.

The police said the taxi carrying the swimmers stopped at a Shell gas station about 6 a.m., shortly after the men exited a party at Club France, an Olympic hospitality house established here in the upscale Lagoa district.

At the gas station, which is in Barra da Tijuca, on the route to the athletes’ village, the swimmers went to the bathroom. In the process, according to the account by investigators, damage was done to the bathroom door, and a discussion ensued with the manager and a security guard.

Someone at the gas station called the police, but by the time a police car arrived at the scene, the swimmers were gone. Witnesses, including a person who offered to translate for the swimmers, said that they paid money to the manager before leaving.

Judges ordered the swimmers to stay in the country and surrender their passports over doubts about their testimony, but Lochte had left Brazil and the United States Olympic Committee would not give up the swimmers’ locations. Then the police pulled two of the swimmers off their plane Wednesday night and said that they needed to remain in the country as the investigation unfolded.

“The truth is that this crime in Brazil is not that serious,” said Judge Marcello Rubioli, the head of the special court handling the case involving four American swimmers, referring to making a false claim. “It results in very little punishment. If they are found guilty, they would just have to make a payment to an NGO that does humanitarian work. It’s not a serious crime. It’s not a crime that is going to send them to prison. It’s not a crime that’s going to prevent them from returning home.”

The episode has also touched on sensitive issues of sovereignty and nationalism around the Rio Olympics, while focusing enormous scrutiny on the perceptions of danger in a society where many Brazilians themselves often lament their exposure to alarming levels of violent crime and police corruption.

“This incident has caused so much damage to Rio’s brand abroad that I think Brazilians deserve a clear, consistent account of what happened,” Brian Winter, vice president for policy at Americas Society and Council of the Americas, said.

The entire episode, Winter said, “has tapped into one of Brazilians’ biggest pet peeves — gringos who treat their country like a third-rate spring break destination where you can lie to the cops and get away with it.”


Meanwhile, the new turns in the case were raising tensions around Brazil, with some commentators questioning the role of the U.S.O.C. in providing confusing initial accounts of what happened and then shielding the swimmers from scrutiny.

Still, Olympics officials in Rio seemed to be trying Thursday to play down the episode.

“No apologies from him or from the other athletes are needed,” Mario Andrada, a spokesman for the Rio Olympics organizing committee, said. “We need to understand that these kids were trying to have fun. They came here, they represented their country to the best of their abilities.”

He added: “But let’s give these kids a break. Sometimes you take actions that you later regret.”

Still, some here in Rio lamented the entire episode, emphasizing that they wished the police were always so efficient in clearing up reports of violent crime in a city that endured an alarming crime wave in the months ahead of the Olympics. Authorities sought to ease fears by deploying a security force comprising 85,000 police officer and soldiers.

“The real dilemma is that people in this city live in fear of crime,” said Eduardo Rangel, 64, the owner of store selling office supplies. “The swimmers took advantage of the mess that exists around here to further denigrate the city. That doesn’t mean Rio is some paradise without crime.”

Others in Rio, however, said they felt deeply insulted by the behavior of the American swimmers.

“These guys from abroad think they’re superior to us, that they can come here, make a mess, lie about it and stain the image of Brazil,” said Airton Rocha, 28, a waiter at a cafe. “Well, the law is the law and it should apply to everyone in the same way.
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Old 08-18-2016, 04:38 PM   #268
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you can't see at all what actually happened but it's pretty easy to infer what really did rather than just hand-wave it away with some vague accusations and irrelevant rumors about australian swimmers being robbed "as well", or mentioning their ages "to be fair" as if being 20 years old cuts you some slack for drunken rampaging vandalism. i get that they're american swimmers which for whatever reason seems to make people super-special to you, but you're trying to let them off the hook for being too drunk and legitimately fucking stupid to realize that they needed to go inside the gas station to get the key for the outside bathroom door that was just on the other side of the shipping container and hulk-smashed it in before trying to hightail it, throwing some cash at the gas station owner when he catches them, going on to file a completely false police report that they were robbed at gunpoint by criminals impersonating police (for whatever fucking reason), then attempting to flee the country before anyone could put two and two together. how can you defend something so asinine?
Thank you.

What baffles me is the suggestion that a US police department wouldn't react in the same way (and more likely much worse) if the roles had been the reverse.

The whole paying-in-cash-for-the-damage is the most infuriating thing for me. It's so fucking patronizing. And typical of behavior of drunken gringos, to quote Irvine, in what they see as third-world countries.
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Old 08-18-2016, 05:09 PM   #269
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Thank you.

What baffles me is the suggestion that a US police department wouldn't react in the same way (and more likely much worse) if the roles had been the reverse.

The whole paying-in-cash-for-the-damage is the most infuriating thing for me. It's so fucking patronizing. And typical of behavior of drunken gringos, to quote Irvine, in what they see as third-world countries.


the NYPD wouldn't have turned this into an international incident by pulling people off planes if it were average tourists in New York. why? because these are heightened, unusual circumstances. it's the Olympics, in a city hypersensitive to it's reputation for crime and violence -- remember when the Rio tourist board sued The Simpsons -- involving a moderately well-known celebrity. i don't think we can compare it to your average Brazilian tourist in the US breaking a bathroom door and peeing on the side of a building.

i'm really not putting forth an argument or a defense of anyone. i've actually tried to understand the situation, rather than dismissing it as, you know, "typical behavior."
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Old 08-18-2016, 05:47 PM   #270
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what have i defended? i've put together what seems like the actual story, that's it.
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