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Old 11-11-2011, 03:13 PM   #211
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But I think Paterno knew the guy would be going to the 'higher ups' for a more thorough handing of the situation.

If I report an incident, identify the parties, and turn it over to 'investigators' I would assume they be responsible for the proper follow through.
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Old 11-11-2011, 03:16 PM   #212
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The question that sticks in my mind is: then what do you do when time goes by and clearly nothing has been done?

If you reported some minor incident up the ladder per the proper procedure and nothing is done, maybe you'd be okay with "well, I did my part, it's not my problem now."

But how do you do that when this person was either molesting or raping a child, depending on which varying report you heard?
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Old 11-11-2011, 03:17 PM   #213
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But I think Paterno knew the guy would be going to the 'higher ups' for a more thorough handing of the situation.

If I report an incident, identify the parties, and turn it over to 'investigators' I would assume they be responsible for the proper follow through.
I am a high school teacher. I would never assume this. Also, the AD is not an "investigator." Reporting abuse to an administrator is not part of mandated reporting in my state. I would need to call the authorities and report it myself. I understand that not all states are the same however.
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Old 11-11-2011, 03:18 PM   #214
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The question that sticks in my mind is: what do you do when time goes by and clearly nothing has been done?
You get promoted.
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Old 11-11-2011, 03:18 PM   #215
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The question that sticks in my mind is: what do you do when time goes by and clearly nothing has been done?

It seems so patently obvious, yet time and time again and in many different types of organizations, this piece of common sense seldom seems to kick in.
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Old 11-11-2011, 03:20 PM   #216
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I participate in different organizations, where there is a chain of command.

when that happens, you either stay with the program or you leave.

Also, this isn't the type of thing where you would necessarily know.

Do you go up and ask him, Are you in court ordered therapy? etc.?
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Old 11-11-2011, 03:22 PM   #217
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The question that sticks in my mind is: then what do you do when time goes by and clearly nothing has been done?

If you reported some minor incident up the ladder per the proper procedure and nothing is done, maybe you'd be okay with "well, I did my part, it's not my problem now."

But how do you do that when this person was either molesting or raping a child, depending on which varying report you heard?
This is why I blame Paterno more than McQueary: Paterno had nothing to lose. There's no way he's losing his job over trying to do the right thing and make a big deal about child molestation. People talk of the hypothetical: what if McQueary wasn't right and you're accusing a man of something he didn't do? Horseshit. Paterno had nothing to lose, even if things were tense between him and Sandusky (they may have coached together, but they were never exactly good friends) and it could have been perceived as him trying to stir shit up.

Whereas with McQueary, you could see why he might have some fears that making too big a deal of it could lose him a lot of things. Obviously he should have done more, but you can at least understand that. With Paterno, there's nothing bad that could have come out of making a bigger fuss about it.
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Old 11-11-2011, 03:23 PM   #218
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That's been my impression as well. (As a total outsider to both college football and Penn State; just my impressions based on what I've read.)
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Old 11-11-2011, 03:23 PM   #219
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Also, this isn't the type of thing where you would necessarily know.
Of course you would in this type of situation: you'd be part of the child protective services / police investigation. If you are Paterno and it is reported properly, you are getting questioned by some legal authority. So then you'd know.
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Old 11-11-2011, 03:24 PM   #220
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This is why I blame Paterno more than McQueary: Paterno had nothing to lose. There's no way he's losing his job over trying to do the right thing and make a big deal about child molestation. People talk of the hypothetical: what if McQueary wasn't right and you're accusing a man of something he didn't do? Horseshit. Paterno had nothing to lose, even if things were tense between him and Sandusky (they may have coached together, but they were never exactly good friends) and it could have been perceived as him trying to stir shit up.

Whereas with McQueary, you could see why he might have some fears that making too big a deal of it could lose him a lot of things. Obviously he should have done more, but you can at least understand that. With Paterno, there's nothing bad that could have come out of making a bigger fuss about it.
Bang on. He's the big fish, not the other way around. They're not going to touch him for going all the way with it, and that is why his inaction is all the more reprehensible imo.
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Old 11-11-2011, 03:27 PM   #221
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This is why I blame Paterno more than McQueary: Paterno had nothing to lose. There's no way he's losing his job over trying to do the right thing and make a big deal about child molestation. People talk of the hypothetical: what if McQueary wasn't right and you're accusing a man of something he didn't do? Horseshit. Paterno had nothing to lose, even if things were tense between him and Sandusky (they may have coached together, but they were never exactly good friends) and it could have been perceived as him trying to stir shit up.

Whereas with McQueary, you could see why he might have some fears that making too big a deal of it could lose him a lot of things. Obviously he should have done more, but you can at least understand that. With Paterno, there's nothing bad that could have come out of making a bigger fuss about it.

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eta...I just remembered something..somewhere along the way one or more media outlets reported that Paterno testified that McQuery never told him that it was anal sex. It's not directly mentioned in the findings of fact though. I guess there is more to the record than what's listed in that document, right? Isn't that just a summary of what facts they feel are relevant?
Right, it's not necessarily an exhaustive account of every last thing that was said. And pretty much every lawyer I've seen comment on this grand jury report has criticized it as really sloppily written.
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Old 11-11-2011, 03:36 PM   #222
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I hear you yolland.

Fucking hell, I need to step away from this subject. I just realized that I'm typing out paragraphs on the difference between one disgusting act on a child and another.

:vomit:
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Old 11-11-2011, 03:52 PM   #223
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Breaking: McQueary was just placed on administrative leave "indefinitiely." Safe to say he should start looking for another line of work.
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Old 11-11-2011, 04:14 PM   #224
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He'll be negotiated out of his contract. They don't want to fuck with his whistleblower-status, but there's no way he coaches again. It can't happen.
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Old 11-11-2011, 04:52 PM   #225
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PFan, do you think the fallout from this is likely to lead to calls for revisions to PA's reporting laws? I don't necessarily have the impression they're any "worse" than the national average (e.g., only a minority of states have a general requirement that any adult with reasonable cause to suspect child abuse directly report it), still, it's hard not to get the impression PA's system facilitated the all-around moral negligence here, even though it obviously didn't cause it.
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