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Old 09-20-2015, 12:27 PM   #31
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Who gives a shit? You do realise that appeals to popularity are fallacious arguments, right?
We're not talking about some shit album high on the Billboard charts. My point is that it's regarded well by people who actually listen to New Order. So when someone dismisses it with very little to back it up I'm not going to take that very seriously.

At least admit you're in the minority when you attack an album like that.

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A 4/5 isn't even an especially good customer score for a golden age album by a popular band. I'm surprised it's that low and that Laz would use such a score as evidence of the album's value.
It's the same score as Low-Life.
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Old 09-22-2015, 08:49 AM   #32
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We're not talking about some shit album high on the Billboard charts. My point is that it's regarded well by people who actually listen to New Order. So when someone dismisses it with very little to back it up I'm not going to take that very seriously.

At least admit you're in the minority when you attack an album like that.
You're still appealling to popularity, albeit of a different sort - I guess you could call it critical popularity or fan popularity. It's not a particularly strong argument.

For example, just because 9 out of 10 U2 fanatics on EYKIW think Passengers is boring unlistenable shit doesn't make it so, at least not to somebody who digs it. Similar case here. The bare fact other people dig this particular New Order album doesn't require Liam or anyone to offer any specific form of defence for their personal preferences. Call somebody out for flimsy reasoning or inadequate substantation, not for being out of step with your opinion/that of any particular majority.
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Old 09-22-2015, 10:00 AM   #33
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In other news, this has leaked.
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Old 09-22-2015, 10:39 AM   #34
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The Complete New Order Music Complete

Once more Laz and I agree on almost everything New Order.

I would also offer that the album cut of Bizarre Love Triangle is arguably better listening music than its inarguably more danceable remix companion. I enjoy the album version better when out driving with the stereo cranked and the sunroof open for instance, but of course would find it a bit less satisfying than the Substance cut over a club system.

Brotherhood is nowhere near a bad album.


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Old 09-22-2015, 10:43 AM   #35
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Wow, what happened in here.

I think it's New Order Day. Starting at the top.

Apparently I've never listened to Movement before, or I never rated it on RYM. .
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Old 09-22-2015, 11:13 AM   #36
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You're still appealling to popularity, albeit of a different sort - I guess you could call it critical popularity or fan popularity. It's not a particularly strong argument.

For example, just because 9 out of 10 U2 fanatics on EYKIW think Passengers is boring unlistenable shit doesn't make it so, at least not to somebody who digs it. Similar case here. The bare fact other people dig this particular New Order album doesn't require Liam or anyone to offer any specific form of defence for their personal preferences. Call somebody out for flimsy reasoning or inadequate substantation, not for being out of step with your opinion/that of any particular majority.
U2 is a mainstream band. Haven't we already established that most of the fans here on Interference seem to barely listen to other music?

The people who are into New Order enough to get their other albums are likely a little bit more particular/discerning on the whole.

And you still seem to be ignoring the larger point: that if you slag off an album that is enjoyed by consensus and don't provide much of a reason why, your opinion isn't going to carry much weight with those you're talking to.
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Old 09-25-2015, 12:56 AM   #37
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Really digging this record. Better than I expected, lots of good stuff to keep coming back to for mine.
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Old 09-25-2015, 06:55 AM   #38
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Does anyone have the link for this, I'm way up north with scant internet access but am driving back this am. Perfect time for a full listen. Pls PM me if you can help, thanks


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Old 09-26-2015, 04:40 AM   #39
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I know most fans are aware of this by now, but Sumner isn't really much of a lyricist these days, is he? Technique was the newest NO album I had heard up until Music Complete and he sounds noticeably uninspired on this record, though I don't have anything recent to compare it to.

Musically, it's a good listen. A bit long. Stray Dog is absolutely terrible, one of Iggy Pop's worst features ever, but there's not much else I would cut altogether. Nothing But a Fool, while very pretty and one of my favorites on the record, would have been just fine at 5 minutes, not nearly 8. Restless seems to be going for Regret-esque, guitar-driven sound and it would function better with a more brisk run time.

All in all though, it's an entertaining hour. Kind of a grab bag of different NO eras, some of it more successful than others. I'm definitely missing Peter Hook, the sound is a little thin.
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Old 09-26-2015, 04:53 AM   #40
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This one is not grabbing me so far. I'll give it a couple of more listens before reaching a final verdict, but I'm definitely not buying this "best album in 20 years" hype it's getting in the press.

But I'm a huge fan of Get Ready and I like Waiting for the Sirens' Call so what do I know.
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Old 09-26-2015, 05:01 AM   #41
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It's definitely not to the level of Get Ready, but I also tend to rate that pretty highly.

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I know most fans are aware of this by now, but Sumner isn't really much of a lyricist these days, is he?
He's had his moments but he's never been a great lyricist. Having said that, he can 'sell' fairly ordinary lyrics quite well with his voice, if that makes sense.
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Old 09-26-2015, 05:16 AM   #42
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I thought Sumner was always a crappy lyricist. Get Ready is actually one of my favourite albums ever, but even I have to concede the lyrics are horrendous in many cases on that record.
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Old 09-26-2015, 05:23 AM   #43
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He almost completely ruins the entirety Slow Jam with the lyrics. I doubt he even spent more than a minute writing the lyrics for that song. It's actually kind of amusing.
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Old 09-26-2015, 05:27 AM   #44
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Those lyrics do not beat arithmetic.
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Old 09-26-2015, 05:28 AM   #45
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The lyrics definitely took a significant hit with Ian's passing, though they were admittedly background noise for me on the early records and nothing really harmful. Temptation is simple but evocative in its own way.

Plastic and Tutti Futti though...
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