Pavement

[LemonMelon]

I'm trying to get into this band. The only albums I've heard by them are Slanted & Enchanted and Crooked Rain, but I just don't quite see what the big deal is yet. S&E was decent, with a mixture of strong and poor songs, but I just haven't gotten into it yet. Crooked Rain is a lot better, IMO, and is a very good album. However, I lost my CD-R of it, so I intend on picking up the deluxe edition of it along with Neon Bible in a couple of weeks.

Is anyone else here a fan of Pavement? Any recommendations?

 

[impy13]

I've tried to get into them since they're held in such high regard and considered seminal to the whole indie movement, but I just don't get what's so god damn spectacular about then.

Truthfully, I find myself bored by them.

 

[If you shout...]

One of the best American bands of the 1990s, as far as I see it.

Slanted and Enchanted is one of my thirty or so favorite albums of all time, and both Wowee Zowee and Crooked Rain, Crooked Rain are only a hair's breadth from being just as good.

Essential songs: "Summer Babe (Winter Version)," "Gold Soundz," "Rattled by the Rush," "Kennel District," and "Zurich is Stained." Just for starters, I reckon that'll give you a pretty good idea of what this band was capable of doing before Nigel Godrich got in there and, as always (minus Radiohead, I admit), fucked it all up way the hell beyond repair.

I once read something written about "Gold Soundz" which said, "Every single time I listen to this song, I have a life-changing epiphany." That pretty well sums these guys up, for me. Malkmus (and even Stairs, though to an obviously lesser extent) was like A.C. Newman before A.C. Newman was writing songs--the sounds of the words, rather than the words themselves, told the most vivid stories and painted the most arresting pictures that you'd ever imagined. All kinds of Eno-styled gobbledy-gook that sounds nothing at all like what Eno did with the same principle(s). There are literally dozens more gems scattered across their discography, but like I said...I think that those songs up there pretty well sum it up.

I mean, come on...

"I wanted to stay there, but you know I needed you more than that."

"Keep my advent to yourself."

"You can never quarantine the past."

"Pick out some Brazilian nuts for your engagement. Check the expiration date, man...it's later than you think."

"I guess a guess is the best I'll do."

That's gold, Jerry. Gold.

 

[lazarus]

Best band of the 90's, though I have to disagree with your assessment of Terror Twilight, IYS. It's a natural progression from Brighten the Corners (a true masterpiece, and the band's most even and fully realized album), if you ask me. They were tightening up and getting slightly more sophisticated on BTC anyway. You may think it sounds too slick, but the songs are still the songs. I think Godrich let them breathe, even if it sacrificed some of the scrappiness that caused so many to love the band in the first palce. I was never a huge fan of Spit on a Stranger and think it's a weak opening (even if its sappines is full-on irony), but if you have any affinity for the breezy, mellow side of Pavement (Black Out, Grounded, Zurich is Stained, Gold Soundz), stuff like You Are a Light, Ann Don't Cry, Major Leagues are up there with the best of them.

Plus, it's not like the album is some kind of snoozefest. Cream of Gold rocks HARD, as does Platform Blues, and The Hexx is all kinds of sinister. And the looser, playful side is represented here too: Speak, See, Remember and Carrot Rope fully satisfy. I can see how others might not like the jamminess of Folk Jam (a cringe-inducing warning of a title) or folkiness of Billy, but they're certainly not crap.

The material does come off a bit slight when compared with previous albums, but aside from Malkmus' lyrics, the thing I come to Pavement for primarily is his guitar playing, and he does such great work all over the recording. Also, there's nothing on TT as bad as Hit the Plane down, or as boring as Heaven is a Truck, the two tracks that prevent CRCR from being a complete masterpiece.

Slanted and Enchanted, however, while certainly being groundbreaking, isn't even close to the band at its peak. To call it the best is rather insulting, and I hate the indie rock axiom that the bands are best right out of the gate. Not even close for Pavement, and as eminently listenable as S&E is, as an experience every other album is denser and richer. Personally I prefer Wowee Zowee, because it's 18 tracks of Pavement, and covers every kind of terrain they were capable of, much like The White Album.

I'm curious, IYS, do you like any solo Malkmus? I just don't see that much of a difference between all the albums (Pavement and SM included) as many others do. They're all great IMO. I guess my main point is that I would direct new listeners to Terror Twilight because it's still the most accessible, and they can dig deeper into the more-offbeat stuff from there.

 

[XHendrix24]

I feel like I should love them, but I generally hold them as somewhere between "okay" and "pretty good." They've got some great tunes scattered around in their albums, but overall they just don't click with me like they seem to do with other people.

"Here," "Gold Soundz," "Cut Your Hair," "Range Life," and "Fillmore Jive" are all totally great, though.

 

[intedomine]

Where should one start if one wants to get into them?

I hear that they are quintessentially 90's...

 

[lazarus]

Well they're not 90's in some kind of trendy sense that's going to sound outdated, save for debut Slanted & Enchanted, which is about as definitively indie lo-fi as you could get.

Crooked Rain, Crooked Rain is their second album and if I'm not mistaken their best-selling one. It's the most straight-ahead rock of their discography and arguably the most accessible. But as I mentioned above, I think the band's swan song Terror Twilight is another great entry point, because it's concise and the most polished of the albums. Plus, the potential to be annoyed by Stephen Malkmus' voice (not that it's on the potential annoyance level of a Michael Stipe, Perry Ferrell, David Byrne, etc.) is lessened by starting here. You're better off hearing him at his least idiosyncratic and easing into the previous albums afterwards.

Amazon is always a good place to hear snippets, but to truly appreciate the magic you're better off downloading or picking up a used copy of a whole album.

 

[If you shout...]

I'm curious, IYS, do you like any solo Malkmus? I just don't see that much of a difference between all the albums (Pavement and SM included) as many others do. They're all great IMO. I guess my main point is that I would direct new listeners to Terror Twilight because it's still the most accessible, and they can dig deeper into the more-offbeat stuff from there.

I've never been able to get into any of the Malkmus/Malkmus + Jicks stuff, no. I've even seen him/them live, but the show didn't mean anything until they started playing a Pavement song or two. It was really sad, now that I think it over...

I totally agree with you in regards to Malkmus's guitar skills, which I still think sounded the most perfectly imperfect on Wowee Zowee; I feel like that was when he started speaking with his guitar on a more regular basis, while I feel like he's done too much of that in the wake of that spectacular album.

Anyway, I guess that I dislike the Malkmus stuff for the inverse reason that you like Brighten the Corners so much--the songs just aren't any good, to my ears.

I should point out, though, that I don't unequivocally hate either of the band's last two albums. I think that Brighten the Corners is solid but unspectacular and that Terror Twilight is embarrassing, watered-down, bland...and still an okay album.

I can't back off of this, though--I swear to you that you have to start with Slanted and Enchanted if you're totally new to Pavement. When I really break it all down, I actually like, listen to, and have fun with Wowee Zowee more than any of their other records, but nobody can deny the charm and appeal of that first earth-shaking record. I'll be sentimental with my criticism, for once, and say that I still consider it my favorite Pavement record simply because it was my first. Here, then, is my ranking...in case anybody cares:

1) Slanted and Enchanted
2) Wowee Zowee
3) Crooked Rain, Crooked Rain (and, yes, "Hit the Plane Down" is disgustingly bad...how the shit did that end up on an album while "Preston School of Industry" never got past the demo stage...?)
4) Brighten the Corners
5) Terror Twilight (AKA, The First Malkmus Solo Album)

Seriously, though...fuck Nigel Godrich, that shithead.

 

[Anu]

Thanks for this thread.

I'm seeing Malkmus at Langerado soon, so I need to study up a little.

 

[UberBeaver]

Pavement rocks. Crooked Rain, Crooked Rain is excellent and a good place to start. Slanted is a little less accessible for a first listen, but after a bit it grows on you and it's brilliant as well.

 

[lazarus]

Thanks for this thread.

I'm seeing Malkmus at Langerado soon, so I need to study up a little.

You are in for a treat, that's all I can say. Janet Weiss from Sleater-Kinney is now on drums and backing vocals, and the made the band twice as good.

Plus, I just saw the Jicks a couple months ago, and half the show was new material. It was the most rocking, exciting stuff I've heard from them to date, and I love al three SM solo albums. Some really long jams...the band is TIGHT.

 

[u2popmofo]

Digging this back up so I don't hijack any other threads trying to talk Pavement with Lazarus. Looks like If You Shout is a fan too, so we may end up with more people to talk to.

This is a band I seem to find myself randomly getting into the mood to listen to them every few months. I recently came across the video to 'Major Leagues', which I'd never seen before, and fell back in love with the song. Here's the vid, by the way:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=13DfvdeH-io

I can't help but find this video incredibly endearing. It perfectly caught the whole "fun" essence of the band, which in a lot of ways is the major reason I like them.

Major Leagues was one of the first tracks from Terror Twilight that really caught me, and I still love it. Great tune, cool video.

 

[lazarus]

That Slow Century DVD that Matador is well worth the price. You get all Pavement videos with commentary, a really nice documentary about the band by Lance Bangs, and two video concerts. If you like the band you'll fall in love watching this thing.

I can't believe Malkmus' next album has been delayed until next year. The guy's been on an album every other year schedule since Pavement started:

Slanted=1991
Crooked Rain=1993
Wowee=1995
Corners=1997
Twilight=1999
S.M.=2001
Pig Lib=2003
Face the Truth=2005

How can he NOT release it in 2007? Will the world end with this even-numbered year business?

Maybe it's a good sign.

Also, the song Old Jerry, included on the Pig Lib bonus disc, is one of the top 10 Malkmus/Pavement songs. Discuss.

 

[u2popmofo]

I actually don't own any of his post-Pavement stuff, which is odd considering there are a number of those songs that I like even as much as some of my favorite Pavement tracks ('Do Not Feed the Oysters' is still a big highlight in my mind from the entire night I saw him and Radiohead).

I'd probably have to say that Brighten the Corners is my favorite album. Though it's not without its flaws, it has the largest number of tracks I love out of their albums. Slanted & Enchanted is extremely close though, I kinda go back and forth on which I think I prefer.

 

[lazarus]

It's surprising that Malkmus' solo albums are as unique and different from each other as the Pavement albums are. The self-titled was seen as maybe a bit too playful, but the individual songs really stand out, very upbeat and poppy for the most part.

Pig Lib goes the other way and is a lot muddier, really feels more like a band album with a lot more jamming and guitar solos (like the 11 minute 1% of 1). At times this is my favorite of the three because I love basking in S.M.'s axe-wielding prowess. Plus, if you include from the bonus disc the aforementioned Old Jerry, plus Dynamic Calories and Fractures & Feelings, it really puts this one over the top.

Face the Truth I think resembles Pavement the most, even though most of it was recorded by S.M. by himself. You have the long jams like No More Shoes, but then the looser, quirkier stuff like Kindling for the Master and Loud Cloud Croud. Baby Come On seems like an old school Pave rave-up, and Post Paint Boy sounds like it could have been on Brighten the Corners. I was really disappointed when this first came out, especially as I hated Pencil Rot, but the whole thing has grown on me over the last couple years.

As I said before, the new material that was played live rocks really hard, and Janet Weiss has breathed new life into the Jicks. I have very high hopes.

 

[u2popmofo]

So what are your favorite Pavement tracks?
(name as many or as few as you like)

 

[If you shout...]

It simply doesn't get any better than "Kennel District."

...Unless you're talking about "Gold Soundz" or "Summer Babe," that is.

 

[lazarus]

Listing a Spiral Stairs song as #1?

Ugh. Def HIS best, though.

Here's as short a list as I can manage:

Shoot the Singer
Frontwards
Trigger Cut
In the Mouth a Desert
Zurich is Stained
Cut Your Hair
Elevate Me Later
Gold Soundz
Range Life
Filmore Jive
Rattled by the Rush
Grounded
Father to a Sister of Thought
AT&T
Grave Architecture
Half a Canyon
Kennel District
Easily Fooled
Shady Lane
Old to Begin
Type Slowly
Blue Hawaiian
Starlings in the Slipstream
Fin (best Malkmus guitar solo ever)
You are a Light
Cream of Gold
Major Leagues
The Hexx
Carrot Rope

and solo S.M....

Jo Jo's Jacket
Church on White
Pink India
Vague Space
Do Not Feed the Oyster
Animal Midnight
1% of One
Us
Dynamic Calories
Fractures & Feelings
Old Jerry
It Kills
Freeze the Saints
No More Shoes
Post-Paint Boy
Baby C'mon
Real Emotional Trash (new)
Dragonfly Pie (new)
Hopscotch Willie (new)

 

[Cute Irish Bono]

I've tried to get into them since they're held in such high regard and considered seminal to the whole indie movement, but I just don't get what's so god damn spectacular about then.

Truthfully, I find myself bored by them.

I agree wholeheartly.

 

[Cute Irish Bono]

Does anyone else think think they sound like Sonic Youth?

 

[lazarus]

Sonic Youth couldn't write songs that good in a million years. They're better musicians, essential musical artists, but make nothing that sticks in your head. It's like indie jazz.

 

[LemonMelon]

Sonic Youth couldn't write songs that good in a million years. They're better musicians, essential musical artists, but make nothing that sticks in your head. It's like indie jazz.

Agreed. With SY, the melodies just aren't there. They could never write something as catchy as Range Life.

 

[lazarus]

To elaborate, since Crooked Rain, Pavement always seemed to have one foot in classic rock to a certain extent. They always knew it was about the tunes, even when deconstructing a great one.

 

[bollox]

i can't understand why pavement is so critically wanked on, i always found them boring as hell. see also: wilco

i made a pavement playlist from all their albums (save for terror twilight which i don't have) and i could only find 11 songs of theirs that i like, 5 of which were off slanted & enchanted

 

[zoetrope]

In the Mouth a Desert is still my favorite Pavement track even though some of the songs from Watery, Domestic come really close. It's all good though.

 

[u2popmofo]

I think a lot of "modern indie" fans have a hard time getting into Pavement because they're expecting it to sound like what popular indie music is today.

Actually, in general I notice a lot of the "hipster indie" type crowd has very little interest in important/influential "past" artists or albums. To some degree I can understand that, as it's sometimes a bit of a bummer to get extremely into a group that doesn't exist any more, as you know you'll never be able to see them live or get new music from them.

 

[LemonMelon]

To some degree I can understand that, as it's sometimes a bit of a bummer to get extremely into a group that doesn't exist any more, as you know you'll never be able to see them live or get new music from them.

Nick Drake
My Bloody Valentine
The Replacements

 

[u2popmofo]

Nick Drake
My Bloody Valentine
The Replacements

The Smiths
The Stone Roses
The Dismemberment Plan
The Beta Band
Ride
Slowdive
Grandaddy

etc

 

[lazarus]

Paul does play Replacements songs live (at least he used to), and they sound about as good as you could hope.

Haven't seen him in quite some time though. Apparently last year he accidentally drove a screwdriver through his hand and hasn't been playing anything since. Hopefully he's on the mend.

 

[If you shout...]

In the Mouth a Desert is still my favorite Pavement track even though some of the songs from Watery, Domestic come really close. It's all good though.

"Frontwards" is so fucking dope. I love that song. Has anybody heard the Los Campesinos! cover, which came out on Arts and Crafts' Sticking Fingers Into Sockets, this summer? It rivals the original, as far as I'm concerned--and that's high-ass praise, let me tell you.