kiss/chilli peppers don't get in HOF

[lazarus]

Re: Bowie on the charts

Pretty impressive, considering how weird some of his shit is. Station to Station at #3 and going gold? Low at #11? Even something like Tonight, widely considered one of his worst, hit #11 in the U.S.

Bottom line: his albums went gold (at least) consistently, and debuted in the Top 40 albums, usually higher. That's popular.

 

[allbecauseofu2]

not hard to beat the commercial success of the vu. they had none. lol.

 

[phillyfan26]

He had seven #1 albums in the UK, and over 20 top ten albums in the UK. Four top ten albums in the US. And he's had numerous compilation albums sell very well.

 

[LMP]

not hard to beat the commercial success of the vu. they had none. lol.

That reminds me of one of my favorite quotes:

"Only five thousand people ever bought a Velvet Underground album, but every single one of them started a band."
-- Brian (Motherfucking) Eno

 

[cobl04]

if i had a dollar for every time i've heard/read that quote...

 

[lazarus]

Didn't Beano also say that 50 million people bought Shuttlecock albums, but only Cockplay started a band that failed so publicly in an attempt to capture the same magic?

 

[allbecauseofu2]

Bowie no showed his hof right?

 

[VintagePunk]

Someone I'd argue should be in waaaaaay before Kiss is Alice Cooper. And yet I don't think I've ever heard his name mentioned in relation to the HOF.

Kiss (and Gene Simmons - gag) are very good at marketing, but other than that and dressing up in costumes, what have they brought to music?

 

[allbecauseofu2]

most hard rock/metal guitarists revere ace frehley and kiss. I have heard this from their own mouths in many interviews. If your looking bash kiss from a no respect from other artists/no influence its not gonna work. They will tell you they brought alot to music, including the reason they themselves play rock to begin with.

 

[VintagePunk]

most hard rock/metal guitarists revere ace frehley and kiss. I have heard this from their own mouths in many interviews. If your looking bash kiss from a no respect from other artists/no influence its not gonna work. They will tell you they brought alot to music, including the reason they themselves play rock to begin with.

Most? You've taken polls? Kept records?

Are you a member of the Kiss Army, perchance?

 

[allbecauseofu2]

No. More like i listen to interviews of metal/hard rock artists who answer kiss every time they state who the biggest influence is. I have only been hearing this for only the last 15 years. Even a someone like trent renzor has said in interviews kiss got him started down the rock path. Do some research. yea, no hard rock/metal artist respects kiss. sure they don't. wow. Go use the commercial success is not a good way of judging entry into the hall of fame augment like everyone is.

 

[VintagePunk]

I'm fairly certain that I've been doing "some research" since before you were just a gleam in mommy and daddy's eyes. I never said that none of them were influenced by Kiss, but to say all of them were is ridiculous. Come on, it's not like they created an entirely new genre. Not even close.

Do you remember when Kiss broke out? I do; I was young, but I remember. Their marketing and merchandising, even back then, put that of boy bands to shame. Even Kiss owes a debt of gratitude to Alice Cooper, along with early 70's glam rock performers.


Eta - I don't have time to troll the entire internet for quotes, but this is just a sampling from his wiki article:

Rob Zombie, former frontman of White Zombie, claims his first "metal moment" was seeing Alice Cooper on Don Kirshner's Rock Concert.[76]

In a 1978 interview with Rolling Stone, Bob Dylan stated, "I think Alice Cooper is an overlooked songwriter".[77]

In the foreword to Alice Cooper's CD retrospective box set The Life and Crimes of Alice Cooper, John Lydon of The Sex Pistols pronounced Killer as the greatest rock album of all time, and in 2002 Lydon presented his own tribute program to Cooper on BBC radio.[78]

The Flaming Lips are longtime Alice Cooper fans and used the bass line from "Levity Ball" (an early song from the 1969 release Pretties for You) for their song "The Ceiling Is Bending". They also covered "Sun Arise" for an Alice Cooper tribute album. (Cooper's version, which closes the album Love It To Death, was itself a cover of a Rolf Harris song.)

In 1999 Cleopatra Records released Humanary Stew: A Tribute to Alice Cooper featuring a number of contributions from rock and metal all-star collaborations, including Dave Mustaine, Roger Daltrey, Ronnie James Dio, Slash, Bruce Dickinson, and Steve Jones.[79] The album was notable for the fact that it was possible to assemble a different supergroup for each cover version on the record, which gave an indication of the depth of esteem in which Cooper is held by other eminent musicians within the music industry.

Heavy metal rocker Jon Mikl Thor, also known as Thor, stated in an interview that Alice Cooper was his idol and hero.

A song by alternative rock group They Might Be Giants from their 1994 album John Henry entitled "Why Must I Be Sad?" mentions 13 Cooper songs, and has been described as being "from the perspective of a kid who hears all of his unspoken sadness given voice in the music of Alice Cooper; Alice says everything the kid has been wishing he could say about his alienated, frustrated, teenage world".[80]

Such unlikely non-musician fans of Cooper included Groucho Marx and Mae West, who both reportedly saw the early shows as a form of vaudeville revue,[81] and artist Salvador Dalí, who on attending a show in 1973 described it as being surreal, and made a hologram, First Cylindric Chromo-Hologram Portrait of Alice Cooper's Brain.

 

[allbecauseofu2]

oh the old just because i'm old i know everything bullshit. Hey pal, i never said anything bad about alice cooper. he should be in. I never said they invented a genre. But i fully believe most, not all, but most hard rock/metal bands were influenced by kiss. I have heard many artists cite kiss. . You asked the question, what did they bring to music. That seemed to me like you were not gonna give them credit for anything other then the dressing up stuff. The closest i come to agreeing with you is, that alice should be in before kiss. But kiss should be in.

 

[VintagePunk]

You're a pleasant fellow. No wonder so many people in this thread are enjoying their conversations with you. Pal.

 

[UberBeaver]

KISS were toys that played bad music. If there's any HOF they should be in it's the Toys That Play Bad Music Hall of Fame. They should not be in any "real" hall of fame. However, the rock and roll hall of fame being a sort of sham/bullshit anyhow, maybe KISS should be in. I dunno. Bottom line is both KISS and the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame suck equally.

 

[allbecauseofu2]

i respond to arrogance with arrogance. Your "gleam in your mommys eye " crap i consider to be a insult. So i respond in kind. I defend kiss, and you assume i must be in the kiss army. I don't think that was meant to be complementary.

 

[VintagePunk]

And you told me to do research, implying I don't know what I'm talking about. That's not arrogance? Just letting you know that I've been doing research for more years than you've been alive.

KISS were toys that played bad music. If there's any HOF they should be in it's the Toys That Play Bad Music Hall of Fame. They should not be in any "real" hall of fame. However, the rock and roll hall of fame being a sort of sham/bullshit anyhow, maybe KISS should be in. I dunno. Bottom line is both KISS and the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame suck equally.

Awesome. Can that be housed next to the Hall of Misfit Toys?

 

[LMP]

I love online bitchslaps.

YouTube - CHERRY DR. PEPPER Gene Simmons

That just makes me sad.

 

[Jive Turkey]

Hey, can someone name a good Kiss song that wont get a lot of laughs?

 

[Jive Turkey]

Do some research

Probably should have done the same before the Bowie comment..... just sayin'

 

[LemonMelon]

Hey, can someone name a good Kiss song that wont get a lot of laughs?

The debut album isn't too awful. I rather like Cold Gin, and the Replacements covered Black Diamond, so you know that song has some level of credibility. Can't think of too many others.

 

[phillyfan26]

Allbecauseofu2, just wondering, did you attend a top 5 UK university?

 

[VintagePunk]

Honestly, I think they're more cultural icons than any sort of musical innovators. I remember them being everywhere circa 76 - 77, and then they faded into being a niche band, with their core group of fans. They're more deserving than AC/DC, who I actively detest, probably more on par with Aerosmith, a safe, mediocre choice that not that many people are going to argue with.

Again though, in the grand scheme of things, the HOF doesn't have a ton of credibility, so it doesn't matter much.

 

[lazarus]

Allbecauseofu2, just wondering, did you attend a top 5 UK university?

Be careful, Peef. The person you're interrogating might KNOW people.

 

[Hewson]

The debut album isn't too awful. I rather like Cold Gin, and the Replacements covered Black Diamond, so you know that song has some level of credibility. Can't think of too many others.

Detroit Rock City?

 

[allbecauseofu2]

first, i checked bowie's us sales and while he had alot of gold records, thats not "huge". Led zeppelin is huge. And i had mentioned , i was going by us numbers. Low wasn't exactly frampton comes alive. Hey , unless no ones been updating his sales here. I asked does anyone have his us soundscans?

vintage, how about admitting you already were backtracking after i called you out about the influence. You asked the question, what did kiss bring to music?. i said, they are a major influence on many hard rock artists. Then you said you never said none were influenced by them, just not as many as i made it out to be. Wait a second. Then your admitting that you do feel SOME were influenced by kiss. You didn't mention that belief in your trashing of the band that before. You were doing research before i was born? great. Too bad thats all irreverent to this thread. Unless you were somehow researching kiss's influence on post 1970's hard rock while it was still actually the 1970's.Thats amazing. Excuse me while i go find out how the killers influenced the the rock movement of the 2020's.

 

[Jive Turkey]

first, i checked bowie's us sales and while he had alot of gold records, thats not "huge". Led zeppelin is huge. And i had mentioned , i was going by us numbers. Low wasn't exactly frampton comes alive. Hey , unless no ones been updating his sales here. I asked does anyone have his us soundscans?

Again, why does the US only matter? A little bit more research and you would find that he was, indeed huge. Thats not even debatable

 

[allbecauseofu2]

i didn't say it did. But since i'm from the us, my initial reaction is that, he wasn't huge commercially save for a few moments. I checked out his UK sales. I'm disappointed earthling didn't do better.

 

[VintagePunk]

vintage, how about admitting you already were backtracking after i called you out about the influence. You asked the question, what did kiss bring to music?. i said, they are a major influence on many hard rock artists. Then you said you never said none were influenced by them, just not as many as i made it out to be. Wait a second. Then your admitting that you do feel SOME were influenced by kiss. You didn't mention that belief in your trashing of the band that before. You were doing research before i was born? great. Too bad thats all irreverent to this thread. Unless you were somehow researching kiss's influence on post 1970's hard rock while it was still actually the 1970's.Thats amazing. Excuse me while i go find out how the killers influenced the the rock movement of the 2020's.

Um...

You're just baffling. You initially said

most hard rock/metal guitarists revere ace frehley and kiss. I have heard this from their own mouths in many interviews. If your looking bash kiss from a no respect from other artists/no influence its not gonna work. They will tell you they brought alot to music, including the reason they themselves play rock to begin with.

I didn't backtrack on a damn thing. I can't backtrack on something I didn't say in the first place. I questioned your assertion that "most" have been influenced by them. That's ridiculous.

Yup, I stopped paying attention to music the minute you were born, you got me there!

Just because someone doesn't hold a mediocre band up to the same standards you do doesn't mean that they're "trashing" them.

So, tell me who exactly Kiss have had this tremendous influence on (and then we'll judge whether or not these influencees even carry any musical weight themselves), and then tell me, other than just naming "bands influenced by..." exactly what Kiss has done that's musically innovative. What genre did they develop or expand, and how has this had a lasting impact on music? What was unique about them musically? What did they do that no one before them had done?

 

[LMP]

KISS... they... "Love Gun..." blah!

Fucking Bowie never made it in the States!