kiss/chilli peppers don't get in HOF

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The only album of his that I've heard in full is Scarecrow, and it's pretty damn fine for what it is. No idea why he chose to become Toby Keith, but his lyrics weren't always such crap.

Re: Petty, I don't think he was far more significant than Mellencamp, but I think it's fair to say that Petty at least showed more versatility throughout his career than the other. Of course, I will admit to my biases: I am a huge fan. Up to and including Hard Promises, I think the Heartbreakers were pretty much unstoppable. And, as a solo act, Full Moon Fever has those singles, and Wildflowers is pretty excellent as a whole.

I think that whole second tier of so-called "heartland" rockers behind Springsteen (Petty, Mellencamp, Seger) all had their moments, and most definitely have a few albums in their catalogs that can be considered near-classics.
 

I heard something on the radio the other day that blew me away. Of all the "catalogue albums" (those that had been in the top 100 and dropped out, greatest hits, reissues, etc) one of Seger's greatest hits packages was the top selling of the decade. I think Dark Side of the Moon came in at number 3.
 
Oh yeah, I really need to listen to more Seger. Other than Old Time Rock And Roll, which can go fuck itself, everything I've heard by him has been awesome. I'll probably pick up the aforementioned quintillion-times-platinum GH collection or something.
 
Oh yeah, I really need to listen to more Seger. Other than Old Time Rock And Roll, which can go fuck itself, everything I've heard by him has been awesome. I'll probably pick up the aforementioned quintillion-times-platinum GH collection or something.

Night Moves and Turn The Page still give me chills. The other day, I heard Still the Same on the radio, and was shocked at how much I enjoyed it.

Old Time Rock and Roll makes me want to stab someone's eyes out, however. Serious hate.
 
The last wedding reception I was at, I vowed that if they played it, rather than watch all the 50 and 60 year olds get up and dance, I'd take back my gift and leave in protest.

Someone has to make a stand against this shit.
 
Isn't selling your song to a corporation for a commercial selling out in its purest form? Should we praise him for this?

Not in this case. I'm not sure if it was Mercury or another label, but his label wasn't really that interested in promoting the song. But, Chevy was interested, so they kind of made a little quid pro quo deal with him where they would feature his song heavily in their ads in return for helping him promote his new material. They gave more of a fuck than his label did. I know this because John was featured in a show called Center Stage on the YES network where he discussed this particular topic.

But, I too got sick of the song when they played it to death and they're still playing it now for Christ's sake!

I'm pretty indifferent to "selling out". An artist is entitled to cash in on what they've done. Ya gotta pay the bills, right? But, I'll leave the debate for others.
 
An artist is entitled to cash in on what they've done.

"Artist" and "cash in" shouldn't be used in the same sentence, which is the whole problem with that way of thinking. An artist is entitled, and encouraged to MAKE A LIVING on what they've done, but your phrasing implies that being an artist is a means to an end, and that end being turning a profit on it. The end should be making a connection with people based on your self-expression.

Of course, most people these days are opportunistic whores, but artists USED to represent some kind of ideal, not a way to "get paid" without having to work like everyone else.
 
Night Moves > Petty & Mellencamp's entire careers put together

Night Moves is a great song and all, but Petty and Mellancamp have plenty of great songs too. Have you completely erased their 80's and 90's work? Full Moon Fever was a pretty fuckin' good album! Mellancamp's Scarecrow is also pretty fuckin' good. What's also interesting is that both Petty and Mellencamp have been more commerically and critically successful than Seger. But Seger did put out a number of great songs. Remember when Chevy featured Like a Rock in their truck commercials? Wow, he and Mellancamp have another thing in common. :wink:
 
I stand by my remark. If the world had to exist without one or the other, I'd take Night Moves. And I'm not even talking about the whole album.
 
I stand by my remark. If the world had to exist without one or the other, I'd take Night Moves. And I'm not even talking about the whole album.

I hear ya, I was just mentioning albums because both featured a number of great songs. Like I said, I think Night Moves is a great song. It's my favorite Seger song even. Obviously, you're just not giving Petty and Mellancamp their props because you couldn't give two rat's asses about them in the first place. Which is fine. You are certainly entitled to your opinion. But one thing that is a fact is that individually, both Petty and Mellancamp have been more commercially and critically successful than Seger.

But, the 94 version of the Night Moves video featured Friends' star, Matt LeBlanc, so you got that going for ya too. :wink:
 
No, I do like Mellencamp a good deal; as I said, I own like 4-5 of his albums, even saw him in concert back in the day. And while I think Petty is majorly overrated, I have a few of his as well and think he's a decent chap.

But I think that Night Moves alone is a greater accomplishment than everything those two did. I think the world would be a sad place without it. Free Fallin' and Jack & Diane we could probably afford to lose. I'm not really talking about commercial success at all, and I think Seger has a better critical reputation than you might think.
 
Well I grew up listening to The Eagles, John Mellencamp, Bryan Adams and Bob Seger. I've got The Eagles best of, and I think it's awesome. They're not the greatest of bands going around, no, but as indra said those songs were (and still are, really) everywhere and I think they deserve their place.

We do have to remember that our opinions aren't making the decisions here.

I unashamedly love Hotel California, One of These Nights, Take it Easy, Jack and Diane, I Need A Lover, Hurts So Good, Summer of '69, Heaven, Waking up the Neighbours (album), Nightmoves, Mainstreet, Travellin' Man... :shrug:
 
I can't stand The Eagles. Their music just feels too slick and soulless for me. I suppose you could say the same about Steely Dan, a band a adore, but The Eagles lack their sense of droll humor and irony. All they seem to be able to churn out is unremarkable, if well-performed, soft rock.
 
Well I grew up listening to The Eagles, John Mellencamp, Bryan Adams and Bob Seger. I've got The Eagles best of, and I think it's awesome. They're not the greatest of bands going around, no, but as indra said those songs were (and still are, really) everywhere and I think they deserve their place.

We do have to remember that our opinions aren't making the decisions here.

I unashamedly love Hotel California, One of These Nights, Take it Easy, Jack and Diane, I Need A Lover, Hurts So Good, Summer of '69, Heaven, Waking up the Neighbours (album), Nightmoves, Mainstreet, Travellin' Man... :shrug:

I really don't give a shit. All we have in judging any act are facts and figures and our own opinions. Give 'em gold and platinum records to hang on their walls, award the engineers/producers for their production quality, have some popular acts throw some benefit concerts every once and a while, that's all great. I love studying music history and how it intersects with the socio-political outlook of the day, and guys like The Eagles, KISS, Aerosmith, AC/DC, they're blips on the radar. Everyone's kissing their asses because they sold a lot of records, which is respectable in its own right, but you don't see people lauding Transformers 2 as one of the greatest movies ever made because it made a lot of money, if you'll allow me to make a film analogy for a second. Why shouldn't the same principle apply to pop music?Voting in a Favorite is a lot different than something Important.

Don't tell me that my opinion doesn't hold any weight or that someone else's is superior. What else do we got, you know?

For the record, I think that "Hotel California" and "Jack & Diane" are fantastic songs, and haven't listened to enough Seger to throw out a thought on his material.
 
good good. it a free for all now. how about kraftwerk? should be in? iron maiden? judas priest? hey, anyone believe billy joel shouldn't be in? i think he should be, but i have a feeling someone on here can make some kinda statement he doesn't have enough hits. I think what kraftwerk did is 1,000 times higher up the artistic ladder then rush. i;m sure someone disagrees with me. i'm actually not sure what to think of the mellencamp vs everyone else discussion. I can see the point where he appears to be a wanna be of older artists. although i think he has made some good songs. Don't forget the other artists that actually did make the HOF this year. cliff,stooges,abba.
 
Here's the point: having a hall of fame for a subjective medium is completely and utterly stupid. Because its a subjective medium, they seem to often overemphasize the objective (sales, hits, and the like). Many times the objective comes ahead of any consensus on actual artistic achievement. For this reason, Nickleback (band of the DECADE according to Billboard) will be inducted in a couple decades, and may G-d have mercy on our souls.

/thread
 
^ yep. thread should have been locked with that as the final post.

I really don't give a shit. All we have in judging any act are facts and figures and our own opinions. Give 'em gold and platinum records to hang on their walls, award the engineers/producers for their production quality, have some popular acts throw some benefit concerts every once and a while, that's all great. I love studying music history and how it intersects with the socio-political outlook of the day, and guys like The Eagles, KISS, Aerosmith, AC/DC, they're blips on the radar. Everyone's kissing their asses because they sold a lot of records, which is respectable in its own right, but you don't see people lauding Transformers 2 as one of the greatest movies ever made because it made a lot of money, if you'll allow me to make a film analogy for a second. Why shouldn't the same principle apply to pop music?Voting in a Favorite is a lot different than something Important.

Don't tell me that my opinion doesn't hold any weight or that someone else's is superior. What else do we got, you know?

For the record, I think that "Hotel California" and "Jack & Diane" are fantastic songs, and haven't listened to enough Seger to throw out a thought on his material.

i will say that i think there'd be millions of shitty pub bands who would cite AC/DC & Kiss as their greatest influences.

but can't argue with any of that mate. :up:
 
some can argue that rock has no business being artistic in the first place. A music, that started off as 3 chords, hip shaking,nonsense lyrics, and is the soundtrack to teenage rebellion. I once took a music theory course in school, and had a textbook. rock music made up approx 2 pages in a over 200 page book. YES and RUSH may be far more gifted then the average rocker, but ac/dc is closer to the true spirit of rock and roll. Rock is nothing compared to the "real" music that has been around for hundreds of years. Its great when a band can bring some artistic elements to the table, and think outside the box, but i'm not gonna start acting like thats been at the heart of rock since day 1. It certainty has not. Elvis sang , 3 min pop numbers. He didn't make 20 min jazz/rock fusion pieces. Thats why i have no problem awarding someone entry into the HOF based on commercial success. Because its the ROCK and ROLL hall of fame. Its' not the jazz,classical,opera HOF.
 
some can argue that rock has no business being artistic in the first place. A music, that started off as 3 chords, hip shaking,nonsense lyrics, and is the soundtrack to teenage rebellion. I once took a music theory course in school, and had a textbook. rock music made up approx 2 pages in a over 200 page book. YES and RUSH may be far more gifted then the average rocker, but ac/dc is closer to the true spirit of rock and roll. Rock is nothing compared to the "real" music that has been around for hundreds of years. Its great when a band can bring some artistic elements to the table, and think outside the box, but i'm not gonna start acting like thats been at the heart of rock since day 1. It certainty has not. Elvis sang , 3 min pop numbers. He didn't make 20 min jazz/rock fusion pieces. Thats why i have no problem awarding someone entry into the HOF based on commercial success. Because its the ROCK and ROLL hall of fame. Its' not the jazz,classical,opera HOF.

see:

Here's the point: having a hall of fame for a subjective medium is completely and utterly stupid. Because its a subjective medium, they seem to often overemphasize the objective (sales, hits, and the like). Many times the objective comes ahead of any consensus on actual artistic achievement. For this reason, Nickleback (band of the DECADE according to Billboard) will be inducted in a couple decades, and may G-d have mercy on our souls.

/thread

let's stop, my head is starting to hurt.
 
I'll probably pick up the aforementioned quintillion-times-platinum GH collection or something.

Get "Live Bullet".
Seger was always at his best live. It contains the version of "Turn the Page" that everyone knows from radio(well at least everyone knew before Metallica covered it:wink:), much better than the studio version.
 
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