Kanye West - My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy - Page 24 - U2 Feedback

Go Back   U2 Feedback > Lypton Village > Lemonade Stand > Just the Bang and the Clatter
Click Here to Login
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 01-03-2011, 06:53 AM   #346
Rock n' Roll Doggie
FOB
 
nielsgov's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Belgium
Posts: 8,600
Local Time: 09:14 PM
Yes I've heard that this album isn't "normal" hip-hop but I don't know anything about the genre so I just tried this because it got so much praise. Thanks for the tip.
__________________

__________________
nielsgov is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2011, 10:13 AM   #347
ONE
love, blood, life
 
powerhour24's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Boston
Posts: 11,645
Local Time: 04:14 PM
Why not listen to Kanye's earlier albums? Personally Twisted Fantasy does not top College Dropout or Late Registration.
__________________

__________________
powerhour24 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2011, 12:30 PM   #348
Rock n' Roll Doggie
VIP PASS
 
If you shout...'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Chicago
Posts: 5,377
Local Time: 02:14 PM
I didn't write this, so don't yell at me!
__________________
If you shout... is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2011, 01:02 PM   #349
Blue Crack Addict
 
onebloodonelife's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 15,106
Local Time: 03:14 PM
THANK YOU!

My favorite bit was this, while talking about the leaked "Monster" video:

Quote:
It’s hard not to think of lynchings, of sexual violence. It’s hard not to feel a little nauseous, and a lot sad. The video is empty provocation and clumsy art, the move of someone who, in a climate of unchecked glorification, has been given too much rope to play with. Maybe not enough for a backlash, but had this video been released four weeks ago, certainly enough to get some people to change their votes.
I seriously wish people hadn't had so much of the Kanye Kool-Aid. This isn't even the best hip-hop album of the year, let alone album of the year. Color me unimpressed with the acclaim it's getting.
__________________
onebloodonelife is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2011, 01:05 PM   #350
Blue Meth Addict
 
u2popmofo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Texas
Posts: 36,961
Local Time: 02:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by onebloodonelife View Post
I seriously wish people hadn't had so much of the Kanye Kool-Aid. This isn't even the best hip-hop album of the year, let alone album of the year. Color me unimpressed with the acclaim it's getting.
Seconded.

I like a number of the songs, but there's a good amount of filler on it for my tastes as well. There are other Kanye albums I like far more, as well as other 2010 hip hop albums.
__________________
u2popmofo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2011, 02:51 PM   #351
Rock n' Roll Doggie
FOB
 
iron yuppie's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Chicago
Posts: 9,445
Local Time: 02:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by onebloodonelife View Post
I seriously wish people hadn't had so much of the Kanye Kool-Aid...Color me unimpressed with the acclaim it's getting.
I feel the same way, actually. I won't question the musical content because I'm not terribly familiar with hip-hop, but the lyrical content to me is the sound of someone reveling in stereotypes for an hour. On that account, the reviews - especially that of Pitchfork - that try to uphold it as some type of intellectual statement have really grated on me.

That said, I also realize that lyrics are not the sole arbiter of an album's quality. Maybe it is a musically ground-breaking album; I just don't know enough about the genre to determine that.
__________________
iron yuppie is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2011, 03:15 PM   #352
The Male
 
LemonMelon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Hollywoo
Posts: 65,807
Local Time: 12:14 PM
The Monster video is pulp, just like much of the record's lyrical content. I'm disappointed that some people are taking the album too seriously to have fun with it.
__________________


Now.
LemonMelon is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2011, 05:51 PM   #353
ONE
love, blood, life
 
Canadiens1131's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 10,363
Local Time: 04:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LemonMelon View Post
The Monster video is pulp, just like much of the record's lyrical content. I'm disappointed that some people are taking the album too seriously to have fun with it.
Indeed.

For me, half of Kanye's appeal is that he isn't that great of a rapper, despite being a great record producer. When he follows up a good line with a really clunky, downright bad metaphor, or trips over sections of his lyrics haphazardly, it's charming.
__________________
Canadiens1131 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2011, 11:02 AM   #354
ONE
love, blood, life
 
powerhour24's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Boston
Posts: 11,645
Local Time: 04:14 PM


Though I would say most of his lyrics on this album were stronger than his past efforts.
__________________
powerhour24 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-2011, 05:19 PM   #355
Blue Crack Addict
 
onebloodonelife's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 15,106
Local Time: 03:14 PM
Here I am yet again, killjoy of everything Kanye, because this article has brought up the issues I have with this album far more eloquently than I have thus far.

On White She-Devils | Atlantic Mobile

Quote:
On White She-Devils
Ta-Nehisi Coates | Jan 3, 2011


I like the beats on Kanye West's new album. I love the inversion of that famous line about Malcolm X--"That's too much power for one man to have." I think he's an improved MC. But I'm a little amazed that no one's disturbed by "Champagne wishes/30 white bitches" as a hook. I'm more amazed at his empty employment of white women as objects. I'm less amazed, but pretty depressed, that colorism is back--"Rolling with some light-skin chicks and some Kelly Rowlands," is little more than "you're pretty for a dark-skin girl" in this postracial era.

All told, the album strikes me as incredibly, almost casually, racist. On some level, I wonder what would have become of John Mayer, had he cut a video with dead black women strewn about and invoked black women throughout his lyrics in the manner Kanye does. But moralism misses the point here. The problem isn't simply racism or sexism, but boring racism, boring sexism that hearkens back to the black power macho of Amiri Baraka and Eldridge Cleaver at their worst. It's the work of a failed provocateur boorishly brandishing his ancient affects. The obvious defense is that this is an exploration of West's psyche, of his fantasy. But actually it isn't. This is an aggressively external album obsessed with dismissing haters, slut-shaming women (black and white), and ultimately, not with Kanye or his fantasy, but with what you will surely say about his fantasy.

Never has someone shouted "Kiss my ass" and sounded less convincing than Kanye West. No, seriously. Paying Chris Rock to play the cuckolder and yell, "Yeeze reupholstered my pussy," is not a stroke of genius, it's a lack of artistic courage. It means even on arguably the most emotionally painful cut, you're not convinced that the song can stand on its own. Always when listening to Kanye, I feel like I'm in a Monty Python sketch and someone is repeatedly yakking, repeatedly announcing "Know what I mean? Nudge, nudge!" I love the line "they can kiss my whole ass," but when it's followed by "More specifically, they can kiss my asshole," you fail. Lyrically.

And I like the album. I like "POWER." I like "All Of The Lights" I like damn near every beat on the record. Nicki Minaj is a terror, and her closer on "Monster" called me back to Busta in the era of "Scenario." But maybe I'm old. Or maybe I can't bear to re-hash Soul On Ice over some (admittedly dope) beats. More likely, I'm tired of rappers who deploy slut-shame to smoke-screen their near total fear of pussy. The comparison with Prince is, again, instructive. There's something hard about submission, and something really weak in Kanye's fear of losing control, in his need to address your commentary on him losing control.


Probably my favorite (and most encompassing of the myriad issues at play here) comment:

Quote:
I don't think the idea is that "white" is the problem. It's "white" AND it's "bitches." Especially when it comes to black/white race relations in this country (though it's true for other ethnicities as well--William Hung, anyone?), there are huge intersections between gender and race in terms of cultural constructs, context, and perception. Examples: Fear of miscegenation (specifically between black men and white women); dehumanization of black women into sexual receptacles who suffer less from rape (no, really); black men seen as hyper-virile, animalistic sex machines; white men as lacking in masculinity, terrified of the sexual power of black men over their wives, daughters, and selves. You can't talk about just race or just gender in this space; they're tangled.

With that in mind, I don't think just saying that he WANTS white bitches makes it a positive comment on white bitches. It's not, "I want white bitches because each white bitch I encounter enriches my life and brings a new perspective to my worldview." It's not even "I want white bitches because I am attracted to white women and 'bitch' is just the word that I used because that's how I roll"--which would have its own problems: It's "I want white bitches because I collect objects that raise my status." The cited desire for white bitches exists within a history of white women viewed as a sexual commodity, conferring social power, that black and white men struggle over.


The argument you're making is not unlike excuses that get made for a lot of sexist rhetoric: "I don't mean bitch in a bad way," "it's just a compliment, jeez," etc. Words do not exist in a vacuum. Context matters.
__________________
onebloodonelife is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-2011, 05:47 PM   #356
Rock n' Roll Doggie
FOB
 
Imperor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Austin
Posts: 9,043
Local Time: 02:14 PM
Here's a thought: "Monster" would be the best song on the album if it weren't for that limp dick Jay-Z verse.
__________________
Imperor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-2011, 05:48 PM   #357
Blue Crack Addict
 
PhilsFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Standing on the shore, facing east.
Posts: 18,886
Local Time: 03:14 PM
Maybe not the best, but it would certainly be an improvement. He's pretty good on So Appalled, but his verse on Monster blows.
__________________
PhilsFan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-2011, 05:53 PM   #358
Rock n' Roll Doggie
FOB
 
Imperor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Austin
Posts: 9,043
Local Time: 02:14 PM
Damn near ruins the song for me. If you're that disinterested, just don't even do it.

Kind of weird that this is my first time speaking about this album, eh?
__________________
Imperor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-2011, 06:43 PM   #359
Blue Crack Distributor
 
VintagePunk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: In a dry and waterless place
Posts: 55,732
Local Time: 03:14 PM
Fully Validated Kanye West Retires To Quiet Farm In Iowa | The Onion - America's Finest News Source

__________________
VintagePunk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-2011, 08:35 PM   #360
Blue Crack Distributor
 
corianderstem's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Seattle
Posts: 63,730
Local Time: 12:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by onebloodonelife View Post
Here I am yet again, killjoy of everything Kanye, because this article has brought up the issues I have with this album far more eloquently than I have thus far.
Thanks for posting that. Even for an album I casually like (by which I mean I like a lot of the songs but don't pay much attention to the lyrics; I care more about the beats and samples than the words), I'm interested in reading stuff like this.
__________________

__________________
corianderstem is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
kanye west

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:14 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Design, images and all things inclusive copyright © Interference.com