This voice in my head...

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U2Kitten said:

I can't understand how anyone could make a 'life decision' disregarding the life of their pets. I'd never go anywhere they weren't welcome.

Good grief!

I have a dog now, he's really become a family pet since I'm living with my parents at the moment. I'm going to law school in September, and he can't come with me. Not only is he not permitted in my apartment but even if he were, he wouldn't like it there! He's a large collie, used to having a large yard and people to walk him. So I am leaving him with my parents, who are near retirement, who walk him multiple times a day, take him boating with them, fishing, and so on. He's going to have a much better life with them than he would with me, cooped up when I'm gone most of the day. And I'll have a better life because of going back to school as well.

It sounds to me like LivLuv has thought a lot about the care of her pets, probably more than a lot of other people would have and has viable, believable options. Life is flexible, things change. If people can up and move around the world, if refugees can be shipped to another continent and they adjust to their new surroundings, language, culture and absence of family, then for God's sake, so can a cat.
 
Yes, Michelle, pets ARE part of the family, but you're forgetting that my pets' family is not restricted to just me. I'm already stressing about what happens if we DONT go to Africa - I've got to pack them up, move them away from their other "parents" (my friends) and split them from the other cats. Neither scenario is ideal, but animals are resillient and find ways to adjust.

My animals will never end up in some shelter or pound. My friends and family who would be taking them feel the same way I do about those places, not to mention that I'm planning on assuming all financial responsibility for them.

I don't think you can comment on how my parents feel about my animals just based on a few posts here. I was not allowed to have a large pet growing up because I lived in a neighborhood surrounded by gang wars and they love to steal dogs for fighting or status symbols or torture cats. Also, we couldn't afford to have the right veterinary car for a pet. My cats have spent weekends at my parents house and recently lived there with me for a month. My sister loves them almost as much as I do.

Animals are not a toy to me. I've said several times in threads that my "dream job", as rediculous as it sounds, is to work for the cheetah conservatory in Namibia or AfriCat in South Africa.
 
Angela Harlem said:
looks like everyone in here has the cats' welfare in mind. is there really a need for everyone to jump on each other?

cats :heart:

True that. Like stars said, the only lead I have so far is an org that requires us to be married for a minimum of one year before being considered, so it's not even a decision I'll have to make soon.
 
I think it's a bit silly for people who obviously like pets in here to be jumping down one another's throats over the topic :wink:

Just for the record, I've had a lot of cats and loved every one (except for the evil stray that terrorized my cats)

But when it comes down to it, if I have to decide to care for a human or a pet, I will give up the pet. Not to the pound or anything like that, but I would still give it up. To me a human life outweighs that of an animal life even though they are wonderful companions.

For instance, if I found the man of my dreams but he was violently allergic to my cat, I wouldn't be ditching the man for my cat, you know? :)
 
Can we not talk about cats anymore? There's a cat thread in LS for cat lovers. If someone has a problem with my decision (which is not really a decision at all at this point), please PM me or e-mail me. Thanks!
 
If I may add to this, Lies' cats would be taken by any of the 5 different people she has lived with and be fine. As Lies has said, they roam the house and the house has had lots of people in it that have taken care of them.

Now, back on topic. Africa. I want to go. Let's keep talking about it so I can get excited again!
love philk
 
MissVelvetDress_75 said:
sula,
This is great information you provided there. I am interested in working in an NGO but want the experience that something like the peacecorp will offer. I may contact you outside of this forum to discuss your experiences.

feel free to drop me a PM anytime. I'm always happy to talk about it. :)
 
OK, I'm getting rather frusterated here. I'm communicating with a lady who recruits for a programs I'm interested in. She keeps sending me information e-mails, including the apps for any new positions that have opened up. The problem is, every single one, no matter how short-term or non-existant the pay says you have to have 6 months minimum experience abroad, with four months consecutive. Anywhere else I look....similar requirements. So please tell me, how does one just acquire "experience abroad?" It's very frustrating to me because I have no clue how to resolve this and they seem to be avoiding this question. Dear Recruiter Lady, I'm sorry my parents were flat broke growing up and the best we could do was a piece of crap sandwiched between a crack house and a brothel. Yes, the first time I stepped on a plane was age 20 and no, we never had the luxury of being able to travel the world, so shoot me and give someone else the job because their trust fund sent them to China for a semester. :|
 
Perhaps find a way to volunteer for a few months first. It will show you can handle it, wont need to necessarily need to acclimatise, may have an added bonus of some language skills, and are able and willing to uproot as you have done it before. I suppose employers for this situation might see a graduate as a cost risk if they dont have the practical background.
 
Angela Harlem said:
Perhaps find a way to volunteer for a few months first. It will show you can handle it, wont need to necessarily need to acclimatise, may have an added bonus of some language skills, and are able and willing to uproot as you have done it before. I suppose employers for this situation might see a graduate as a cost risk if they dont have the practical background.

Yeah, if only I had enough $$$ to volunteer for months....

Is there really a "practical background" for anyone leaving everything behind and moving thousands of miles to a new place? It seems to me that no matter how many times you've gone to various other places for whatever reason, it's always going to be a shock and a bit stressful for the first part.
 
LivLuvAndBootlegMusic said:
The problem is, every single one, no matter how short-term or non-existant the pay says you have to have 6 months minimum experience abroad, with four months consecutive. Anywhere else I look....similar requirements. So please tell me, how does one just acquire "experience abroad?" It's very frustrating to me because I have no clue how to resolve this and they seem to be avoiding this question.

That's the same problem people trying to get a regular job deal with. Everybody wants you to have experience...but how do you get experience if nobody will give you a chance unless you already have it??? :crack: When that was the case for me, it meant working a fairly low-level, part-time job for pay barely above minimum wage, so that I could finally start getting some experience...and even that job was hard to come by! What does that translate to in your situation? I'm not sure...I'm unfamiliar with that territory. It may mean you would have to find a self-supported way of getting the experience though.
 
Bonochick said:


That's the same problem people trying to get a regular job deal with. Everybody wants you to have experience...but how do you get experience if nobody will give you a chance unless you already have it??? :crack: When that was the case for me, it meant working a fairly low-level, part-time job for pay barely above minimum wage, so that I could finally start getting some experience...and even that job was hard to come by! What does that translate to in your situation? I'm not sure...I'm unfamiliar with that territory. It may mean you would have to find a self-supported way of getting the experience though.

So true. Although a lot of times you can talk to people and kind of "fudge" through some of the requirements for jobs.

I think the reason it really bothers me is because I've grown up under the wing of this organization (as has my entire extended family for the past....100 years) and I see the people who meet their expectations and they're the people who've had everything handed to them on a silver platter and think it would be fun to move away for a while and no worries because daddy's got them covered financially back home. And it sucks because half of them don't last a DAY because their heart's not really in it, it's like a social justice fad to them (which compounds the lack of effectiveness - wasting time and resources on people who treat this like a mission trip and aren't committed long term). I'm not saying they don't deserve these opportunities, because everyone does, it's just extremely frustrating because this position is the lowest rung of the latter. It's just an internship. I guess I always understood internships to be like an extended trial period to see how you fit in long term.
 
LivLuvAndBootlegMusic said:


Yeah, if only I had enough $$$ to volunteer for months....

Is there really a "practical background" for anyone leaving everything behind and moving thousands of miles to a new place? It seems to me that no matter how many times you've gone to various other places for whatever reason, it's always going to be a shock and a bit stressful for the first part.

Well there is because in today's global society many people have lived abroad for extended periods of time. I've lived in the developing world for about 10 years, and overall I've lived in 4 countries, not because of a trust fund, but just because that's how things worked out. Apart from volunteering, this is the only real way to get "practical" experience, I guess.

My friend's b/f is in Tanzania right now. He is returning in September. It was a 4 month volunteer placement and he raised money for 2 years to do it. A lot of it was raising money through his local parish (he's Catholic) and he also got some alumni support from his university and so on. He managed to raise about $7000 to cover the costs of his travel and expenses.
 
anitram said:
My friend's b/f is in Tanzania right now. He is returning in September. It was a 4 month volunteer placement and he raised money for 2 years to do it. A lot of it was raising money through his local parish (he's Catholic) and he also got some alumni support from his university and so on. He managed to raise about $7000 to cover the costs of his travel and expenses.

I think this program does something like that, you spend about a year getting support and whatnot. I've no trouble doing this except for two things: 1) I'm not sure how I feel about soliciting for financial help when I basically need the money to cover my personal student debt expenses while volunteering or receiving a stipend (I'm fine with saving for travel expenses and such) and 2) the program I'm looking at is an introductory internship for people interested in moving abroad or going into missions so I guess I though the point was that THIS program would be like the one your friend is doing now. I explained to them we haven't done anything like this before and they put me in contact with a rep and she gave me all the info on these internship and said it would be along the lines of what we were looking for to get into this line of work, but now all the requirements are way above us. They are really starting to confuse me because they made it sound like the point of the program was to give people the chance to gain the experience.

I'm so confused because everything I look into turns out to be totally different from what it sounds like. I wanted to start with these orgs that are part of my family's history and part of this community, because the Dutch CRC people here are cheapskates, especially where the developing world is concerned, but tell them you're working for the CRCNA/CRWRC and they'll throw money at you, but I think something like PeaceCorp might make more sense now...
 
Lies, I just read your article. Very cool. Well, I made the decision to go on a short term work projects missions trip through my church next year/2007. Plus, I've been commited to donating money every month to a 5 yr old orphaned girl living in Ethiopia through Compassion International. I really gotta go see for myself what is going on in some of the poorer countries of Africa.
 
sonicsmurf said:
Lies, I just read your article. Very cool. Well, I made the decision to go on a short term work projects missions trip through my church next year/2007. Plus, I've been commited to donating money every month to a 5 yr old orphaned girl living in Ethiopia through Compassion International. I really gotta go see for myself what is going on in some of the poorer countries of Africa.

:up: I'm glad you found something that works for you. And, oh my gosh, I totally forgot I'd done that interview! :lol: Which reminds me, I have to go bug my Prof. about the textbook donations because he won't contact me back (he's probably in Africa right now).
 
Yeah, you do your thing too. Afterall, we're all fighting the same good cause. I do sense an subtle undertone, where those who did their part as short term missionaries or given monies is being discounted. I'm probably reading it wrong?
 
sonicsmurf said:
Yeah, you do your thing too. Afterall, we're all fighting the same good cause. I do sense an subtle undertone, where those who did their part as short term missionaries or given monies is being discounted. I'm probably reading it wrong?

Nah, every little bit helps. I just feel that personally, for long term growth and development, it's going to take a lot more than charities and aid money. I don't understand why our government likes to say we give so much aid, when at the same time we're crippling countries with debt. Also, I firmly believe that a short term visit can lead to long term action and committment (because I've only been there a month after all). The long term commitment is important. It's hard to say because if you say you prefer one or think one is more important, than it sounds like you think the other isn't important at all, or is bad, you know? The general impression I got from all the ELCT programs we visited in Tanzania was that they're really pulling for long-term support of grassroots movements, rather than outsiders coming in for a month or two at a time. I guess it's hard to find a balance because so many people want to volunteer help, but the orgs kept saying to puch for debt relief, push for debt relief. They receive so many donations and have so many of their own workers from their own community, they're just running out of resources from the government. I'm not an economist and I don't work for the ELCT, but this is just what I know from what I've seen and heard.
 
Just a few comments....

I don't think anyone would discount the experiences gained by short term missions trips, etc., but as someone who has lived long-term in many of the poor countries where people make these trips, I have to say that they are really most effective in giving the people from rich countries some perspective. They don't solve anything in the poor country, and they don't have much real long-term impact. I'm sorry if that sounds insensitive, but that's just what I've seen with my own eyes. Yes, buildings get built and projects get done, but in general those same buildings could have been built with local labour which would give people some money and a job. That said, it's a great thing for Americans to get outside of America and get a tiny taste of what the majority of the world's population experiences. If it opens eyes and hearts and minds so that the American has their perspective changed, then it's a good thing. :up:

Lies, I hate to sound like a broken record, and I promise that Peace Corps doesn't pay me to say this, but the experience factor is one of the biggest bonuses that Peace Corps would give you. 2 years of real on-the-ground experience which includes language skills, cross-cultural skills, and project management skills. Also, depending on where you're stationed, you probably would have the opportunity to network with a lot of the people who do work with NGOs. There are tons of organizations out there that you'd never know about until you're in the country.

Another thought, you might check out Geekcorps if you're at all business or technology inclined. I knew a lot of them in Mali, and they were mostly young globally minded people who were using their technical skills to help support small business development. They pay a little better than Peace Corps and I think the assignments are a lot shorter. Could be another way to get hands-on experience for the resume as well as build contacts.
 
sulawesigirl4 said:


Another thought, you might check out Geekcorps if you're at all business or technology inclined. I knew a lot of them in Mali, and they were mostly young globally minded people who were using their technical skills to help support small business development. They pay a little better than Peace Corps and I think the assignments are a lot shorter. Could be another way to get hands-on experience for the resume as well as build contacts.

:love: "technology inclined" hehe, I'm a computer technician w/ a business communications degree.

As always, I appreciate your input.

Phil and I talked yesterday. I think we've basically made our decision - stay where we are, even though we HATE it here, because it would not be worth it to deal with a 1500 mile move while finding temporary jobs so we can look into things like PeaceCorps Project HOPE, or whatever would work for us. The Project HOPE application process is a year long, so if we applied before Aug 17 and got accepted (which we wouldn't), we would not leave for Tanzania or Kenya until August 2007 (for a 30 month program). We're going to spend a few years working on this, then sell all our worldly possessions and get the hell out!
 
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sulawesigirl4 said:
JThere are tons of organizations out there that you'd never know about until you're in the country.

Oops, missed this comment before, but I wanted to say that even based on the very, very short experience I had, I found this to be one of the most signficant things I learned. Out of all the places we visited, I never heard a single mention of the the larger aid orgs and programs. There were tons of thriving grassroots orgs supported by and supporting people from the local community.
 
Question: Assuming this would work out with my future job, etc, would it be wise to audit a Kiswahili course at my college?
 
Well that only helps you in some parts of Africa. What if you get a placement in western or southern Africa where Swahili isn't an asset?

Most people I know who were applying for positions there (actually including the guy who is in Tanzania) spoke French at least passably.
 
:up:
I'm working with a guy here who did a field school in west africa last summer and he had to learn french while he was there in order to talk to people.
 
True, however our best possibility that we've been working on is definitely in East Africa, sometimes in Kenya but almost exclusively northern Tanzania, where they speak Kiswahili, English, and several native dialects you'd never learn in school (and there's also a LOT of German/Lutheran influence because it was settled and governed by Germany). West Africa - French sounds like a must.

I'm not sure how often this particular course is offered so I'm considering it since even if I never use it, it can never hurt to take any language class. I saw it in the course catalog and was like "holy crap, they teach Kiswahili at our school?!?!" :shrug:
 
LivLuvAndBootlegMusic said:
True, however our best possibility that we've been working on is definitely in East Africa, sometimes in Kenya but almost exclusively northern Tanzania, where they speak Kiswahili, English, and several native dialects you'd never learn in school (and there's also a LOT of German/Lutheran influence because it was settled and governed by Germany). West Africa - French sounds like a must.

I'm not sure how often this particular course is offered so I'm considering it since even if I never use it, it can never hurt to take any language class. I saw it in the course catalog and was like "holy crap, they teach Kiswahili at our school?!?!" :shrug:


For my major I need to demonstrate a profiency in a language and because of my interest in Africa, I chose French. From everything I am told, flunecy in French most definetly gives you a competitive edge, even over someone more "qualified". But my schoool also offers Swahili and I'm studying that for noncredit because it certainly can't hurt having familiarity with multiple languages in this line of work!
 
starsgoblue said:
But my schoool also offers Swahili and I'm studying that for noncredit because it certainly can't hurt having familiarity with multiple languages in this line of work!

Yeah, I'm thinking of auditing for non-credit, just for "fun", if you will. I haven't taken a language in a while because I qualified out of the requirement. If I had more time and $$ to devote to becoming a full time student again, French would be on the list, as well as finishing the IDS major. Whilst I was in college, our school totally re-vamped their IDS program, which was previously Third World Development Studies. At the time the major was unavailable so the best I could do was take as many classes as I could fit around my actual major. It would be nice to finish that degree now that they've got the program and faculty sorted out.
 
French would probably be more useful in the long-term as a language to have on your resume. However, if your school is offering a language like Kiswahili, I say go for it. It can't hurt in any case. :)

I'm going to audit Chinese this year because I think it's a language that is going to be increasingly important to have familiarity with in the future. Looking forward to it! :up:
 
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