Some Kind Advice Needed...

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Erm, arent you divorced diamond?

What happened to your 'contract' ?
 
Originally posted by doctorwho:
When I read through these articles, I don't see anyone say, "make your marriage work." But I do hear people, like myself, recommend seeing a counselor - and that is a GOOD thing.

Maybe for you it wasn't. But if you were so easily able to accept your husband leaving for another woman, that also suggests that you were also ready to end the relationship.

However, in most cases, I do feel that least an *attempt* at saving the relationship should be made. For example, is MacFly lusting after Sam because this is his "soul mate" - or has he finally come to the realization that he can no longer sleep with other women? Sam represents the "forbidden fruit." Additionally, I think they both need to work out a few issues. Why is MacFly's wife so dependent on him? Why is he so willing to run to another woman? He needs to work out his issues of guilt and confusion. Only a counselor can do this.

Therefore, to just say, "eh, get a divorce then bang away" is just as ignorant as saying "make your marriage work." At least an attempt should be made to save it. THEN, if things still aren't working, I fully agree that the marriage should end. Some peoople aren't meant to be married, and some marriages aren't meant to be. But all marriages will face road bumps, including attractions to other people. To end a marriage just because he has an attraction to a coworker is rather extreme.

ok i'll jump on the bandwagon for a second here:
maybe some would say its a good thing to see a marriage counselor, who knows it may work, but staying in a marriage when mac 'loves' another woman is just really sick. say the wife does find out...and she decides to 'make things work'...or she doesn't find out...either way, she loses. she'll probably never measure up to sam. and thats what makes me angry. she deserves someone who will look upon her the same way mac looks on sam. and even more. and thats why i'll never agree that marriage counseling is the answer in this case.

yeah, i guess you could say i was ready to end the relationship when my ex brought the whole thing up. if he would have just kept his mouth shut, then the sad thing is, i would have been there to this day. a man lusting after another woman and then wanting to end the marriage does something to a relationship. it killed every notion of safety and normality i had with my ex. the sad thing is...thats whats going to happen with mac and his wife, if he does speak to her about it. i was married for 7 years. i speak from experience.

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you've got to cry without weeping, talk without speaking, scream without raising your voice..

[This message has been edited by nellie (edited 05-09-2002).]
 
Yes diamond, I stated that I am not married, therefore can't offer advice, and did not!
I also did not talk about my views on marriage whatsoever. I have VERY strong views on it as a matter of fact, but I didnt want to bring that into the conversation as everyone else has done that here already.
So Im not sure why you a divorced man, is explaining to me, someone who would only marry once and plans on staying married once i have made the commitment, about the 'contract'.

But I do however somewhat agree with you on your last statement, albeit once again a little judgemental. Mac needs to talk to his wife, not us.

I'm glad to see this thread, although a lil harsh, has stayed civil.
 
Originally posted by paxetaurora:
Who here who is married or in a relationship has *never* had second thoughts?

::cricket noises::


Me, actually. I've been married 12 years and I've never had second thoughts about marrying my husband. I HAVE however, as I said in my post, had times where I wanted to throttle my husband. It's just that I took those vows seriously and we work on our marriage every day. It does take 2 - but it is a commitment that requires work and that's what I tried to say.

I also think that I said in my post that I think HE needs counseling himself - not just marriage counseling - to find out what his issues are. Otherwise, history will just repeat itself.

I don't think I was being too harsh or judgmental - just offering the advice he asked for.



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She's gonna dream up a world she wants to live in / She's gonna dream out loud.
Visit my web page at www.u2page.com
 
Originally posted by Arun V:

well...it is harsh..it's a harsh situation. and even though he hasn't done anything...we do have to make it clear that the serious consideration of it..is not a good thing.
Amen, Arun. He asked for people's advice. Something as serious as this cannot be candy- coated.
 
Originally posted by Sicy:
Erm, arent you divorced diamond?

What happened to your 'contract' ?

Yes Sicy Iam divorced.
And after yrs of marriage counseling and the counselors calling out my Ex, in sessions w/her present, more than a few suggested to her and me,- that she was a 'fraud'.
Her motives were transparent.
Our contract had to be cancelled as it takes two to keep this contract in force.
Yes I was married to a 'fraud' and I divorced her, and she was/is still greedy..
Perhaps I should of left her in the Dennys where I found her, waiting tables,I dunno.
confused.gif


Manda-
My advice is to attempt to share my life's experiences w/you and Mac, thats all.
And alot of ppl nowadays take the marriage commitment lightly like a lease agreement.
You do not appear this way.
When you do find the right person, I sincerely hope the best for you.
He will probalbly be a lucky cat.
smile.gif


DB9

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AIM= diamondbruno9


[This message has been edited by diamond (edited 05-09-2002).]
 
Originally posted by diamond:

When you do find the right person, I sincerely hope the best for you.
He will probalbly be a lucky cat.
smile.gif


DB9


manda is marrying me..there are no questions on this matter

sorry to break the seriousness of the thread.


80's thanks for understanding that this issue does not warrant sugar-coating. And I'm going to be honest again.

"intellectual complexities"..is a lot of BS..you dont' sound like your exactly coming up with the cure for cancer in your spare time. Ever consider that your wife may have some traits in you that she doesn't find up to par?????

[This message has been edited by Arun V (edited 05-09-2002).]
 
Originally posted by Arun V:
manda is marrying me..there are no questions on this matter

sorry to break the seriousness of the thread.


Brother Halfstar-
Plez talk to your soon to be spouse and procure me an invite.
I will be on hand,at the reception, to console the disgruntled and despondent harem girls.
Always here to help.
Your brother-
diamond
wink.gif


[This message has been edited by diamond (edited 05-09-2002).]
 
Well, I gotta agree with Sicy for the most part (not the cheating part, though)...which is also why I have no intention of getting married either. I think "til death do us part" is a nice fantasy and I have personally seen very few relationships that would alter my opinion. Most long-term marriages that I have seen should have ended a long time ago, in my opinion. Sorry, but that's my opinion... sad, but true.

Anyway, you've only been married two months...maybe you married the wrong person; if so, you could get the marriage annulled. Maybe you have commitment issues that have nothing to do with either of these women.

Either way, get professional counseling asap. Please don't make any decisions alone or in a state of pain and confusion. I'm not sure that talking about it with your wife is the right thing at this point without counseling first. You might want to be clearer about everything before 'dumping' on your wife. I don't mean 'dumping' to sound judgmental--but it does seem like you are too confused to have a conversation with her that wouldn't end up in her feeling 'dumped' on. Maybe there's a better word, though.




[This message has been edited by joyfulgirl (edited 05-09-2002).]
 
Oh oh oh poor man... and I am just having love troubles myself!

Well, my opinion is:

First: Calm down. However your decision will be, there is no reason to sleep badly or to have physical problems because you always turn around the same thought - what you should do. Get a break. Stop thinking, if you can manage that. Relax. You have all the time of the world to make your decision. And if you are at this point, you will be too nervous to realize what you really want.

Second: Find out what you really want. What were your motives for marrying your wonderful wife? That she is so sweet? What are your motives to love Sam? That she is so free and independent? Or other reasons?
Be careful not to step in the trap of picturing women out too much. I mean, the angel picture of your wife, the - maybe - "femme fatale" picture of Sam... compare your pictures to the real persons.

Third: Whatever you decide, think it through half way first. I, too, think that people should be married after years and years, and trust and trust, you know the good and bad times and this stuff. There is a lot of truth in this, and morality can be a very positive thing, but sometimes not the best solution. There are hundreds, really, hundreds of ways how people deal with relationships. And no one will be able to tell that this or that way is better.
I wouldn?t say you should "try how it works out in bed", but I neither would say you have to fear anything except of your own conscience, if you want to. And the hurt of your wife, if you tell her.
Anyway, to say the truth, I think it is not the top of the time to make love to Sam, is it? You should make love when you feel free, so that you can enjoy it with all your soul.

Four: If you decide to divorce, I really don?t know how you will tell your wife... I know this thought is a horror for you. Try to find a possibility (I know there is no possibility, but try) to hurt her the least possible. Maybe you should go away first, like to... leave her? But first, be sure about your feelings for her. Do you still love her, or is it dead? Do you fear to be unhappy with your wife in the future? Do you fear that Sam could also leave you, if you divorce and get together with her? Be sure, there is no guarantee. Never. Ever.

Five: Relax again. Try to find out how you are going to manage it without getting a heart attack. Take your time. Enjoy seeing Sam, try to be happy. Love yourself. It?s not your fault, falling in love with someone can happen to us (me too...).

Six: Get to act. Break with one of them. I know, it?s awfully sad, but hurt is part of any love, too. Get over it, if it is possible for both, stay friends (either with your wife or with Sam). You will push this through. You will need time to convince her to stay friends. You will need to give her a lot of time, to decide if she wants to be friends. Fight for her. And be happy with your decision.
 
If I did not fear being called names and such, I would say more; but being as it is, I inform you that I agree with a lot of the things doctorwho and Crzy4Bono said; and Diamond speaks with the qualified experience of a valuable point of view.

But please let me say this:

Extra-marital affairs are SOOOO 90s!
 
I know that this is a difficult subject, and let me say, once again, that I absolutely do not approve of extramarital relationships. But still, MacphistoFly came here in search of compassion as well as some advice.

Again, I'm sure most of you have good intentions. But still: I don't think any of us here can judge someone on the basis of things they've thought about. I've wanted to kill people sometimes, or at least seriously wound them. But I've never acted those impulses. Am I still a killer?

No one is perfect. Let's remember that we're dealing with *two* hurting people. I'm sure in the end that Machphistofly will make the right decision. As long as he remembers that honesty is always the best policy, he will be okay in the end.

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Well, the God I believe in isn't short on cash, mister. --Bono

But a day will come
In this dawning age
When an honest man
Sees an honest wage.
--The Edge
 
"Advising" him to seek counselling qualifies as "advice," doesn't it? I think that is what doctorwho and Crzy4Bono were doing; at least that is what I was doing in my concurrence with them.
 
Originally posted by paxetaurora:


Again, I'm sure most of you have good intentions. But still: I don't think any of us here can judge someone on the basis of things they've thought about. I've wanted to kill people sometimes, or at least seriously wound them. But I've never acted those impulses. Am I still a killer?




Ahh..but if you said that you were seriously considering killing someone and were not joking...and were actually considering acting on those emotions...I hope you'd realize..that's not very good.


I'm done beating the horse now
 
Originally posted by U2Bama:
If I did not fear being called names and such, I would say more; but being as it is, I inform you that I agree with a lot of the things doctorwho and Crzy4Bono said; and Diamond speaks with the qualified experience of a valuable point of view.

But please let me say this:

Extra-marital affairs are SOOOO 90s!

hey! what about me!

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you've got to cry without weeping, talk without speaking, scream without raising your voice..
 
This thread is depressing. Mac's situation and many of your views on marriage/life. Very depressing. I really worry about the future of society. That's all I have to say.

ABEL, diamond, Arun V , you all made points I agree with.

Good luck to you Mac. Maybe you can right your wrongs and find peace... the trouble is finding what is right and what is wrong. We all have our opinions, but in the end its you has to decide.
 
Originally posted by Spiral_Staircase:
I believe the exact opposite to be true.


So you believe in a life of servitude, and pleasing others?

and when I say "...if you are not living for yourself than you a just wasting air and space" I don't mean like being a selfish prick all the time. Like me me me. There is a time to please others and a time to please yourself. But if you are doing something or you are with some one for reasons other than your own desires than you are not living for yourself.



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When life hands you a lemon, say "Oh yeah, I like lemons. What else you got?" --Henry Rollins
 
Originally posted by ghetofabu:
But if you are doing something or you are with some one for reasons other than your own desires than you are not living for yourself.


I'm sorry, but there are a lot of things in life that you have to do for reasons other than your own desires. I'm not saying he should stay with his wife solely out of obligation. I'm not even saying he should stay with his wife. Ultimately that decision belongs to him and his wife. But the reality is that he did marry her and now he DOES some sort of obligation towards her to at least try to make it work.

I think most everything else I'd say has been covered already by Arun, doctorwho and others.
 
I think we have all covered this topic from every angle. We have all given him some things to mull over.


Someone please take this dead horse out of the room. It has taken enough of a beating.

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When life hands you a lemon, say "Oh yeah, I like lemons. What else you got?" --Henry Rollins
 
Originally posted by ghetofabu:
I think we have all covered this topic from every angle. We have all given him some things to mull over.


Someone please take this dead horse out of the room. It has taken enough of a beating.


But not before I tell you I agree with the essence of your previous posts.
wink.gif
 
Originally posted by joyfulgirl:
But not before I tell you I agree with the essence of your previous posts.
wink.gif
Thanks.
icon39.gif


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When life hands you a lemon, say "Oh yeah, I like lemons. What else you got?" --Henry Rollins
 
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