Question for Married Folks, or anyone with a opinion I guess

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Hi BEAL!

I remember us having fun discussing U2 stuff here a few years back. So much has happened since then - in fact, I didn't even know you married! I'm sorry to hear, though, that you are having difficulties.

The bad news is that the first year of marriage is difficult for everyone. I think the reality of "married for life" finally hits people. The hype of getting caught up in a wedding and honeymoon has long since passed and now a couple has to plan their lives together.

What I read from your posts is a classic frustration. You did some of these things before you married, even gave items up for her (like your cats), yet now suddenly it's either not enough of she wants even more. So you try to give more, but even then, it seems as if it's not enough.

The issue here is the fact that she is exploring what she wants. She doesn't know, so she's taking things out on you. She doesn't like her job - so you support her decision to not work. But that doesn't help. She wants to go to school, so you support her decision there, but now she's afraid that won't work. In other words, she's dreading imagined things, afraid of failure. Her insecurities are mounting daily and sadly, you are her scapegoat.

Therefore, I strongly recommend counseling. Both of you need marriage counseling and she may need some personal counseling. If she refuses to go, then go on your own. Love is fantastic, but the life your leading is not productive for either of you.

Therefore, before separating, have a VERY calm discussion with her. If she starts to nag, cry, scream, or whatever, remain calm. Do not "feed" into her anger or insecurities. Do not tell her how you've done "so much" already. Just let her calm down or tell her you'll continue talking once she's calmer. With level calm minds, discuss that it's clear both of you need counseling. Despite your efforts, you cannot make her happy, which is tearing you apart. And this needs exploration.

I wish you the best during this difficult time.


P.S. I have two dogs now and I would never, ever give them up for anyone, love or not. So be careful about what she asks because it seems your sacrifices are not what she is really seeking.
 
Oh yes I remember our discussions Dr....bet you're really a OLD MAN by now ;)

We are in counseling, and have been for a couple of months. Really started out as a way to just kind of prepare for our married life. And now it's gotten more into issues with married life.

I guess something has got to give here. I am not going to give everything up. If that truely bothers her, then if she wants out, then that's the decision, and I have one heck of a life story going so far at 28 : )

We do have some exercises to go through, and we'll see how those turn out. The thing is we need some form of common ground. Neither one of us appear to want to budge for our own reasons.

In this book I'm reading, the author says that not every problem has a solution. It's finding a common ground and a way to work together. he doesn't even mean communication, it can just mean doing things a different way.

Of course having a gridlock can be the end of a relationship, and I hope this doesn't cause the end of one.

I can only control myself and how I feel. It just feels like we're going down...down...down....instead of up.
 
BEAL said:
Oh yes I remember our discussions Dr....bet you're really a OLD MAN by now ;)

We are in counseling, and have been for a couple of months. Really started out as a way to just kind of prepare for our married life. And now it's gotten more into issues with married life.

I guess something has got to give here. I am not going to give everything up. If that truely bothers her, then if she wants out, then that's the decision, and I have one heck of a life story going so far at 28 : )

We do have some exercises to go through, and we'll see how those turn out. The thing is we need some form of common ground. Neither one of us appear to want to budge for our own reasons.

In this book I'm reading, the author says that not every problem has a solution. It's finding a common ground and a way to work together. he doesn't even mean communication, it can just mean doing things a different way.

Of course having a gridlock can be the end of a relationship, and I hope this doesn't cause the end of one.

I can only control myself and how I feel. It just feels like we're going down...down...down....instead of up.
Click to expand...

Old is relative BEAL. ;-) Let's just say that I am younger than the members of U2, but older than you. Oh, and I've tried writing to you several times over the years, but you have left yourself no way to be reached (either via PM here or e-mail - even BonoChick couldn't reach you!).

As for your situation, I do not wish to state or recommend anything that goes against your counselor. However, as you more than know, any relationship - even something as light as an internet friendship - is about compromise. If a person cannot offer anything to another, the reason for continuing that relationship is in question.

Based on what you wrote, though, it does appear you are willing to make sacrifices and alter your life. However, this is not working because of where your wife is right now. You could give her the moon and all she'd say is how she's not worthy of it and that you only gave her the moon because it's big and blocks her from your sight. In other words, it's a losing situation. This is why I feel your wife needs far more counseling.

Your marriage counseling is, in part, for you. You may even need separate counseling yourself now in order to better understand where she is and how you can support her more.

Counseling takes time. It's not like the movies where a person has a sudden realization. There may be issues of her self-esteem that may take a while to come out. And, it may even take another counselor to pull those issues out of her. Therefore, you need patience. The one thing I'm sensing in your notes is frustration and a lack of patience. At your age and experience, this is to be expected (one thing age does provide is experience and more patience). But this is also why I recommend counseling just for you - to learn how to understand her and, in turn, understand yourself.

The sad truth, though, is that despite your love and commitment, you still may need to separate. Just be sure that before you do, you've done all you could. Leaving your wife now - at a time when she really does need you most - won't win you many friends.

Good luck!
 
It is not I who brought up the possibility. She said in our meeting today that she doesn't think we're going to work.

If we were to end our relationship, the last thing I'm going to worry about is how her family takes it. For starters, I wish her family was a little more involved with her. They tend to just treat her moods as "There she goes again", rather than realizing that she is hurting. Not saying they're bad people, but they tend to leave my wife out of the loop a lot.

And that's not to say that the way my wife acts sometimes, it's not surprising that they do their own thing.

I'm concerned that my wife and I may not be together in the near future. I'm concerned for where our love has gone? I know it's still there, but can there be an attempt from both of us to get it back? That I don't know.

We did live together for about 6 months prior to getting married, so it's not like we didn't have a idea. And that's just luck anyway, my parents never lived together until marriage and they're fine.

I have my trip to Chicago this weekend, and I really hope that maybe we can be on better terms before I go. I hate having to think about this all the time. I'd rather focus on having a good time with friends, instead of is my wife still mad at me?

As for where I've been. I disappeared for a couple of years, believe it or not, more women issues. I moved out of the parents home, got a job, had quite a few lady friends, some serious, some not, and then finally purchased a computer that wasn't for work.

I usually surf this place more now that my company doesn't have it filtered. With U2 making music at a less frequent pace it seems, this place can kind of be a little slow.

Of course now that you've found me, what do you plan on doing with me:drool:

The gay innuendo never gets old
 
First off I think any counselor should tell her she's wrong, however blunt they want to be, that she thinks it's wrong for you two to bring up issues that are bothering you in counseling. Ummm.........isn't counseling supposed to help you with the issues, even if you've "discussed" it already?

From the things I've been through with my husband...good God....we can discuss it till we're blue in the face, but it should still be brought up in counseling....because whatever it is has to do with us and what's bothering one or both of us!

I wouldn't go jumping to seperation or divorce if you guys really love each other. Especially over something like this. Now if one of you were cheating or beating the other.....yeah grounds for seperation or divorce. But look at the reality of it. You've been married for 6 months!!!! No one has ever said that marriage or relationships are easy! And seperation shouldnt be used as an easy out either.

I'm not meaning to come down on you, from the sounds of it, you're not the one looking for the out. You're the one that wants to work things out and you shouldn't be made to feel guilty about doing your hobbies just because she doesnt understand them. Like so many others have said, she has to find a hobby of her own.
Again, if your hobbies were physically hurting her or abusing her, or causing you to cheat on her.....I'd be telling you to knock it off. But so far from the sounds of it you've made an effort to juggle things around and to find time with her and for her.

Did she really think that life after marriage was going to be sitting there starring at one another? Or that you'd be just ever so happy to be her shadow or entertainment planner?

Im sorry, I don't mean any disrespect for you or your wife, it just sounds like she really needs to grow up a bit and maybe the counselor will tell her that. I'll leave you with some words that were given to me a few months back when I was dealing with a pretty dark situation in my marriage. Fight like hell. Fight for your marriage if that's what you want and fight till you can't fight anymore.

Those words helped me, and they continue to do so. And I think it's pretty cool that someone on here, in the confessionals is the one that gave me that advice.

I hope it helps you as well.

:hug:
 
BEAL, I am sorry to hear all this. It's not that I think splitting up or divorce or whatever is bad. It just does make me sad when others are possibly hurting.

Now, one thing I want to get across is this. I'm not an expert so take this as you wish, but I do know counseling takes time and honestly, things can tend to get worse before getting better. Maybe I'm way off and you've been through counseling longer than I think, but if it hasn't been that long, perhaps take that into consideration.

I'm going to stop here. I could go on with all this mumbojumbo about communication/expectation/perception and blah blah blah, but you have heard all this. I'm not going to bash your wife either at all because I don't know the whole thang on that side. I like that line above from kiki, "Fight like hell...if that's what you want."

Sidenote: Is she going to DMACC? Drake? ISU? (Iowa native)
 
BEAL said:
It is not I who brought up the possibility. She said in our
Of course now that you've found me, what do you plan on doing with me:drool:

The gay innuendo never gets old
Click to expand...

Actually, I never really "lost" you, baby. I have periodically replied to your posts in various threads, but you never responded. It's unfortunate that it took this thread to do so. But you can PM me if you want. :)

As for the family... yeah, I can see that if your wife has a pattern of self-esteem issues that her family has probably been where you were 10-15 years ago and have realized that they can't change her, so they accept her. Trouble is, she probably needed counseling way back then. Had she received it, you might know a different woman today. Of course, that leads to another situation - if she were a different woman, would you even know her let alone have married her? Such is the way of life.

For now, I recommend as much counseling as your schedules and budgets allow. Use all resources, including free ones from your employer. If ultimately she sadly realizes that her unhappiness stems from her marriage, then...

Of course, I'll always be her to snog, I mean, comfort you, BEAL. :love:
 
BEAL said:
And that's just luck anyway, my parents never lived together until marriage and they're fine.
Click to expand...

It isn't all luck. It's a combination of being who you really are when you're still dating, having the ability to communicate before marriage, and simply being compatible.

On other notes:

Was she like this before you married her? If not, what happened? If so, why did you marry her?

Compatibilty is as important as love in a marriage, maybe even more so at times. It could be you two just aren't compatible.

As for fighting like hell, just make sure you really want what you're fighting for and can live with the results.
 
Keep in mind that there are a lot of different kinds of counselling. Is she seeing a counsellor on her own as well? I can empathise a bit with what she's going through (I've been signed off work for seven weeks for depression), and I think talk therapy is completely useless for me since knowing that my issues may stem from my childhood or whatever doesn't tell me what to do with them.
 
She does go to a counselor for her own issues, and has ever since she was a child.

She first starting going because it was recommended that her and her sibblings go after their parents divorce. She continued to see one just as a way of talking and getting stuff off of her chest.

The doctor just recently upped her dosage of happy pills (she's been on them for about 6 weeks), so hopefully in a few months those can really start to work wonders.

As for her being like this before we were married, no not really. Every women I've been with has issues, and my wife was/is no different. She would have mood swings, pout, etc. It would only last a day or even a few hours.

Of course I'm going to be there for her. What is bugging the hell out of me is that it feels like she's asking me to give up too much. We talked last night and she told me that she does like my TKD and what it does for me, but she doesn't like how it takes me away for most of the night. She says there may not be a compromise, and that she'll just have to learn to deal with it. I told her dealing with it doesn't mean bitching me out every month.

It's kind of the same way with golf. She doesn't mind that I play, it just sucks for her cause I'm gone for 5-8 hours playing it. I told her I can do a better job of not spending so much time after the round drinking and talking. Maybe have a beer and then get out.

I just want her to get a fucking activity so she's doing something. Unfortunately, her depression has put her in a state of "I don't wanna". Which then forces me to want to lay the hammer down.

Despite having our spat yesterday morning, we seemed to be fine last night. So I'm very glad that we didn't continue on that mess.
 
I'm glad she's seeing a counselor, but based on the few things you wrote here, it's possible she may need to see another person. If she's been seeing someone for this long, yet still has these extreme issues of self-esteem and insecurity, this suggests to me that the counseling isn't working. It may be time to find another.

That said, your wife does have a point. Your TKD obviously keeps you in shape, allows you to vent frustration and is a good break from family - just as her workouts are. One way to help her understand this is perhaps to have her work out as well on the evenings you have TKD. That is, instead of always exercising in the morning, she has classes at night. This way, you are both busy on those nights and after your classes/work-outs are over, you can enjoy each the rest of the evening. As it stands, she's sitting home alone for even longer, while you are busy.

Given that TKD does take you away from home, golf may be something of a luxury. The fact remains that you have a responsibility now - her. Either you play golf less frequently, she finds activities outside of home for her to do while you golf, or, and perhaps best of all, she joins you. Golf is also great exercise and as long as you don't turn this into a competition with your wife, it could be a sport the two of you enjoy long into your senior days.

In other words, given that you are now married, it's time that you stop doing things alone or with buds, and more with her. Yes, you still need your separate time and I encourage all couples to have this. But the definition of couple means doing more things together. Sitting around at home bored, though, is not the solution. So you sacrificing your TKD nights or golf days just to watch TV with her while she grumbles how worthless she is clearly isn't the answer. A compromise for her is to get out and either join you or find other activities with friends or her church or other groups in the area (including volunteering, such as being a Big Sister (mentoring), working with animals at a shelter, helping an elderly person or teaching someone to read; or a job perhaps that is fun, like washing dogs or entertaining children). Hobbies can also be wonderful, such as building or making VALUABLE collections (gathering junk is expensive and not a fix, but a valuable collection not only provides the excitement of collecting and fixing old items, but could be a nice "nest egg" for you some day). Even writing, reading, interacting online, etc. could be great ways to learn more and help her get out of this dark place.

So if you compromise to be with her more, only do so if she compromises to actually do something!

And while anti-depressant medicines may be beneficial, I think she needs another counselor to help her get at the root of her issues. It is possible she has a chemical imbalance, where the medicines are needed (and may be needed for a while). But I also think a proper counselor can help her overcome many issues - issues that her current counselor clearly cannot help her resolve.

Good luck!
 
BEAL said:
I just want her to get a fucking activity so she's doing something. Unfortunately, her depression has put her in a state of "I don't wanna".
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she doesnt like sports and I'm guessing she doesnt like video games. Tell her to join a book club, a quilting circle....lol sorry. Or something crafty. Suggest she volunteers at a Big Brothers/Big Sisters club or something
 
Kiki said:

Suggest she volunteers at a Big Brothers/Big Sisters club or something
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That helped me a great deal when I was depressed. No matter how bad I felt, I was always in a good mood as soon as I picked up my little sister. It was impossible to be sad around her. You are also more motivated to keep your commitment, as you don't want to disappoint your little.
 
Has she had any bloodwork done? Depression is often related to nutritional deficiencies or hormone imbalances, and sometimes just a slight adjustment with supplementation can turn things around rather quickly (not always, of course). Along with the continued counseling, I'd recommend that you encourage her to see a nutritionist or a naturopathic physician as they are trained to look at bloodwork differently than a regular doctor, with an eye for things like depression. That avenue changed my life some years ago.

I'll leave the relationship discussion to the experts here but just thought I'd introduce another direction to consider.
 
The thing is, when you're depressed, you don't feel like going out and getting an activity. Yes, it would be ideal for her to get together with girlfriends or do something that interests her in the evenings, but her reluctance has to do with the fact she's not in a great mental state. And until you first deal with that depression, you're not going to really be able to change her schedule or her habits. Even if you were to take her to play golf with you, or if she were to join some kind of extra-curricular club, her underlying issues would still be there. That's why you might have one nice night with her and it feels almost like things are back on track, and then you're taken aback when you have a shitty day or she starts back up with her wide-ranging complaints. That's because nothing has really changed for her personally; every problem she had before, she still has now.

I agree that she should probably get some bloodwork done, and maybe looking into a new counsellor. It seems like she's just been stagnating for a while now.
 
I appreciate all the feedback, has been very helpful. Still don't know what to do.

She was supposed to start school this past week, but she dropped out. Turns out our iMac isn't very compliant with what she needs to do. I told her that there is software (MS Office) that can be downloaded/purchased for a Mac, but she doesn't want to hear about it. Just now figures it probably isn't meant to be. Only positive is it saves us about 60k. But it's just another thing she has quit now in the past 4 months.

She says it's not her being flaky, that she's just trying to figure out what's best for her and us. She says she now has 3 goals; 1. Find a job 2. Find a Church 3. Find a after work hobby

I really just don't know. I sat down with her last night and told her I don't know where our relationship is going. I know it's still early in our relationship, but it feels like we're going no where.

We each have expectations, and right now those aren't being met.

I told her I need a few days to think about things. And yes, I do mean seperation. When I met my wife, she seemd very career oriented. Yes, she had issues with her job, but who doesn't?

She wants someone who will give their life over to God. I honestly gave that a try with her. She was the first person I ever met that got me interested in God and Church. Eventually though I found myself disagreeing with what was being said, and my old thoughts of "This doesn't make any sense!" started coming back.

I have been keeping this on the downlow for a while, and I think it's only fair to let her know.

Last night she says that she knows she can be happy, but I don't believe her. She's told me too many times in the past that she just doesn't think she'll ever be happy. She also doubts that her medication will ever work.

How much do we have to put up with? Maybe I am a selfish prick, who only is concerned with my own interests and wants life to work out MY WAY.

I'm just starting to get worried that we're going to create a lot more trouble in the future for each other. Neither one of us owns anything jointly, would probably seem like the time to end it if that's the correct path.

I don't know. I love my wife, but it just seems we can't find common ground. I do like our conselor, but it's almost like we're waiting on each other to make the first move. To me, that's a bad sign, and shows that maybe we each have the same doubts.

My wife asked if it would be better for her to leave for the weekend so I can have time to think on my own, and I'm not sure if that's a good idea. I just spent a weekend in Chicago with friends, so I was able to get away then.

I'm just so frustrated. I'm just fighting a battle in my head.
 
Personally, I think your wife needs to get her act together so you both can deal with this. The marriage counseling is a good thing. You are trying to make it work. You sound as though you are being honest with her and giving all sorts of options and opportunities. I'm not trying to make light of her depression, but it's not a spouses job to be someone's doctor. That's far too much strain on the relationship, especially an immature relationship (immature as in new). If she does have severe depression, then she needs to get proper treatment for herself. She can't have it both ways. She can't say she's so depressed but then do nothing about it and expect you to come up with her band aids. I would strongly encourage her to see a doctor for a full physical and blood work like others have suggested and a mental health doctor that can actually give her a diagnosis as far as her depression. Without a clear idea of what is wrong, you're going in circles trying to help.
 
BEAL said:





We each have expectations, and right now those aren't being met.




Click to expand...

So tell me.......if you can't meet hers, how do you expect your wife to meet yours.

After reading your posts i feel like....I'm the wife in your posts....I'm going through a similar ordeal......except add 2 kids and a job i am not happy with.
 
So you're going to start nagging me too ? :wink:

I don't know if we will meet each other's expectations. She knows mine, and I know hers. Something is getting lost in the execution though.

And we've talked about it many times before getting married. Right now it seems as though our expectations are completely different.

There have been times over the past few months where my expectation would be just to leave me alone...and I'm sure vice versa for her.

I'm so glad we don't have kids right now, that would make the issues we're facing that much tougher.

She was offered a job at a clinic this week, but has yet to get in contact with their HR person. I'm hoping that maybe she'll have a new job by the end of next week. She did like the sounds of this job, but she also interviewed on Monday for another job that she says is also up her alley.

Will she wait to hear back from that interview? Or take this job? Don't know. I'm concerned she may miss out on a opportunity, but I also understand in waiting for something you will really like.

I just think any sort of job would be good for her. Just keep her busy and expose her to potential new friendships. Guess I'll see what happens and where it takes us.
 
There are times in a relationship where two people aren't on the same page or even in the same book. That happens to my husband and I, you go off and do your thing and she goes off to do hers and next thing you know your are literally two ships that pass in the night. As long as you know that that part of a relationship happens to others as well even after 17 years of marriage. :huh:
 
Yeah, I understand that there are highs and lows. And right now has been one long low. There are signs that improvements are on the way.

I do wish my wife would quit assuming that any time I want to do something, it's on my own, or it's a way for me to get away from her. I'm surprised I'm allowed to go to work, as it keeps me away from home for soooo long.
 
To quote Aretha. - "R. E. S. P. E. C. T."

If it aint there the relationship is going nowhere.

Coincidently Im googling wedding vows for a friend. I just found a beaudy:

"I ______, take you, ______, to be my husband/wife. I will be a loving husband/wife. I promise to respect and encourage your fulfilment as an individual."

:up:

PS Background info - my marriage disintergrated so take any of my advice on lurve with a pinch of salt.
 
martha said:

That kind of paranoia would get really old really fast. :huh:
Click to expand...

Yeah, it does. And I think most of it comes from her sitting at home all day, and then when I get home at 8pm on my tkd nights (3 nights a week), she wants 100% of me.

I won't lie, some nights I'm extremely tired, and I don't give her that. But I would say that more times than not, I am there to do whatever she wants to do.

I really get tired of her telling me that she respects my love of tkd, then turn around and say something like "You're never going to be around when we have kids. The kids will be fed and put to sleep by the time you get home".

For one thing, I probably wouldn't keep up my 3 nights if I had a kid. Would knock it down to 2, and one of those probably being the weekend class.

It's just these type of comments that have really turned me off to the relationship. I'm guilty of creating negative scenerios in my head too, but I usually keep them to myself.

She hasn't accepted the offer yet, so I'm still crossing my fingers she'll do so by Monday. I really want to see how our relationship changes once she is busy.

Of course if she blows off this offer (it as given to her on Wednesday), I don't know how I will react positively.
 
BEAL said:


And I think most of it comes from her sitting at home all day, and then when I get home at 8pm on my tkd nights (3 nights a week), she wants 100% of me.
Click to expand...

You see....it's this particular statement that gets my crawl every time. I am left wondering who does your washing and general duties around the home.

Without kids and without work.......housework can still be hard to keep up with....... WITH work it's REALLY hard....(maybe this is the reason, why she finds work difficult at this time, because your wife was prolly sick and tired of going to work and STILL coming home to WORK while you go off and do your thing! That's all great....and like me (my hubby is a Kung-Fu instructor....so you can understand why i find this extraordinary, that i found this thread interesting to me!) she knew the deal when you guys got married...but i really do think that after time it can really wear you down and you find yourself getting bugged by stuff)

.........NOW.......ADD KIDS.......well holy-shit......i felt myself boiling over at the most ridicolous things, like the toilet roll not being put on the roller right and him not using f**** AIR-FRESHNER!!! Maybe your wife is visualising all this.....she maybe thinking, my hubby can't cope when i am having a brain snap now, how the f*** is going to help when the kids come along.

I think your wife definately is thinking about wanting kids right now.....and she is shit scared about the future because she thinks she is going to do this all on her own.
 
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