What Is It About 20-Somethings?

[Pearl]

The New York Times Magazine recently ran an article saying people in their 20s are taking longer to grow up.

It’s happening all over, in all sorts of families, not just young people moving back home but also young people taking longer to reach adulthood overall. It’s a development that predates the current economic doldrums, and no one knows yet what the impact will be — on the prospects of the young men and women; on the parents on whom so many of them depend; on society, built on the expectation of an orderly progression in which kids finish school, grow up, start careers, make a family and eventually retire to live on pensions supported by the next crop of kids who finish school, grow up, start careers, make a family and on and on. The traditional cycle seems to have gone off course, as young people remain untethered to romantic partners or to permanent homes, going back to school for lack of better options, traveling, avoiding commitments, competing ferociously for unpaid internships or temporary (and often grueling) Teach for America jobs, forestalling the beginning of adult life.

The 20s are a black box, and there is a lot of churning in there. One-third of people in their 20s move to a new residence every year. Forty percent move back home with their parents at least once. They go through an average of seven jobs in their 20s, more job changes than in any other stretch. Two-thirds spend at least some time living with a romantic partner without being married. And marriage occurs later than ever. The median age at first marriage in the early 1970s, when the baby boomers were young, was 21 for women and 23 for men; by 2009 it had climbed to 26 for women and 28 for men, five years in a little more than a generation.

We’re in the thick of what one sociologist calls “the changing timetable for adulthood.” Sociologists traditionally define the “transition to adulthood” as marked by five milestones: completing school, leaving home, becoming financially independent, marrying and having a child. In 1960, 77 percent of women and 65 percent of men had, by the time they reached 30, passed all five milestones. Among 30-year-olds in 2000, according to data from the United States Census Bureau, fewer than half of the women and one-third of the men had done so. A Canadian study reported that a typical 30-year-old in 2001 had completed the same number of milestones as a 25-year-old in the early ’70s.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/22/magazine/22Adulthood-t.html?_r=1&src=me&ref=general


The article is very long, so read it if and when you have the time.

But based on what I posted, do any of you agree? I'm 28 and I would say its the economy's fault that I haven't done a lot of things that "make" an adult - such as getting married and having kids. But I know other 20-somethings who do have good jobs, yet still live at home, haven't had any serious relationships, etc. Is there something wrong with us?

I would say yes and no. No because my generation seems to believe that life should be fun and we can live until we're 90 or 100, so why rush to grow up? But I would say yes because some 20-somethings are dragging their asses around when it comes to being independent, and not because they are too busy having fun. They really do seem to be babied by their parents and still have adolescent minds.


Thoughts?

 

[anitram]

I would argue that the traditional sociological definition of adulthood, as discussed in that article, is arcane today. Getting married and having children should be stricken off the list in the sense that they are seen as lifestyle choices and not necessary transitions. Things have also changed for women in particular, who no longer depend on marriage for financial security.

Another thing to remember is that both proportionally and absolutely, fewer people of our parents' generation had undergraduate degrees. That degree had a far higher value back then than it does now. These days many of us are forced to complete graduate or professional degrees which would not have been necessary for comparable jobs 40 years ago. Moreover, the cost of college has sky rocketed while salaries have stagnated and we are graduating with debt levels that my parents simply did not have to deal with in their day. You could work over the summer and perfectly well be able to finance your education.

So there are some external factors that may be delaying "adulthood" as defined in this article.

What has changed about us intrinsically? I'm not sure that I can pinpoint it and I'm not sure that any of these things are necessarily negatives. I think we have more options and opportunities and maybe that leads to indecision. The financial independence that women have these days certainly affects the average marriage age as well as probably increases the numbers of single women who would otherwise seek to marry. The world is also more accessible for us - we can travel, we have global mobility when it comes to jobs and places where we can live and maybe we don't feel very strong ties to any particular community - we are much more children of the world than our parents were.

 

[Liesje]

I guess I don't fit their mold. I'm married, I don't move every year, I haven't lived with my parents since I was 17, I am 25 and have had the same job for almost 8 years.

And, what Martina said.

As for the housing, my mom tells me all the time about people her age (mid-fifties) whose parents/family bought or helped financed their home. These days normal people cannot afford that, plus with the housing market what it is no one wants to buy into a home they really are not committed to. Phil and I have been looking for over a year, and when we do buy it will be something we are committed to living in for a minimum of ten years. Also since it's a buyer's market, we can be really picky about what we want and where we want it. Now if we'd just gotten married and my daddy was going to buy me a house, you betcha I wouldn't care nearly as much and jump on that like flies on poo.

Personally, I am not a career-focused person. My identity and how I feel about myself and how I define success have nothing to do with my job. My job gives me something to do, it pays my bills, it allows me to go on reasonable vacation, and it covers my ass as far as health, life, retirement, etc. Beyond that, as a 25 year old I have a few hobbies that take up the rest of my time and much more of my energy and commitment than my job. Right now I just selfishly would rather pursue those activities than have kids. I'm lucky that my job covers my basic needs and then some, so my real happiness and feelings of success and self-worth are defined by the things I truly love doing and don't make a cent doing it. These days people can switch careers if they want. You don't have to pick something straight out of highschool, and it's less and less common to take over and inherit some sort of family trade. Plus as a woman, all the previous generations of women in my family were housewives and that's not what I aspire to at this moment. I have a good ten years to have or adopt kids and we fully intend on raising them ourselves but at this point in our lives we enjoy the other things we are committed to as far as time and financially and aren't ready to make that sacrifice.

 

[anitram]

I guess I don't fit their mold. I'm married, I don't move every year, I haven't lived with my parents since I was 17, I am 25 and have had the same job for almost 8 years.

I guess I should also clarify that I probably don't fit their mold. Firstly because I'm actually 30 (and no, life hasn't ended). I also haven't lived at home in years, have a couple of degrees and a career and stable job and the last time I moved was when I graduated. On the other hand I'm not married (and not sure I care to be) but I would like to have children some day, it's just that I have career goals I'd like to meet before doing that.

 

[joerags]

It's tough to settle down. I don't know how people do it, let alone 20-somethings.

All, if not most, 20-somethings want to go clubbing every night and hook up with as many people as they can. They don't want to leave the high school/college mentality of partying. They don't want to be tied down in a marriage, having kids, worrying about the bills and having to pay for a mortgage.

I am 37 and single. I have never had a girlfriend. I still live at home with my widowed mom. I am college-educated and employed, but I don't make enough money to live on my own, let alone support a family.
I will never get married because of two things: I am physically ugly and I don't make enough money. I am a total loser, but that is besides the point.
The point is, 20-somethings want to party and have fun as long as they can.
I used to think that women who reach the age of 25 begin to start thinking about marriage and having kids. But now, I think those women want to play the field, have casual sex and live independent lives, not worrying about having to get married and have kids. Just read those Maxim magazines. You will see that most 20-something women are pretty much like that now.

 

[BoMac]

I am 37 and single. I have never had a girlfriend. I still live at home with my widowed mom. I am college-educated and employed, but I don't make enough money to live on my own, let alone support a family.
I will never get married because of two things: I am physically ugly and I don't make enough money. I am a total loser, but that is besides the point.
The point is, 20-somethings want to party and have fun as long as they can.

It's ironic that in your thread in Zoo Confessionals, Pearl called you out for these very comments, and yet here you are spouting off this nonsense in one of her threads!

I sincerely hope you seek the help you so obviously need, because it's obvious you do not listen to what others tell you, even if they are strangers on an Internet fan forum. It is not necessary to repeat the same lines over and over every chance you get. We get it.

But I don't want to derail this thread.

As you were.

 

[redhotswami]

I am 37 and single. I have never had a girlfriend. I still live at home with my widowed mom. I am college-educated and employed, but I don't make enough money to live on my own, let alone support a family.
I will never get married because of two things: I am physically ugly and I don't make enough money. I am a total loser, but that is besides the point.

Do you just copy and paste this into every single thread you post in?



I definitely fit the mold. I'm 29, moved back with my parents for a year after I graduated college, and in the past 3 years I've moved 9 times. I also have yet to hold a full-time job for more than a year. Though, I've never lived with a partner. I've got 99 problems, but a bitch ain't one.

I'm a rockstar, so such is the way of life.

 

[Bono's shades]

Yawn. I remember all the professional worrywarts freaking out 20 years ago when I was a 20-something about those crazy young people changing jobs all the time and not being in a rush to get married right away (like taking a lot of time to decide who you are going to make a lifetime commitment to or maybe deciding marriage just isn't your cup of tea is such a horrible thing) and having to move back in with their parents for a while. Gee, what a coincidence, the economy was in the crapper back then too.

 

[Diemen]

It's tough to settle down. I don't know how people do it, let alone 20-somethings.

All, if not most, 20-somethings want to go clubbing every night and hook up with as many people as they can. They don't want to leave the high school/college mentality of partying. They don't want to be tied down in a marriage, having kids, worrying about the bills and having to pay for a mortgage.

I am 37 and single. I have never had a girlfriend. I still live at home with my widowed mom. I am college-educated and employed, but I don't make enough money to live on my own, let alone support a family.
I will never get married because of two things: I am physically ugly and I don't make enough money. I am a total loser, but that is besides the point.
The point is, 20-somethings want to party and have fun as long as they can.
I used to think that women who reach the age of 25 begin to start thinking about marriage and having kids. But now, I think those women want to play the field, have casual sex and live independent lives, not worrying about having to get married and have kids. Just read those Maxim magazines. You will see that most 20-something women are pretty much like that now.

Oh fer chrissakes. This is getting just a little old, joerags. Quit trolling.

 

[indra]

Woohoo! According to this article I'm a 20-something! Who would have thunk it at my age?

 

[lauramullen]

I just turned 30 and never expected to be married when I was in my twenties. I always looked at my twenties as the time to go out and do what I want before I settle down and get married and have kids. I do have a full time job, with great perks and I have lived in my aprtment for seven years, but I never finished college. That is my one regret not doing before turning thirty.

 

[joerags]

It's ironic that in your thread in Zoo Confessionals, Pearl called you out for these very comments, and yet here you are spouting off this nonsense in one of her threads!

I sincerely hope you seek the help you so obviously need, because it's obvious you do not listen to what others tell you, even if they are strangers on an Internet fan forum. It is not necessary to repeat the same lines over and over every chance you get. We get it.

But I don't want to derail this thread.

As you were.

I don't understand why you and everybody else keep attacking me. I am just stating what my situation is, in regards to the topic of this thread.

Did I ask for advice? Am I asking for sympathy?

The answer is no. I am not here looking for sympathy. Okay???!!!! Can I be any more clearer than that????!!! So, with all due respect, please stop attacking me. If you don't like what I have to write, just ignore me. Is that simple enough?

The topic was about 20-somethings afraid to grow up, and I simply used me as an example and to express my thoughts.

For the record, I won't participate in this thread, or any other threads from now on.

 

[AliEnvy]

^ Do you even know any 20-something women to be able to compare them to the crap you read in Maxim?

 

[corianderstem]

Without touching on the personal stuff, your generalizations are ridiculous.

 

[Liesje]

Without touching on the personal stuff, your generalizations are ridiculous.

Ditto. Speaks for NONE of the 20-somethings I am currently acquainted with.

 

[purpleoscar]

I believe this generation has more options. Now if someone chooses a particular option because they are happy with it then that's okay. Unfortunately it's hard with a boom and bust to make some of those typical responsible decisions (marriage, mortgage, children, EDUCATION, taking care of sick relatives). Then you add the enormous choices people have for lifestyles which can be distractions. I think many in reaching the 30s will settle down more in their careers and can finally make longer plans. It's a different world with quickly changing jobs (and job locations) and constant re-education if you're a professional.

There was also a video that anitram posted before that talked about degree inflation which I think forces many people to change careers entirely which will slow things down. Eg. What do all those Psychology graduates do when they can't find a job in Psychology?

 

[coolian2]

Without touching on the personal stuff, your generalizations are ridiculous.

if this is how he really thinks, the mystery of his loneliness isn't such a mystery.

 

[BoMac]

I don't understand why you and everybody else keep attacking me. I am just stating what my situation is, in regards to the topic of this thread.

Did I ask for advice? Am I asking for sympathy?

The answer is no. I am not here looking for sympathy. Okay???!!!! Can I be any more clearer than that????!!! So, with all due respect, please stop attacking me. If you don't like what I have to write, just ignore me. Is that simple enough?

You are looking for sympathy and/or attention, whether you like to admit it or not.

But, whatever, if you cannot see that now, one day you will.

if this is how he really thinks, the mystery of his loneliness isn't such a mystery.

This.

 

[Moonlit_Angel]

These days many of us are forced to complete graduate or professional degrees which would not have been necessary for comparable jobs 40 years ago. Moreover, the cost of college has sky rocketed while salaries have stagnated and we are graduating with debt levels that my parents simply did not have to deal with in their day. You could work over the summer and perfectly well be able to finance your education.

This pretty much sums up my current situation. Add in the fact that I've been living with my parents thus far because it's been hard for me to get my own place (due to moving so much and other factors) and the job market hasn't been that fantastic and you pretty much have the main explanation for today's 20-somethings, at least the way that article shows them.

(I find it interesting, by the way, how we react to the idea of people in their 20s living at home. In other parts of the world, it's perfectly fine, normal for multiple generations to live in the same house, people think nothing of it. Here, however, it tends to be mocked, even if the reasons as to why are perfectly understandable. Why the difference in attitude?)

I'm smack dab in the middle of my 20s, and I feel like an adult in some ways and yet still don't in other ways (namely the fact that I'm still living at home)-it's a strange back and forth. I've seen many of my friends from school get married or go off and have kids, and my sister, who is 22, is engaged. Many of my friends have finished school or are still going through school, and most of them are living on their own. I'm definitely in the minority in the group of people I know in that regard. But I'm not in any rush to get married or have kids, I'm perfectly happy to wait a few more years on that. Not because I want to "party it up" or whatever during this part of my life ('cause I'm not that big a partier), but because I just do not feel I'm in a stable enough place, partially emotionally but mostly financially to have that stuff happen, a mindset which I actually think shows some maturity and responsiblity regardless of what age you are. I'm not saying I'm necessarily going to wait until my perfect career path drops in my lap and whatnot, but I do want to be in a good place financially. I'm much more concerned about getting that aspect of my life dealt with right now than I am anything else. I want to be out on my own and have my own place and get that settled. I want to go back to school and finish up there first, or at the very least be firmly on my way to getting my degree and such. After all that, then marriage and family will start to enter my mind.

Truth be told, it is a little scary to suddenly realize that you are responsible for yourself now (and possibly other people), it's a little intimidating at first getting out into the "real world". But I don't think that's the main reason why our age group is acting this way, I honestly think most of it is due to issues beyond our control going on right now. And besides, I think this new attitude people in my age group have might actually bode well down the line. Planning ahead a little more, not rushing into anything, waiting until the time is right to move on to the next stage of your life-this may lead to many positive situations personally and for society at large.

Angela

 

[Pearl]

It's ironic that in your thread in Zoo Confessionals, Pearl called you out for these very comments, and yet here you are spouting off this nonsense in one of her threads!

Exactly. You told me you would stop and you haven't.

I don't understand why you and everybody else keep attacking me. I am just stating what my situation is, in regards to the topic of this thread.

Did I ask for advice? Am I asking for sympathy?

The answer is no. I am not here looking for sympathy. Okay???!!!! Can I be any more clearer than that????!!! So, with all due respect, please stop attacking me. If you don't like what I have to write, just ignore me. Is that simple enough?

The topic was about 20-somethings afraid to grow up, and I simply used me as an example and to express my thoughts.

For the record, I won't participate in this thread, or any other threads from now on.

Oh grow up! Really, just get a life. Enough of all this whining and woe is me attitude you display in every thread that have nothing to do with your situation. Are you like this in real life, or is this all a joke? Because you've been saying the same thing for years and clearly have never gotten help - despite everyone on this forum telling you to do so - so I'm starting to wonder if you just love playing games with people. Either that or you're quite pathetic.

I'm sorry if that sounded really harsh, but apparently you need brutal honesty in your life.

 

[bigjohn2441]

at 23 i got hired a couple days before i even graduated. i graduated in august 2008, and moved from pittsburgh to st thomas virgin islands, having never been there before, in september and started work 2 days after i arrived. i had no problem with it whatsoever, other than finding a place to rent so short notice. this july i bought a condo. is that grown-up enough?

i guess im one of the lucky ones. a lot of people i know are like the article says. times are rough.

 

[Liesje]

What I do see a lot in my age group is people who think they deserve so much right away and forget how long our parents worked and scrimped and save to "build" their homes, families, and financial security. These days there is an attitude of entitlement. So many people my age have made such huge mistakes for no reason, like this guy I know who didn't have any worries b/c his parents paid for college still ended up with huge CC debt because he wanted a nice house and all new stuff because supposedly that is just what you "get" for graduating from college, getting married, and having a job. Most of us can't live like that, we have to get our hands dirty and work our asses off to afford that sort of lifestyle. My late step-grandpa is sort of an inspiration to me in this regard. He did not come from money at all, was a blue collar worker (plumber) his entire life, was not without his own family drama (kids being unstable and needing his help financially) but he worked really hard and stashed his savings so he was able to enjoy his retirement (even then he did not spend frivolously) and help out his kids/grandkids and others in need.

 

[MrsSpringsteen]

Yes I do think SOME, and I want to emphasize SOME, people that age have been so spoiled by their parents that they do have a sense of entitlement. Especially with the way the economy is now it just doesn't work that way. They want to charge whatever they want on credit and live a kind of lifestyle that's way beyond their means. Of course in many cases that's exactly what their parents do.

 

[Liesje]

It's not always people that have been spoiled though, at least not by today's definition, but people who just haven't learned what it means to actually WORK for something, make choices/sacrifices, deal with pressures and roadblocks.

There are plenty of people that have a learned helplessness because they were spoiled and sheltered and thus have very little to no life skills, but I think there's really more people in the middle that were raised decently and are not stupid people but have to make a mistake in order to get it right.

 

[financeguy]

It's tough to settle down. I don't know how people do it, let alone 20-somethings.

All, if not most, 20-somethings want to go clubbing every night and hook up with as many people as they can. They don't want to leave the high school/college mentality of partying. They don't want to be tied down in a marriage, having kids, worrying about the bills and having to pay for a mortgage.

I am 37 and single. I have never had a girlfriend. I still live at home with my widowed mom. I am college-educated and employed, but I don't make enough money to live on my own, let alone support a family.
I will never get married because of two things: I am physically ugly and I don't make enough money. I am a total loser, but that is besides the point.
The point is, 20-somethings want to party and have fun as long as they can.
I used to think that women who reach the age of 25 begin to start thinking about marriage and having kids. But now, I think those women want to play the field, have casual sex and live independent lives, not worrying about having to get married and have kids. Just read those Maxim magazines. You will see that most 20-something women are pretty much like that now.

I know a guy of 37 who has always lived at home except for a very brief spell where he shared a house (with two women), has been doing the same, not very well paying job for years with little or no promotional prospects, did not go to college and although nowhere close to being married is quite successful with women. His most recent G.F. was 23 and he ditched her, incidentally, not the other way around. I wouldn't say he is particularly good-looking either. In fact is on the puny side, though it probably helps with younger women that he looks a good bit younger than 37.

Fella, it's time for change. Start with ditching the Maxim magazine collection.

 

[the iron horse]

CSF Berks: Extending Adolescence?

 

[AliEnvy]

From the monogamy thread:

There is always:

Girlfriend experience - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Capitalism is great, there's a supplier for every demand.

And now, there's this:

CANOE - Lifewise - Sex & Romance: Dating site launches for ugly people

The Ugly Bug Ball - dating for the aesthetically challenged

 

[deep]

There is already a dating site for unattractive people

eharmony.com

 

[Got Philk?]

:lurk:

 

[Headache in a Suitcase]

i think a large number of those in their late 20s/early 30s are seeing these things happen because of the economy, the increased emphasis on more and more higher education and the implications of that (hard to find a job if you don't have them, hard to stay out of debt if you do)...

i also think that those in their early 20s and teens are being more and more coddled and over-protected by parents who refuse to cut the cord... and that's only getting worse each passing year.