What Is It About 20-Somethings?

[Irvine511]

people in their 40s and up should remember a time when a college education could be paid for with summer jobs bagging groceries.

in many ways, i've been very lucky. i've struggled, so to speak, but have never, ever asked for help -- perhaps only out of sheer pigheadedness -- but then i also managed to avoid calamity or disaster. and when disaster did strike, i was secure enough to pay off my large (and still continuing) medical bills.

i also think that the 20s are a time when you should pursue a dream, if you know what that dream might be, or to search for that dream. but i think, naturally, when you shift into your 30s, the more practical aspects of life take over, and you become more able to work a 9-to-5 that is respectable and funds the rest of your life, and you're fine with that. i just think that many 25 year olds won't be happy feeling as if they've "settled" and would be happier trying to pursue what it really is that they want to do, and even if it doesn't work out, at least they can say that they tried. and then life will take it's course, and the idea of "settling" doesn't quite mean to a 35 year old what it might mean to a 25 year old. there are many, many ways to get through life, and everything is in constant negotiation.

my only advice would be to follow your gut, and to listen to what it is that you *really* want -- whether that's something to help you afford your true passions, or whether your true passion is working very hard for very little money, or if your true passion is not so much the work itself but the feeling of accomplishment in a fast paced environment, or if you've got some hungry mouths to feed and uninteresting but solid work is a mere 5-minute drive from home.

we give ourselves too much credit for the ability to steer the events of our lives. many decisions will be made for you, and remember that your decisions are 50% chance anyway.

 

[Liesje]

^ True, my mom has mentioned this before, that she could pay for college with academic scholarships, living at home, and working during the summer.

When I went to college, we were required to live on campus for two years which was not cheap ($8000/yr I want to say). I did work full time all summer AND I worked three jobs during school, M-F I often worked 8-9 hour days and then I'd have to go TA in the evening. Even with all of that, there's no WAY you can make $25K/yr to pay for college. I was a great student in high school, I went to an academically challenging private school where I got As, I got some honors, I was captain and MVP of the gymnastics team, but when I entered college I was so disappointed to find how competitive scholarship are/were. I got the standard Dean's List scholarship but nothing more besides need-based aid even though I was an A student and worked hard to lead a sports team because I thought that might help. My mom went to the same high school AND college as me, she was not an A student but she got a lot of scholarships when she attended.

 

[PhilsFan]

how hard do you work, can i ask? like when you're not at school or working whatever job you might be working to bring money in, are you enjoying going to games on the weekends and interviewing, commentating, etc? how much voluntary time do you put into it, is what i'm asking.

I'm a journalism major as well... but i'm not enjoying it as i once was. Creative writing is my favourite class, and i like Lit as well, for the class discussions. i also do Italian, because i enjoy it.

I work for a radio station and a TV station. For the radio station, I have a meeting or two per week, a weekly radio show, and then intermittently will broadcast some games (which is what I like to do most). I'd probably do more if the station wasn't three miles away and accessed only by a particularly unreliable bus. I don't have a car up here since my brother at home needs it.

For the TV station, I've hardly done a thing yet, but that was mostly due to scheduling conflicts. I'll probably be more involved this semester.

I'm beginning to write for the website too, though how frequently is yet to be determined. The only thing I've written so far was heavily (and in my opinion, unnecessarily) edited because a player said something interesting but controversial in the post-game press conference.

So, how much time do I put in? Probably about five or six hours a week. I try to do as much as I can from my room because I really hate wasting time on transportation. I'm taking six classes (18 credits) as well, so my time is somewhat limited.

 

[PhilsFan]

As far as work is concerned: I don't work at school because I typically take more credits than necessary each semester (I don't think I'll be graduating early, but I'd like to have lighter course loads when I'm a junior and senior), but I do work over the summer. I worked the entire summer this year, with 45-hour weeks, working in a warehouse. It completely and totally exhausted me, and I actually was in poor health by the end because of it. However, it was by far the most steady hours I could find anywhere and probably the best wages too. So, for the sake of argument, I worked the absolutely maximum and got the most money possible out of my summer.

In doing all that, I made enough money this summer to pay for just about 10% of this year's tuition, room, and board.

 

[Irvine511]

As far as work is concerned: I don't work at school because I typically take more credits than necessary each semester (I don't think I'll be graduating early, but I'd like to have lighter course loads when I'm a junior and senior), but I do work over the summer. I worked the entire summer this year, with 45-hour weeks, working in a warehouse. It completely and totally exhausted me, and I actually was in poor health by the end because of it. However, it was by far the most steady hours I could find anywhere and probably the best wages too. So, for the sake of argument, I worked the absolutely maximum and got the most money possible out of my summer.

In doing all that, I made enough money this summer to pay for just about 10% of this year's tuition, room, and board.

kids today are so lazy, selfish, and spoiled.

 

[Liesje]

I think everyone has their own barometer of what is a "lot" of school work or hard work. It's not really anyone's fault; we were all raised differently with different expectations. If you simply don't have a place to live or no one to help pay bills and help you get on your feet, your life adjusts fairly quickly.

When Phil enrolled do to post bacc. for elementary education, they told him that you are not allowed to have a job while in the program because you are in school AND student teaching for 4 semesters straight. I just laughed at that. You cannot tell someone they are not allowed to work. Juggling work and being in school is one of the more valuable lessons you can learn as a student, and for someone that is going back to earn additional degrees and credentials it's just not possible not to work when you have a spouse and kids and your home and such to keep going.

 

[MrsSpringsteen]

I can't believe what my college tuition was, how cheap it was relative to what it costs now. It was two private colleges, I transferred after my sophomore year. I took out loans and my parents paid for a small portion of it-the only scholarship I got was one for $500 from my church.

One thing I would say that college students need to do is take full advantage of career services. I was very independent and introverted and focused on getting good grades, and because I commuted I wasn't involved in on campus stuff. But I never did that and that was a big mistake.

 

[financeguy]

Everyone is entitled to happiness.

 

[coolian2]

i love being told by people who didn't pay for their university education that mine is costing the country too much.

 

[cobl04]

in the 80s, i think it was, Labor was in power, and there were no university HECS or anything, you just had to pay a flat yearly fee of a few hundred for facilities, etc.

 

[KhanadaRhodes]

politicians are woefully out of touch with exactly how expensive it is now to attend university. the schools have been allowed to raise their fees as much as they want with no restrictions - a wiser thing (imo) would've been to only allow it to correlate with the rate of inflation. combine that with the cost of living increasing while wages have decreased, and it's just impossible now to go to school full time and work to pay for your year's tuition.

while i'm all for free university tuition, i've no problem with countries expecting people to pay their own way. but some concessions need to be made. a student (in the u.s. at least) could probably earn a max of $20k a year if they work full time the whole year, so even assuming said person can live on a diet of water and sand, there's no way it should cost more than that. ivy league colleges i can see charging more since you are paying for the privilege of attending something with the prestige of harvard or yale, but public universities certainly have no right to be charging that much.

[/rant]

 

[cobl04]

in America is it different to here? the good thing about our setup is that we don't have to pay a yearly fee or anything. the costs for each unit just accumulate and then once you start earning a certain amount, the money is debited through your tax i think.

 

[KhanadaRhodes]

in america, you're expected to (somehow) pay for everything each semester, the money's due before class starts. if you get financial aid (whether it's grants - free money, or loans) through the government or some other means it goes straight to school so if you get enough to cover the full cost, you're good. i'm sure this is the same over there though.

anyway, blah blah blah any loan you'd get won't expect you to pay any money until after you graduate, you get a grace period of six months (this time is also used if you ever take a semester off so if you ever do take a break, you'll be expected to start paying the next time you're not enrolled for a semester, whether you take another one off or have graduated). for the most common loan, the government pays your interest while you're in school. the other kind, they don't so it's more like a traditional loan. but once that six months is up you're expected to start paying, if you're not making enough to make your payments you can fill out a form to get the amount you pay lowered, but i'm not sure if it's a guaranteed reduction or what.

i don't know if this answers your question or not!

 

[cobl04]

yeah it does. so that's why the words "college fund" are bandied around so often.

as much as it costs to go to uni here, at least you don't have to pay-as-you-go (but if you're rich you can.)

 

[KhanadaRhodes]

ahh. lucky

 

[Liesje]

it's just impossible now to go to school full time and work to pay for your year's tuition.

Not to mention that if you worked during high school as I did and many do to save for college, there are restrictions on how long you can work (child labor laws) which also prevents you from even making a dent in that cost.

I do not think school should necessarily be free, but something's got to give. Phil and I pay twice as much for student loans (he has multiple degrees) than many of my comfortably living co-workers pay for their mortgages each month. The one nice thing is our fabulous credit scores. I've never own a home, a credit card, and didn't owned a vehicle in my name until a year ago but I've been paying student loans since I was 17.

 

[redhotswami]

I do not think school should necessarily be free, but something's got to give. Phil and I pay twice as much for student loans (he has multiple degrees) than many of my comfortably living co-workers pay for their mortgages each month.

I definitely hear you on that. My master's was paid for with an assistantship. The bachelor's didn't cost me too much (I went at the right time. Tuition has sky-rocketed since.) Yet my doctorate alone is going to put me 6 figures in debt. 6 figures!!!

So yes, I'll be in my early 30s when I graduate, and may have to move back in with my parents for at least another year, much to deep's dismay.

 

[cobl04]

this thread has taken a decidedly depressing turn lol.

i reckon i'll be about 247 years old when i finish paying off my HECS

 

[A_Wanderer]

I've decided to get a job whilst the market is good (graduate geologists can expect $60,000+) and do my PhD later (probably in my early thirties). I hope to gain financial security that will permit me to devote most of my life to research science. It should also give me experience and maturity to succeed at a doctorate.

My parents, partner and friends have strongly recommended buying property and it seems like a good choice. I just need to do the research over the next two years as I save up a deposit. I don't particularly want to be a slave to a mortgage but I think I can live austerely enough while I'm young to have a stable future.

 

[Kieran McConville]

As an Australian, I'm not sure HECS is comparable to US-style student loans. At all. Unless something has changed since the days when I acquired my (relatively modest) HECS debt. I tend to question the hype that surrounds it.

 

[KhanadaRhodes]

Not to mention that if you worked during high school as I did and many do to save for college, there are restrictions on how long you can work (child labor laws) which also prevents you from even making a dent in that cost.

exactly. i started working when i turned 14. i earned just enough to pay for my car insurance and cell phone. i could've worked a little more when i was in high school but i did try to focus on my studies and also tried to have a little bit of a life outside of work.

I definitely hear you on that. My master's was paid for with an assistantship. The bachelor's didn't cost me too much (I went at the right time. Tuition has sky-rocketed since.) Yet my doctorate alone is going to put me 6 figures in debt. 6 figures!!!

you're right, that's insane. people who want to go into graduate and postgraduate studies should be encouraged. getting a six figure debt just from your phd is ridiculous. the politicians who think this shit's acceptable or the lucky few who can become professional students (while not racking up insane amounts of debt doing it) are out of touch with the real world.

 

[Liesje]

Yeah I am not unfamiliar with six figure debt I mean, it's doable and we're fine but it's depressing when you see people in every OTHER situation getting breaks from the government... food, unemployment, incentives for buying a home or a newer car, companies getting bailed out.... um, how about honest, hard working people that got a good education and now have secure jobs? What an idea...

 

[financeguy]

My parents, partner and friends have strongly recommended buying property and it seems like a good choice. I just need to do the research over the next two years as I save up a deposit. I don't particularly want to be a slave to a mortgage but I think I can live austerely enough while I'm young to have a stable future.

Ho hum. I have long been of the opinion that the Australian property market was in the last few years, and remains, an enormous bubble.

In any case, contrary to popular opinion, average inflation adjusted real estate returns over the long term are quite modest, only around 1-2% per annum.

If you do buy, make sure it is somewhere that you could live in for the next twenty years - or, if not, at least somewhere that can be rented out with ease, and that the rental payments would at least cover the interest on the mortgage.

 

[financeguy]

My university fees in Ireland were the equivalent of around $2,000 per year in the early nineties. Allowing for inflation that's still only around $4,000 per year in today's money.

 

[trojanchick99]

I work for a university, and not all of it is the 20 somethings fault.

Sure there are some who feel they are entitled to a 6 figure job out of school, but most are just struggling to pay off what has become absolutely ridiculous student loan debt. The current Cost of Attendance at my school is over 50K a year. Sure financial aid can be generous but I know people who will be leaving undergrad with over 100K in student loan debt.

Something needs to be done.

 

[Liesje]

My university fees in Ireland were the equivalent of around $2,000 per year in the early nineties. Allowing for inflation that's still only around $4,000 per year in today's money.

That's about half of what K-12 cost per kid.

 

[PhilsFan]

I work for a university, and not all of it is the 20 somethings fault.

Sure there are some who feel they are entitled to a 6 figure job out of school, but most are just struggling to pay off what has become absolutely ridiculous student loan debt. The current Cost of Attendance at my school is over 50K a year. Sure financial aid can be generous but I know people who will be leaving undergrad with over 100K in student loan debt.

Something needs to be done.

Financial aid is hardly generous.

I'm in my third semester and already have tens of thousands in debt.

 

[A_Wanderer]

Ho hum. I have long been of the opinion that the Australian property market was in the last few years, and remains, an enormous bubble.

In any case, contrary to popular opinion, average inflation adjusted real estate returns over the long term are quite modest, only around 1-2% per annum.

If you do buy, make sure it is somewhere that you could live in for the next twenty years - or, if not, at least somewhere that can be rented out with ease, and that the rental payments would at least cover the interest on the mortgage.

Cheers, I was thinking along the same lines - buy somewhere that I would be pleased to live that is reasonably close to the essentials.

 

[maycocksean]

I did pretty well financially in school. I had a full ride for four years, so I only ended up taking out a loan for about $15,000 to cover the fifth year I had, when I changed majors. My wife, on the other hand, borrowed $75,000 for her two degrees and we will pay north of $100,000 by the time that and the interest is paid off. I heard something about some loan forgivness program but I don't know how it works.

 

[Moonlit_Angel]

people in their 40s and up should remember a time when a college education could be paid for with summer jobs bagging groceries.

Yes. Absolutely. I wish that were still the case.

College expenses are ridiculous. I'm all for paying a reasonable amount to help get me into school and pay for classes and books and whatnot, that's fine, but nobody should have to be drowning themselves in debt just to pay to go to public universities. If more people felt they had a shot at affording college, I bet you'd see a heck of a lot more of them striving to go. PhilsFan's post about financial aid depresses me .

i also think that the 20s are a time when you should pursue a dream, if you know what that dream might be, or to search for that dream. but i think, naturally, when you shift into your 30s, the more practical aspects of life take over, and you become more able to work a 9-to-5 that is respectable and funds the rest of your life, and you're fine with that. i just think that many 25 year olds won't be happy feeling as if they've "settled" and would be happier trying to pursue what it really is that they want to do, and even if it doesn't work out, at least they can say that they tried. and then life will take it's course, and the idea of "settling" doesn't quite mean to a 35 year old what it might mean to a 25 year old. there are many, many ways to get through life, and everything is in constant negotiation.

my only advice would be to follow your gut, and to listen to what it is that you *really* want -- whether that's something to help you afford your true passions, or whether your true passion is working very hard for very little money, or if your true passion is not so much the work itself but the feeling of accomplishment in a fast paced environment, or if you've got some hungry mouths to feed and uninteresting but solid work is a mere 5-minute drive from home.

Honestly, you have no idea how comforting and reassuring and inspiring this part of your post is. I really like what you said here, and fully agree with you. My biggest issue regarding my dream is finding the right means to get in touch with people to make it come true. I've joined writing groups in school and had a few things published in class booklets here and there, and have a few stories saved online at various sites, which is certainly a start. I just want to know how to contact people who can help me further my dream (and how to pick the genuine help from the scammers) and things of that nature. I have the motivation, the interest, all that good stuff. I just need the contacts/connections.

Angela