Too "Fat" To Be Surgeon General?

[BVS]

Martial Arts is a great way to keep in shape. I've had my blackbelt in Tae Kwon Do for 22 years, I'm not as active in it as I used to be but still keep up with it...

 

[BEAL]

ditto. lot of MA programs are now offering total body fitness type classes instead of the full blown self defense as alternatives for those who don't want to get punched in the face

I've been doing tkd for 5 1/2 years and I love it! 2nd D black. Summer time little less because I golf, but its one of the best cardio workouts you can do.

 

[anitram]

Honestly, I don't know. But, I gained weight while doing martial arts.

That's because you lost less fat mass than you put on muscle mass. Which is probably a good thing.

Muscle doesn't weigh more than fat. But for example, last year I wanted to lost 15 lbs and I lost 18 but then when I was done my weight loss, I took up weight training in earnest and packed on like 8 lbs of muscle. Thing is, my body looks WAY better with the muscle because every limb, etc, is totally toned, so I think women should stop being paranoid about doing resistance training.

 

[Jive Turkey]

Muscle vs Fat myth:

Muscle Weighs More Than Fat Myth

That article is ridiculous. No one ever claimed that 5 lbs of muscle weighs more than 5 lbs of fat That doesnt even make sense. The article is arguing against an argument that isnt even an argument. in their photographic 'proof' they even had to use a bigger volume of fat than muscle to get the same weight. So the muscle DOES weight more than the same volume of fat. Its like showing 5 lbs of lead and 5 lbs of feathers and saying they weight the same, so lead isnt heavier than feathers. whoever wrote that is a mouth breather

 

[Liesje]

That article is ridiculous. No one ever claimed that 5 lbs of muscle weighs more than 5 lbs of fat That doesnt even make sense. The article is arguing against an argument that isnt even an argument. in their photographic 'proof' they even had to use a bigger volume of fat than muscle to get the same weight. So the muscle DOES weight more than the same volume of fat. Its like showing 5 lbs of lead and 5 lbs of feathers and saying they weight the same, so lead isnt heavier than feathers. whoever wrote that is a mouth breather

Right, but so often I hear the "muscle weighs more than fat" to justify one's appearance being bigger, or actually growing in size. The article clearly dispells that myth. Even if you GAIN weight by replacing fat with muscle, then you should at the very least stay the same size if not get smaller because the muscle takes up less volume. When I did gymnastics some of the coaches who were still really active would get their body fat measured. These were lean, muscular, fit looking guys. The smaller their body fat percentage, the more lean and fit they looked, not the other way around. You don't go from looking fat b/c you have a lot of fat to looking even fatter because you lost fat and replaced it with muscle.

 

[Jive Turkey]

Right, but so often I hear the "muscle weighs more than fat" to justify one's appearance being bigger, or actually growing in size. The article clearly dispells that myth. Even if you GAIN weight by replacing fat with muscle, then you should at the very least stay the same size if not get smaller because the muscle takes up less volume. When I did gymnastics some of the coaches who were still really active would get their body fat measured. These were lean, muscular, fit looking guys. The smaller their body fat percentage, the more lean and fit they looked, not the other way around. You don't go from looking fat b/c you have a lot of fat to looking even fatter because you lost fat and replaced it with muscle.

I dont even understand what the argument is. Of course if their body fat percentage was less, they'd look lean and fit. Fat is an outer layer, so with less of it, you can see more definition of underlying muscle. Why would someone even think it might be the other way around? Its completely counter intuitive. and for people who are already fat and start lifting heavy weights, they arent actually replacing fat with muscle. They're building muscle and, unless they are also doing cardio, they are most likely not losing fat. They're bulking up muscle underneath the fat, so they might actually be getting bigger while putting on muscle, but they're still fat

 

[BVS]

The article is arguing against an argument that isnt even an argument.

That's kind of the point. Have you never heard anyone use that excuse? I hear it all the time.

 

[UberBeaver]

I didn't have a problem with a fat surgeon general til I noticed she was a WOMAN???

HELLO!

 

[Jive Turkey]

That's kind of the point. Have you never heard anyone use that excuse? I hear it all the time.

Whats the excuse? Maybe I'm missing something. A fat person saying they're heavy because they're muscular?

 

[BVS]

Whats the excuse? Maybe I'm missing something. A fat person saying they're heavy because they're muscular?

I usually hear it from people who are suprised they gained weight. They started working out but they either don't work out properly or they actually start to eat more because they're working out etc... When they find out they've actually gained weight they usually have the excuse that: "well muscle weighs more than fat".

I've heard it all my life, especially now more than ever working in the medical field.

 

[Jive Turkey]

I usually hear it from people who are suprised they gained weight. They started working out but they either don't work out properly or they actually start to eat more because they're working out etc... When they find out they've actually gained weight they usually have the excuse that: "well muscle weighs more than fat".

I've heard it all my life, especially now more than ever working in the medical field.

Oh, well thats a little different then. Just people lying to themselves. It doesnt change the fact that muscle does weigh more though. And its completely possible to add muscle, not lose fat, and get bigger/heavier....probably not in these people's cases though. I'd assume they arent power lifting or anything. but I getcha

 

[yolland]

would anyone be questioning "her weight" and therefore credibility for selection if she were a white male?
i doubt it.

I really don't think race is an issue here. If there's a general tendency in American society for people to be quicker to deem an individual "fat" on the basis of skin color specifically, I've never noticed it. Gender could always potentially be an issue, since the aesthetic preference for slender female bodies is stronger than the preference for slender male bodies. So yes, it'd be difficult to rule out the possibility that perceptions of her figure as "unattractive"--a judgment having zilch to do with health--might be exaggerating any concerns here. But, she is being nominated for Surgeon General after all, the highest-ranking public health position one can hold in this country. If you go to the Office of the Surgeon General's website, you'll see that 'Childhood Obesity Prevention' is their lead campaign right now, and that their advice is geared towards measures meant for children and adults to follow together, which only makes sense. And realistically, if you're a parent who's having trouble motivating yourself to help your overweight or obese child become more fit, it's not gonna help if the doctors advising you on that issue are overweight or obese too, because Look, this doc clearly doesn't practice what s/he preaches, so it can't be that important. Is that actually in the doctor's job description, nope, but the reality is it influences patients' perceptions nonetheless.

Like I said, I don't ultimately see this as a worthy disqualifier--she's not all that overweight, she might well personally have 'good genes' plus an already fairly healthy lifestyle and thus have excellent bloodwork, decent cardiovascular fitness, etc. despite the overweight. But I don't think it's an illegitimate issue, either, and people huffing about "Well she's not aiming to be Supermodel General!" etc. are guilty of intentionally exaggerating the potential aesthetic component of it so as to devalue a serious public health issue.

 

[Jive Turkey]

would anyone be questioning "her weight" and therefore credibility for selection if she were a white male?
i doubt it.

such a knee jerk response

 

[BVS]

If there's a general tendency in American society for people to be quicker to deem an individual "fat" on the basis of skin color specifically, I've never noticed it.

I think if you already have race issues you are quicker to point out overweight people of the race you have issues with... Here where I live it just adds to the "lazy mexican" "lazy ******" stereotype. I live in one of the fattest cities in the U.S. and it doesn't matter about color, but one thing I've noticed that the overweight white woman is quicker to point out the overweight black woman as "fat" than they are themselves or another overweight white woman. Because of what I do, I'm surrounded by diabetics, most of which are obese, and instead of having empathy for one each other they just seem to be oblivious to their own health issues and talk about those that are slightly fatter than they are

 

[BVS]

such a knee jerk response

You don't think overweight men have it slightly easier than overweight women?

 

[Jive Turkey]

You don't think overweight men have it slightly easier than overweight women?

It was more the combination of sex and race that I was referring to. But yes, I think overweight females get the short end of the stick

 

[yolland]

I think if you already have race issues you are quicker to point out overweight people of the race you have issues with... Here where I live it just adds to the "lazy mexican" "lazy ******" stereotype. I live in one of the fattest cities in the U.S. and it doesn't matter about color, but one thing I've noticed that the overweight white woman is quicker to point out the overweight black woman as "fat" than they are themselves or another overweight white woman. Because of what I do, I'm surrounded by diabetics, most of which are obese, and instead of having empathy for one each other they just seem to be oblivious to their own health issues and talk about those that are slightly fatter than they are

Hmmm, interesting. I haven't personally heard comments of either type you're describing; then again, maybe I'm out of touch from having spent most of my last two decades in an academic environment, which is definitely a fairly health- and fitness- (and appearance-) conscious one. Although, now that I think about it, I have occasionally heard colleagues make jokes in poor form about 'fat' students (to other faculty, I mean--not in front of students!), whereas I don't think I've ever heard them joke about overweight faculty, even though there certainly are some. And obviously there's a socially hierarchical relationship there, the teacher-student thing, greater temptation to prematurely lump people into imaginary good/bad 'character' boxes and so on. (Course, we probably don't want to know what the students say behind our backs, lol...)

 

[Liesje]

And its completely possible to add muscle, not lose fat, and get bigger/heavier....probably not in these people's cases though.

eh? Maybe if you already have no/very little fat to lose....

But yeah, what BVS said. I hear it all the time as well. Overweight people start working out....and they're not losing weight or getting smaller, usually because they are not eating healthy or the exercise is only marginal, but I hear "well muscle weighs more than fat..." as if it's normal/appropriate to stay the same size or even get bigger while supposedly working out a lot more. I don't think so. If you are really working out, then you are burning fat regardless of also adding muscle. If you are working out and getting bigger in size (not necessarily weight) and/or not getting any more toned, then you are doing something wrong.

I'm not trying to be offensive or whatever, I personally know people who do this and use this excuse and doesn't mean I care one way or the other about their weight or my weight. But the excuse makes no sense.

 

[Jive Turkey]

eh? Maybe if you already have no/very little fat to lose....

Thats not true. If you're lifting heavy weights and doing no cardio, you wont burn fat. It doesnt matter if you have a lot of a little. Heavy lifting doesnt burn fat.

 

[Jive Turkey]

Like these guys

I guarantee they work out all the time. they're fat and they're muscular. Since they only really do heavy lifting, they arent going to burn fat

 

[Jive Turkey]

I'm not trying to be offensive or whatever

I'm not making my argument from personal experience just principle. I'm not a fatty, no offense taken

 

[bigjohn2441]

Martial Arts is a great way to keep in shape. I've had my blackbelt in Tae Kwon Do for 22 years, I'm not as active in it as I used to be but still keep up with it...

i've been taking karate (Tang Soo Do) since 1993. reached 2nd degree blackbelt. almost had 3rd but had to stop cause of this job / relocation thing.

i used to set up those freestanding kicking bags that you can adjust the height and run across the room and do flying side sicks over one of them (around 4ft tall) and kick the other taller one over. now i probably couldnt kick above my head. you loose it quick.

 

[BVS]

you loose it quick.

Yes you do. I have a photograph that someone took of me doing a sidekick and my legs were perfectly in line, I was basically doing the splits, this was in college, and after injury and studies my work out was less intense and no matter what I've never come close to getting my flexibility back. My endurance and strength I can always get back after awhile but my flexiblity is gone, I mean I can still put my legs behind my head and a few things most guys can't do at my age but nothing like I used to have...

Tang Soo Do, that's Korean as well, right?

 

[A stor]

Martial Arts is a great way to keep in shape. I've had my blackbelt in Tae Kwon Do for 22 years, I'm not as active in it as I used to be but still keep up with it...

I have a black belt in Shotokan. I haven't trained in over eight years. Because, of a very serious back injury. I wasn't able to walk for over a month. But, I do keep active.

When, I was talking about a little extra weight for women as the age. I was talking about a few pounds. Not morbid obesity. Say, for an example. If you are a women who is perimenopause/menopause and can't lose that last ten pounds. It's okay. Ten pounds over the BMI weight range for your height. Isn't going to effect your health as long as you don't smoke, eat healthy and stay active.

 

[A stor]

eh? Maybe if you already have no/very little fat to lose....

But yeah, what BVS said. I hear it all the time as well. Overweight people start working out....and they're not losing weight or getting smaller, usually because they are not eating healthy or the exercise is only marginal, but I hear "well muscle weighs more than fat..." as if it's normal/appropriate to stay the same size or even get bigger while supposedly working out a lot more. I don't think so. If you are really working out, then you are burning fat regardless of also adding muscle. If you are working out and getting bigger in size (not necessarily weight) and/or not getting any more toned, then you are doing something wrong.

I'm not trying to be offensive or whatever, I personally know people who do this and use this excuse and doesn't mean I care one way or the other about their weight or my weight. But the excuse makes no sense.

I think you are right and have made a very good point about healthy weight loss. It must be gradual and also, constant. Exercise must be done on a regular basis. And because you exercise, doesn't give you card blanche to eat more. Fruits and vegetables, like your grandma said, are good for you. So is protein. Carbs and sugars are something you may want to discuss with your doctor.

I have pre-type 2 diabetes. Which, I am so far, controlling with diet and exercise....no meds or insulin, yet. But, I also know. I have several high risk factors. One being, a diabetic pregnancy. I was told at age twenty seven. I would develop type 2, later on in life. Not all diabetics are over weight, either. I am a healthy BMI for my age. But, if you are diabetic. Weight is something you want to watch and that goes for being under weight too.

 

[Liesje]

I guarantee they work out all the time. they're fat and they're muscular. Since they only really do heavy lifting, they arent going to burn fat

Yeah they look like they eat all the time too. And how much time do they actually spend lifting? Lifting a truck once every few minutes isn't really the type of workout I meant. The people I know "working out" and not losing weight or gaining much muscle are not trying to set world records. If you are doing reps like normal people in a gym you should build muscle AND burn calories. Maybe not burn as many calories as a cardio workout or build as much muscle as a weight lifting champion but those guys are beside the point.

 

[anitram]

Thats not true. If you're lifting heavy weights and doing no cardio, you wont burn fat. It doesnt matter if you have a lot of a little. Heavy lifting doesnt burn fat.

Sure it does, so long as your caloric intake is less than your caloric expenditure.

Fat will be burned as soon as you consume less than your energy output. It's just that cardio work burns calories faster.

 

[A stor]

True.....you have to burn more calories than your intake. And weight loss should always be done with the supervision of your doctor. She/he knows your medical history and will determine, what is best for you.

 

[Jive Turkey]

Yeah they look like they eat all the time too. And how much time do they actually spend lifting? Lifting a truck once every few minutes isn't really the type of workout I meant. The people I know "working out" and not losing weight or gaining much muscle are not trying to set world records. If you are doing reps like normal people in a gym you should build muscle AND burn calories. Maybe not burn as many calories as a cardio workout or build as much muscle as a weight lifting champion but those guys are beside the point.

They do look like they eat all the time, but so do bodybuilders. Its not really the point. I bet those guys dont really get much fatter than they already are. All I'm saying is that fat burning and muscle growth CAN be independent. Not that its the norm. But regardless, that wasnt even my original point, which was muscle most certainly does weigh more than fat

 

[Jive Turkey]

Sure it does, so long as your caloric intake is less than your caloric expenditure.

Fat will be burned as soon as you consume less than your energy output. It's just that cardio work burns calories faster.

But now we can be talking about diet as well. Lets say that caloric intake and expenditure are a wash. Just building muscle doesnt necessarily mean you're going to lose fat