Tipping Point - Sexual Harassment In America

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Another day, another pervert.

Remember when we had posters here trying to convince us the media blows up racism and sexism and it's really all just great in 2017...
 
All the time. Patient satisfaction scores are a big deal in medicine right now, and we have provider coaches going around all the time telling us to greet people warmly, smile more, thank them for their time, etc.

Context does matter, after all.
 
Yes that's an entirely different context. As an aside I think it's ridiculous too, focus should be elsewhere. Dealing with my mother's illness for almost three years now and so many doctors and staff and the whole rest of it. Smiling while making people wait 45 min or more-nah. Making things like refills a colossal hassle. Smile?

My mother's surgeon actually chewed gum during one of our appointments. After we found out she had incurable cancer, he says to me "is everything ok"? I said no, everything 's not ok. He then says well it is what it is. Ugh. That's fine Belichick post game media snark. Not to a patient's daughter who found that out one week after her birthday.

Luckily one of her doctors is an absolute gem and treats me so well that it's a true blessing in my life.

Now I have to go look up what AL Franken did.
 
The lock her up crowd are extremely concerned about innocent until proven guilty now, they’re very concerned about ruining a good judge’s name, and only because another woman wants her 5 minutes.

We’re fucked...
 
God damn it, Al Franken.

My thoughts exactly :sigh:.

I don't recall people really telling me I needed to smile more. I'm sure there were some who did at some point, but I don't remember that ever really being a thing for me the way it has for other people. The big thing people tend to say about me is, "You're always so quiet. Speak up more!"
 
God damn it, Al Franken.
My thoughts exactly :sigh:.
hoooo, boy. :sigh:


I don't recall people really telling me I needed to smile more. I'm sure there were some who did at some point, but I don't remember that ever really being a thing for me the way it has for other people. The big thing people tend to say about me is, "You're always so quiet. Speak up more!

If they could only see you here! Such good posting.
 
If they could only see you here! Such good posting.

Heh, thanks :). I just tend to feel much more comfortable communicating when I'm writing (or typing) than I do when I'm speaking to somebody in person (unless I'm comfortable around them and know them well). I used to be painfully shy as a kid, too, which I think explains some of that awkwardness.
 
I was spitting mad when I saw tweeter in chief tweet snark at Franken yesterday.

Pussy grabber says what?
 
"When you're a star, they let you do it. You can do anything."
- the President of the United States

As much as I am gratified to see creeps go down and would like to see Trump face the same kind of pressure based on pretty clear evidence, this speedy public trial of celebrities via social media feels gross and kind of dangerous.
 
Agreed about the speedy public trial thing.

It's difficult for me. When will someone accuse as a conspiracy? Has someone already done so? What happens when someone doesn't believe a real accuser in this new post-Weinstein age?

Makes me uncomfortable.
 
At this point, I have no reason to doubt any of these accusers - not that I'm anybody. And a lot of these accused men are acknowledging their assholery.

But - and to keep this close to the board - what if someone accused a Bono, for instance? For whatever reason. There are pictures of Bono cavorting with young women in bathing suits. Plenty of people dislike Bono - it would be knives out.

I'm not sure we're equipped as a culture to deal with this correctly.
 
I was spitting mad when I saw tweeter in chief tweet snark at Franken yesterday.

Pussy grabber says what?

Yeah, I saw an article earlier talking about that, and people on Twitter came out in full force making similar arguments. Stuff it, Trump.

(They also noted that he hasn't made a peep about all the stuff going on with Moore.)
 
At this point, I have no reason to doubt any of these accusers - not that I'm anybody. And a lot of these accused men are acknowledging their assholery.

But - and to keep this close to the board - what if someone accused a Bono, for instance? For whatever reason. There are pictures of Bono cavorting with young women in bathing suits. Plenty of people dislike Bono - it would be knives out.

I'm not sure we're equipped as a culture to deal with this correctly.



Yes I agree, there's been no reason to doubt anyone so far. And so far, the accusers have been equipped and have had backup and evidence.

I'm worried about the accuser that isn't. For fear of them either not being listened to (a la Trump) or conspiring (and threatening the meaning of public accusations).
 
At this point, I have no reason to doubt any of these accusers - not that I'm anybody. And a lot of these accused men are acknowledging their assholery.

But - and to keep this close to the board - what if someone accused a Bono, for instance? For whatever reason. There are pictures of Bono cavorting with young women in bathing suits. Plenty of people dislike Bono - it would be knives out.

I'm not sure we're equipped as a culture to deal with this correctly.




I’ve been thinking this as well, thank you for saying this.

The culture has changed a lot in 30 years. We also have to draw distinctions between a monster (Weinstein) and a creep (Frankin). As well as those who acknowledge wrong doing and apologize (Louis CK) and those who deny and play victim (Trump, Moore).

This is complex territory. On one hand, it seems simple — this is bad, often illegal, behavior. But I’m not sure where this could be heading. I’m thrilled that victims are empowered to come forward, but I’m not sure anyone has led a mistake free life and the culture is different than it was 30 years ago. (But then, I don’t take pictures like the Frankin picture, so ... dunno, pondering a lot of this stuff right now).
 
. I’m thrilled that victims are empowered to come forward, but I’m not sure anyone has led a mistake free life and the culture is different than it was 30 years ago. (But then, I don’t take pictures like the Frankin picture, so ... dunno, pondering a lot of this stuff right now).

Times have definitely changed and going back 30 or 50 years is problematic in instances where it is an act that may have been culturally defined/approved (NOT criminal) but is not today. I think what's needed there is proper context and a separation of what we find distasteful today from what was clearly inappropriate and illegal even back then.

Which is to say that at no point do I think we should excuse any sort of child sexual assault or harassment. Or outright assault against women, up to and including rape. I don't care if everybody in your small town in the middle of nowhere was doing it - NOT acceptable.

What do you do with old men who would pat their secretary on the behind or make jokes about the receptionists breast size in front of her? It's distasteful, it's clearly 100% inappropriate today, but does such an act from a person in 1965 disqualify them from participation in polite society today? I don't think that we can make that leap.
 
FWIW, Mika on Morning Joe really held court on this issue this morning, and she did a nice job pushing the issue deeper.
 
Just in case anyone's still mystified as to why people are so desperate to defend Roy Moore:

https://www.yahoo.com/news/came-clear-roy-moore-apos-194952547.html

Some oh-so-charming comments from his supporters in here, too:

Several women attacked Moore’s accusers, saying the stories of abuse they’ve heard from multiple news outlets smell fishy. Martha Shiber, 79, wondered why one of the young women didn’t tell her parents she’d been attacked.

“She didn’t say anything to her mother about it ― why didn’t she tell her mom? Why didn’t the mother say anything about it?” Shiber said to HuffPost. “Roy has a beautiful wife! Why would he want to fool with some ugly-looking woman? She needs a sign over her head asking to pay for somebody to be with her.”

Even if the allegations turned out to be true, some voters wouldn’t be swayed. Montgomery native Tim Hensley, 58, was seen arguing with a protester just outside the event. The protester held a sign that read “Roy Moore is a pedophile.” Hensley told HuffPost that he’d forgive Moore for sexual assault.

“Nothing’s really gonna change my mind,” he said. “This was 40 years ago. I probably did some things I wasn’t proud of then. I’d forgive him unless we found out about something, say, five years ago.”

The sheer stupidity on display here is truly something else :|.
 
Yeah, no amount of evidence will cut through the tribalism in this country. Some people would rather vote for a pedophile than a democrat. There can be mass shootings in schools, churches, and a goddamn country music festival and people still won’t consider gun control.
 
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