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Old 01-09-2009, 06:31 PM   #16
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None of the companies I checked would insure people in my state, so it all came down to the one state-chartered provider. Hardly competitive.
In the state of TX we have quite a few providers to choose from, the interesting part is that there's almost no direct provider to provider comparison to shop with... It's apples and oranges. One will be excellent with drugs but horrible with surgery, and vice versa, and this results in people actually having a primary and secondary insurance.

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On the other hand, the idea of health insurance, in general, is anti-capitalist and anti-competitive, which may be why medical costs are monstrously high and unchecked, thus now making insurance itself unaffordable.
I work in the medical industry so I see on a daily basis the mess that is healthcare. The problem is, there are so many players and they are all raising the price for the other person to the point where they are shooting themselves in the foot.

Health insurance is very capitalistic within themselves, but I understand what you are saying. The problem with health insurance as a capitalistic industry is that they screw those that need it the most, i.e. not covering very treatable genetic diseases, etc...

The other thing about health insurance, and I see this everyday, is they won't cover a very simple $100 device to treat a simple broken bone, but 3 months down the line when that fracture hasn't healed due to not being treated properly they will cover a $4,000 device or surgery that will heal the fracture.
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Old 01-09-2009, 06:40 PM   #17
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But according to the same Census report, there are 8.3 million uninsured people who make between $50,000 and $74,999 per year and 8.74 million who make more than $75,000 a year. That’s roughly 17 million people who ought to be able to “afford” health insurance because they make substantially more than the median household income of $46,326.
Terrific.

So you make $50K per year, but you also have student loans in the amount of $125K and live in an urban area like Boston, New York or San Fran. You SURELY MUST HAVE $391 extra lying around (that's the average premium cost for a single person on an employee plan) per month.

What a poorly constructed argument.
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Old 01-09-2009, 06:42 PM   #18
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It's not even the cost of the plans that's too expensive, it's paying all the money for the plans and then STILL having to pay insane deductibles or being denied for every this or that. I can't figure out what my insurance covers besides generic prescriptions and annual physicals only with your PCP. They haven't been covering Phil's appts with his neurologist, bloodwork the neuro requires in order to renew his prescription, and they only partially covered his last prescription. I had to pay for an urgent care visit because my PCP was closed for the Christmas holiday and I had a bacterial infection that needed antibiotics. I was in the room for less than 5 minutes and told the Dr. what was wrong with me and what scrip I needed (had the same infection a few years before), but I had to pay over $100 simply because my Dr was closed for a week. So you pay and pay and pay but can never reach the stupid deductible...so what exactly are we paying FOR? (dont answer that!) And I supposedly work for one of the best employers in its class as far as the benefits.

Anyway....
I hear you. The way I see it, these days all you're really "getting" from health insurance is financial saftey net if you're hit with some catastrophic illness that costs you substantially more than the deductible. But then apparently, some insurance companies also have this thing called coinsurance where, if I understand this correctly, you pay 10 to 20% of your medical bill that goes beyond the cost of the deductible and the insurance company picks up the rest. So say you have a $5000 medical bill and your deductible is 2500. You'd pay the 2500 plus another $500 for your coinsurance. Basically, what your insurance is doing is giving you a 2000 discount on your medical bill--which is better than paying the full $5000 but still would ruin me financially.

It's a real mess.
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Old 01-09-2009, 06:54 PM   #19
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I know we have many of our own problems in the UK, but as a student nurse I can't help but feel the way US healthcare is organised and run seems cruel.

That said I don't understand a great lot of it...all the different sorts of insurance seem overly complicated...Mind if I ask you folks a few questions on it? What is emergency care like? As in you have a major car crash, and need emergency surgery...is that free or does the insurance cover the full cost or ownly partly?
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Old 01-09-2009, 07:06 PM   #20
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What is emergency care like? As in you have a major car crash, and need emergency surgery...is that free or does the insurance cover the full cost or ownly partly?
I don't deal much with emergency care, but from my understanding if you have insurance they will cover it but it depends on your carrier how much. If you don't have the insurance you will still get care but it's pretty much and it's a loss for the hospital, often they will try and bill you but they won't get paid...
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Old 01-09-2009, 07:09 PM   #21
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So say if you need physio after an accident or continued medication and care, that would be reliant on your insurance coverage?
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Old 01-09-2009, 07:12 PM   #22
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Old 01-09-2009, 07:16 PM   #23
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Really I struggle to wrap my head round that, it strikes me as something bordering inhumane.

In healthcare would you have an idea of the general opinion of people in all fields, nurses, doctors, physios etc feel about the current system in the states? Would they prefer a more social healthcare approach or they like it as it is? Or maybe somewhere inbetween?
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Old 01-09-2009, 07:53 PM   #24
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You still haven't learned about your sources, yet. I see.
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Old 01-09-2009, 08:01 PM   #25
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Would they prefer a more social healthcare approach or they like it as it is? Or maybe somewhere inbetween?
The doctors I deal with for the most part would like something in between. They all pretty much hate the current system, but they are all leary of a full out social system.

The current system is making it harder and harder for them to do their job properly and get paid. But then again it also depends on the type of doctor.
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Old 01-09-2009, 08:02 PM   #26
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You still haven't learned about your sources, yet. I see.

What, you didn't find that to be credible?
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Old 01-09-2009, 11:29 PM   #27
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surely the absurd cost-to-charge ratios of many hospitals are also a contributing factor to increasing healthcare costs?
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Old 01-10-2009, 01:34 AM   #28
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surely the absurd cost-to-charge ratios of many hospitals are also a contributing factor to increasing healthcare costs?
This is exactly what I'm talking about those absurd cost to charge ratios are usually driven by the fact that there are so many players. For example I know of a electronic medical device that probably costs less than a hundred dollars to manufacture, but list price is $6,000. This is driven by the fact that insurance won't cover it except for extreme cases even though many more would benefit from it, sales reps, hospital costs, etc...

It could benefit more and cost less if insurance companies were structured differently.
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Old 01-10-2009, 01:43 AM   #29
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Yes, it is a truth universally acknowledged that monopolies drive down product prices.
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Old 01-10-2009, 02:32 AM   #30
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Yes, it is a truth universally acknowledged that monopolies drive down product prices.
Care to elaborate? I know you are being sarcastic, but what is the monopoly that you are implying?
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