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Old 07-27-2011, 08:37 AM   #76
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1 - is there any amount of money you could be paid to be this man's lawyer?
2 - if everyone the world over cries for harsher sentences for people like this why do they not listen? torture is the only suitable punishment.
3 - why are people who commit sick crimes given a chance to rehabilitate?
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Old 07-27-2011, 08:43 AM   #77
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I read somewhere that while 21 years is the maximum he can be handed at once, those sentences can be extended (by five year periods.) So in 21 years, it would be possible to just keep handing him five, then another five after that, then another five after that, etc etc for the rest of his life. I have no idea what the process is, if it's just a judge decision or there's another jury/hearing thingy of some sort, or if there's precedent or whatever. But no - they don't do US style sentencing (e.g. 21 years x X killed). And I don't think that is very common outside the US? I think that's one aspect of US murder/serious crime sentencing that's quite good.
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Old 07-27-2011, 12:13 PM   #78
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torture is the only suitable punishment.
You might want to think over this point.
And well, in the modern legal system someone has to be the lawyer. Like it or not, but the alternative would be much worse.
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Old 07-27-2011, 01:14 PM   #79
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In an article about his manifest on spiegel.de it was said that most of his work was copy & paste from right-wing bloggers and other authors, and only very little of the text apparently was written by himself.
Some parts (primarily about bomb-making) were plagiarized from the Unabomber, and some of the sections on "cultural Marxism" were plagiarized as well (from the Norwegian anti-Muslim blogger Fjordman, and a right-wing US think tank called the Free Congress Foundation). In other places he does cut and paste at length from various right-wing/anti-Muslim bloggers, although with attribution, not trying to pass their work off as his own. You could accurately enough describe the whole thing as a compilation of other people's writings accompanied by Breivik's running commentary and some "autobiographical" material. IMO, it's not really that difficult to distinguish between what he wrote vs. what's merely cited or plagiarized (though you'll probably give yourself a headache in the process).
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I hope Breiviks lawyer won't get through with a insanity defence.
In Norway does the defendant have the right to refuse an insanity defense? (Assuming he's found competent to stand trial in the first place.)
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Old 07-27-2011, 04:25 PM   #80
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Ok, interesting to hear, as the article put it more like little was written by him, and most was just a compilation (though cited, unlike our former Minister of Defence and various others). That article also was about how these people now are trying to distance themselves from Breivik and his ilk.
I'm on holidays at home, and it's 1518 pages. I guess I will spare me that.

I just hope for Europe in general that people who thought Wilders, Strache, Le Pen et al. are not that bad, and they are just saying what no one else isn't daring to say will wake up and see, even though of course none of them can be made responsible for what happened, they are indeed very dangerous for our society, and they are playing with exactly this kind of fire.
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Old 07-28-2011, 03:13 PM   #81
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I cross my fingers for custody that will be for life. I hope Breiviks lawyer won't get through with a insanity defence. In that case it won't mean that Breivik will be let out but held in forced treatment.
Local TV news said the prosecution wants to find a way to trial him for genocide/crimes against humanity, in which case the punishment is 30 years in prison.
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Old 07-28-2011, 04:01 PM   #82
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Whether he gets 21 or 30 years, he will still live the good life:

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The British newspaper The Telegraph focused on Norway's 1-year-old Halden Fengsel prison as a possible place where Breivik could serve his likely sentence. With a flatscreen television for every cell, cooking classes in its "kitchen laboratory" and female prison staff to create a less aggressive atmosphere, Halden was intended to have its inmates re-enter society better than when they left it to serve time. That approach to its prison system has given Norway a 20 percent recidivism rate for the first two years after convicts are released.
Could Norway rampage suspect go to posh prison? - World Watch - CBS News
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Old 07-28-2011, 05:11 PM   #83
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I just hope for Europe in general that people who thought Wilders, Strache, Le Pen et al. are not that bad, and they are just saying what no one else isn't daring to say will wake up and see, even though of course none of them can be made responsible for what happened, they are indeed very dangerous for our society, and they are playing with exactly this kind of fire.
Wouldn't vote for any of those people, but TBH I think that this attitude from the left - the subtle attempt to close down debate - is much more dangerous.
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Old 07-28-2011, 05:14 PM   #84
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I think that this attitude from the left - the subtle attempt to close down debate - is much more dangerous.

I guess we need a dead body recount?
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Old 07-28-2011, 05:18 PM   #85
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1 - is there any amount of money you could be paid to be this man's lawyer? ?
If I was a Norwegian criminal defense lawyer, I would do it for the normal rate - no more, no less. It would be a very interesting, albeit traumatic, case to work on, and you would learn a lot.

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if everyone the world over cries for harsher sentences for people like this why do they not listen?
This is a matter for the people of Norway.

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3 - why are people who commit sick crimes given a chance to rehabilitate?
Most criminal justice systems are too focused on punishment and not enough on rehabilitaton. Norway's is much better than most in this regard. I hope they do not change it.
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Old 07-28-2011, 05:20 PM   #86
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I guess we need dead body recount?
What?
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Old 07-28-2011, 05:20 PM   #87
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Wouldn't vote for any of those people, but TBH I think that this attitude from the left - the subtle attempt to close down debate - is much more dangerous.
This subtle attempt, which by the way in most countries stems from both the left and the right, is what paved the way for these populists to get so much support for their vitriol.
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Old 07-28-2011, 09:23 PM   #88
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What is so disturbing about it? It's a youth organisation, and they have summer camps. With some fun time, discussion groups etc. Just like any other organisation would have. Far from brainwashing or something like that, which would indeed be disturbing.
It's the youth wing of a political party, no?
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Old 07-29-2011, 02:42 AM   #89
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It was hectic at work today.

 
I was as busy as a Norwegian florist.

 
Too soon?
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Old 07-29-2011, 02:42 AM   #90
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It was hectic at work today.

 
I was as busy as a Norwegian florist.

 
Too soon?
You suck.
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