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Old 08-27-2015, 12:40 AM   #76
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Old 08-27-2015, 04:22 AM   #77
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I'm getting so frustrated with the whole "knives/cars" comparisons that always seem to come up in these debates. Yes, knives and cars have been used to commit murder. Absolutely.

But that is not their only use. That is not what they were designed for. They have plenty of non-violent uses.

Guns? Not so much. Their ONLY purpose is to injure or kill humans or animals. That's it. Nothing else. Therefore, it seems blatantly obvious to me that they would be regulated and dealt with differently than knives and cars would.

And it just flat out boggles my mind how, every single time this issue comes up, we can blame any and everything else under the sun for these crimes-video games, violent shows and films, mental illness, etc.-except for the very weapon that actually killed these people. WHY is the actual thing that killed somebody so sacred that we can't dare scrutinize it or criticize how guns are treated/handled by their owners, or question why someone thinks they need to have an entire arsenal of weapons in their home that no average citizen should ever even want, let alone need, to own. Weapons that should solely be relegated to law enforcement and military use, mind, and even then, should be used sparingly at that.

I saw a story on Larry Wilmore's show some time back about some place that banned or restricted the sale of toy guns. Toy guns. Fake guns that will not hurt or kill anyone. You (general you) mean to tell me that we can do that for toy guns but when it comes to the real thing we just kind of have to shrug and go, "Eh, people are going to shoot people no matter what, what're ya gonna do?" No.

These people were struck down by a gun. That is an inarguable fact. The person who shot them clearly should not have had any sort of access to getting a gun. That is also an inarguable fact.

And it is high time we finally actually address this issue, because I am beyond sick and tired of going online or turning on the news and hearing about these kinds of stories seemingly every other damned week. I live in an area of the country where people own guns, and lots of them, and as a result, every story of this sort that I hear makes me a little more nervous. Especially considering how...unstable...some of the gun owners around here tend to be.

The pro-gun side cannot continue to keep sticking their collective heads in the sand on this issue anymore. They just can't. At some point, all these innocent people who've died have to start taking precedence over people's precious weapons, the vast majority of which I'm pretty sure they can live without owning.
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Old 08-27-2015, 06:13 AM   #78
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Old 08-27-2015, 06:36 AM   #79
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Guns are obviously not the problem. Guns and gun access laws are totally not the reason why there are so many gun related homicides in the US, compared to the rest of the world...
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Old 08-27-2015, 08:16 AM   #80
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While I'm so saddened for the family's and coworkers and friends of these two innocents what's becoming alarming to myself is how I'm reacting to this. In years past I would be so upset over this and prolly on here spouting off about the NRA and gun control and the Impaler would be answering me that the shooter was the victim in all of this and somehow I'm partly to blame...... My desensitization is more alarming than the actual act, it's alarming to me, the things that I know will be true:

1>. The gun debate will rage for a few weeks
2>. Politicians will get on their soapboxes and proclaim this is the time that they shall stop this senseless violence.
3>. The above politicians will count on the short attention span of the general American citizen will be then more worried about who The Bachlorette will pick or who to vote off of Dancing With The Stars
4>. This will be forgotten until....
5>. It happens again
6>. Repeat steps 1-5

Thinking gun control only would stop this is stupid, deflecting the point onto mental illness is also stupid...... but doing nothing (which I'm sure will happen) is what we Americans are going to get, no leadership in government with all of the elected officials deeply embedded in the NRA's pockets is what to expect.
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Old 08-27-2015, 08:51 AM   #81
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Correct me if I'm wrong, please, but Australia did not effectively ban guns. Australia made it much more difficult to purchase guns, and have much stronger regulations, but my reading is that in no way did they ban guns.
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Old 08-27-2015, 09:09 AM   #82
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I don't actually believe that guns would be banned. But that doesn't stop some from calling for it and pretending the second amendment doesn't exist. Or that it's somehow been misinterpreted for the past two and a half centuries since it was created, which I don't understand.
The 18th Amendment existed. Until it didn't.

The 2nd Amendment should be changed. The Constitution was made to be a living breathing document. It was NEVER meant to be the end all, be all. It was specifically designed to be changed as times changed.

So guess what?

Times have fucking changed.

You want a gun so that you can protect yourself in the ways the forefathers intended? Sure! No problem.



Knock yourself the fuck out.

This gun culture in which we live in has to fucking stop. The guns need to go.

Is our record on mental health deplorable in this country? Absolutely. But that doesn't change that it's just too fucking easy for anyone and everyone to get a weapon of death that is completely and utterly unnecessary for the average citizen.
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Old 08-27-2015, 09:11 AM   #83
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Yeah? How so?
Enabling.
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Old 08-27-2015, 09:18 AM   #84
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Correct me if I'm wrong, please, but Australia did not effectively ban guns. Australia made it much more difficult to purchase guns, and have much stronger regulations, but my reading is that in no way did they ban guns.


You can effectively ban guns without actually banning guns. That's how we need to go about this. Treat guns as a product with as much need to regulate as cars, and with the social responsibility of cigarettes. A gun in a house with children should be treated with the same opprobrium as a woman drinking and smoking while pregnant. Bring back shame, apply warning labels, tax the shit out of guns and bullets, make life inconvenient for gun owners as we do for cigarette smokers.

Incremental change we can believe in.

And I'll add I have no problems with hunting (asshole dentist game hunters aside). But you can join a club and do that. Regulate, regulate, regulate.
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Old 08-27-2015, 09:29 AM   #85
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People who think of the gun first (and YES, this is many of the law abiding citizens staunchly hanging on to their guns) need to admit openly that they value their choice to own a gun more than they value the human lives that are lost to gun culture. That's what it comes down to really.
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Old 08-27-2015, 09:37 AM   #86
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People who think of the gun first (and YES, this is many of the law abiding citizens staunchly hanging on to their guns) need to admit openly that they value their choice to own a gun more than they value the human lives that are lost to gun culture. That's what it comes down to really.
*extremely gun-owner voice* Gun culture is not what's causing these deaths, it's the culture of the people using the guns!
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Old 08-27-2015, 09:56 AM   #87
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Originally Posted by Headache in a Suitcase View Post
The 18th Amendment existed. Until it didn't.

The 2nd Amendment should be changed. The Constitution was made to be a living breathing document. It was NEVER meant to be the end all, be all. It was specifically designed to be changed as times changed.

So guess what?

Times have fucking changed.

You want a gun so that you can protect yourself in the ways the forefathers intended? Sure! No problem.



Knock yourself the fuck out.

This gun culture in which we live in has to fucking stop. The guns need to go.

Is our record on mental health deplorable in this country? Absolutely. But that doesn't change that it's just too fucking easy for anyone and everyone to get a weapon of death that is completely and utterly unnecessary for the average citizen.
All of this.....

For example, why would a regular citizen need hollow point bullets?

Why would a regular citizen need anything more than say a hunting rifle to shoot game or a handgun to protect themselves with?
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Old 08-27-2015, 10:00 AM   #88
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All of this.....

For example, why would a regular citizen need hollow point bullets?

Why would a regular citizen need anything more than say a hunting rifle to shoot game or a handgun to protect themselves with?
Because FREEDOM! And rights! And ancient pieces of paper saying they can!
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Old 08-27-2015, 10:14 AM   #89
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Because FREEDOM! And rights! And ancient pieces of paper saying they can!
I get it GG, that's such a stupid argument isn't it? I'm gonna go out on a limb and prolly say our forefather's had no idea of hollow point bullets and semi automatic weaponry back when this was written. And PLEASE don't think I'm a weapon hating lib because I'm not. My belief is that we have a right to protect ourselves, family and property.
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Old 08-27-2015, 10:36 AM   #90
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I'm not a weapon hating liberal either, I just do not see why regular citizens would need a weapon in their home. I just don't get it... Here there are guns, heavily regulated yes, there's shooting clubs where guns are locked into the club when you leave, there's hunters that have their rifles but are regulated as well, there's background checks, and of course our police officers have guns but don't use them that much (though it has been a point of discussion lately). So why, please someone tell me why would a random person need a gun in their house?
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And if U2 EVER did Hawkmoon live....and the version from the Lovetown Tour, my uterus would leave my body and fling itself at Bono - for realz.
Don't worry baby, it's gonna be all right. Uncertainty can be a guiding light...
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