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Old 08-27-2014, 03:51 PM   #406
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Eh I know the article mentions that race problems in the UK but it kinda suggests they aren't as big as a deal here, compared to general inequality. It should be important to remember the London riots kicked off because of the police shooting and killing a black man.

The one thing that really bugs and has probably already cropped up, is how people keep bringing up black on black shootings in comparison and saying why aren't we up in arms about it. For a start initiatives are being taken on it, they just don't show any interest in it until they can complain about it. Secondly black on black shootings are not comparable to representatives of the state, people that should be held to a higher standard, frequently shooting members of that population.
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Old 08-27-2014, 04:39 PM   #407
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That article was good until it brought up Waiting for Superman. That movie is a sham and the numbers are based on a fraud. Mainly, the school ended up kicking out lower-performing students to boost the school's average test scores.


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Old 08-27-2014, 05:21 PM   #408
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Secondly black on black shootings are not comparable to representatives of the state, people that should be held to a higher standard, frequently shooting members of that population.


right? it boggles the mind.
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Old 08-27-2014, 06:08 PM   #409
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Black people are more likely to be poor, more likely to end up in jail, more likely to be pulled over, less likely to be hired for a job, and suffer from many other forms of implicit discrimination. Racism isn't just people saying ethnic slurs, it's the way society as a whole treats minorities. In almost every single indicator, black Americans are doing worse than white Americans. That's racism and is a result of the history of slavery and discrimination in this country. We've got a long way to go before we reduce the effects of structural racism and ending structural racism will require more than "moving on."


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Yep. I don't get why it's so hard for people to understand that.

Incidentaly, one of the most telling facts about racism and criminal justice is how the death penalty is more likely to be imposed when the victim is white and/or the defendant is African American.
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Old 08-27-2014, 06:39 PM   #410
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really, at it's core, it's much more about class and socioeconomics especially in a winner-take-all society like ours where there's tremendous competition especially between the lower and the middle-lower classes.

it just so happens that, due to our history, our classes are race-d. certainly class is permeable, to a degree, and i really, truly do think that most people don't want to be racist and most recoil at obvious discrimination. but i don't think the lived-in experience of being a racial minority is grasped by the white majority, nor do i think the white majority is aware of the privileges their whiteness gives them. it's no one's fault, per se, it's just about being aware of who you are and the circumstances under which you live.

i've written quite honestly about where i live -- a rapidly gentrifying section of a minority-majority city with a once-stratospheric crime rate that has plummeted -- and the fact that race enters my day-to-day interactions when i do something as simple as walk my dog. it's simply an aspect of life, and asking people to "get over it" is impossible.
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Old 08-27-2014, 08:10 PM   #411
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it's simply an aspect of life, and asking people to "get over it" is impossible.
From a legal perspective, what more can realistically be done? What new laws can be written?

From a moral perspective, I think that it is reasonable to assume that our society - as a whole - teaches that racism is bad, equal opportunity is good.

I guess we could take money away from richest whites and give it to poorest blacks, but I'm sure that 1) that would not be allowed to actually happen before all the wealthy whites fled with their money or hid it, and 2) it would cause another civil war.

It seems the best we can do is open the doors to opportunity - but it is up to each individual to walk through it or not. The legal system can only enforce that the doors remain open, it can't possibly force people through.
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Old 08-27-2014, 08:18 PM   #412
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I have no answers and I think everyone agrees that reparations as a practical matter is basically impossible. And I'm not sure something needs to be "done" so much as "understood."


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Old 08-27-2014, 08:43 PM   #413
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From a legal perspective, what more can realistically be done? What new laws can be written?
I think this type of question actually reveals a huge problem. That is, at some point, we started treating law and legal systems as vehicles to bring about social change. Laws can establish basic parameters but that's as far as they'll get you.
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Old 08-27-2014, 08:57 PM   #414
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From a legal perspective, what more can realistically be done? What new laws can be written?



From a moral perspective, I think that it is reasonable to assume that our society - as a whole - teaches that racism is bad, equal opportunity is good.



I guess we could take money away from richest whites and give it to poorest blacks, but I'm sure that 1) that would not be allowed to actually happen before all the wealthy whites fled with their money or hid it, and 2) it would cause another civil war.



It seems the best we can do is open the doors to opportunity - but it is up to each individual to walk through it or not. The legal system can only enforce that the doors remain open, it can't possibly force people through.

We can fight against it, not turn a blind eye.


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Old 08-27-2014, 11:12 PM   #415
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I think this type of question actually reveals a huge problem. That is, at some point, we started treating law and legal systems as vehicles to bring about social change. Laws can establish basic parameters but that's as far as they'll get you.
I agree and disagree.

I agree that we should not require laws to "do the right thing."

However, without laws against something like discrimination, it would be much more rampant today.
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Old 08-27-2014, 11:14 PM   #416
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And I'm not sure something needs to be "done" so much as "understood."


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I think that's a fair assessment.
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Old 08-28-2014, 01:04 AM   #417
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Eh I know the article mentions that race problems in the UK but it kinda suggests they aren't as big as a deal here, compared to general inequality. It should be important to remember the London riots kicked off because of the police shooting and killing a black man.

The one thing that really bugs and has probably already cropped up, is how people keep bringing up black on black shootings in comparison and saying why aren't we up in arms about it. For a start initiatives are being taken on it, they just don't show any interest in it until they can complain about it. Secondly black on black shootings are not comparable to representatives of the state, people that should be held to a higher standard, frequently shooting members of that population.
I remember reading somewhere that black-on-black violence had decreased in the US over the past 20 or so years, too.

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Mainly, the school ended up kicking out lower-performing students to boost the school's average test scores.


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Reminds me of the Simpsons episode where Skinner locked Bart and the bullies in a store room so that they wouldn't take the test.
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Old 08-28-2014, 01:35 AM   #418
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I remember reading somewhere that black-on-black violence had decreased in the US over the past 20 or so years, too.

Reminds me of the Simpsons episode where Skinner locked Bart and the bullies in a store room so that they wouldn't take the test.

All violent crime in the US has declined over the last twenty years.

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Old 08-28-2014, 09:21 AM   #419
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Old 09-02-2014, 02:22 AM   #420
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I was just wondering about that last night. Is he just sitting at home chilling right now? I thought that they did, at the very least, deem his death to be a homicide. Does the police officer just...walk around free until they file a charge?
Ummmm. Anytime a human kills a human even in self defense it is ruled a homicide.
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