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Old 05-07-2011, 11:59 AM   #661
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Don't mind that most Muslims disapprove of Choudary, that most non-Muslims don't understand Sharia law, and the survery you're quoting is bullshit Daily Mail Scaremongers About 'Killing for Islam'

Nothing to see here, don't mind my lies and hatred...
When you learn the difference between personal hate and confronting an ideology I'll take you off my ignore list.
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Old 05-07-2011, 12:13 PM   #662
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But you aren't confronting an idealogy INDY, you've shown this time and time again.

You fall for all the anti-Muslim propaganda.

What does that say?
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Old 05-07-2011, 12:13 PM   #663
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Indy, do you have a problem with Beth Din courts in the UK? Or in the US?
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Old 05-07-2011, 12:20 PM   #664
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But you aren't confronting an idealogy INDY, you've shown this time and time again.

You fall for all the anti-Muslim propaganda.

What does that say?
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Old 05-07-2011, 12:48 PM   #665
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Too late for England as there are at least 85 Islamic Sharia courts operating in the country already.

But you're right nothing to be seen here. Don't be bothered that:

A survey of 600 Muslim students at 30 universities throughout Britain found that 32 per cent of Muslim respondents believed killing in the name of religion is justified, 54 per cent wanted a Muslim party to represent their world view in Parliament and 40 per cent want Muslims in the UK to be under Sharia law.

33 per cent said they want to see the introduction of a worldwide Caliphate based on Sharia law. The overwhelming majority supported the introduction of Sharia into British law for Muslims.

Or that 2/3rds of Islamic terrorist activity in the UK over the last ten years has involved British citizens.

Or that at least 35 Guantanamo terrorists were radicalised in London mosques... no worries right?

And above all, pay no attention that Anjem Choudary, who organised this protest, has praised both the 7/7 and 9/11 terrorist attacks and promises more.


now that Bin Laden is gone, i guess we need another boogeyman.
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Old 05-07-2011, 01:04 PM   #666
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Indy, do you have a problem with Beth Din courts in the UK? Or in the US?
Not in cases where all parties agree to settle religious law in such a matter and whose laws don't supercede established civil or criminal codes. I would apply that same standard to Sharia courts including in the U.S. I think banning Sharia courts in the United States would be unconstitutional. But I believe in equal protection, assimilation and E Pluribus Unum.
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Old 05-07-2011, 05:47 PM   #667
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Not sure why, but it seems weird to see that Bin Laden clip, with him watching TV, with Obama popping up on screen. It feels like they should be from different times/ages. As if they didn't coexist.

Also, CHOOSE A FUCKING CHANNEL AND STICK TO IT!
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Old 05-07-2011, 05:49 PM   #668
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Not in cases where all parties agree to settle religious law in such a matter and whose laws don't supercede established civil or criminal codes. I would apply that same standard to Sharia courts including in the U.S. I think banning Sharia courts in the United States would be unconstitutional. But I believe in equal protection, assimilation and E Pluribus Unum.
So you shouldn't really have a problem with where/how Sharia is accepted/practiced in the UK? It's only in family/business/property type disputes. Exactly the same as Jewish Beth Din is, both in the UK and US.
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Old 05-07-2011, 07:00 PM   #669
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So you shouldn't really have a problem with where/how Sharia is accepted/practiced in the UK? It's only in family/business/property type disputes. Exactly the same as Jewish Beth Din is, both in the UK and US.
Right but I would also argue that widespread use of separate courthouses and judges for individual populations in a plural society is unhealthy. At some level we must all be equal before the law and not seperate. We learned that the hard way here.

Is this equality before the law in Britain?

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Muslim husbands with more than one wife to get extra benefits as ministers recognise polygamy

Ministers have decided that, even though bigamy is a crime in Britain, polygamous marriages can be recognised formally by the state - provided they took place overseas, in countries where they are legal.

The outcome will chiefly benefit Muslim men with more than one wife.
Ministers estimate that up to a thousand polygamous partnerships exist in Britain, although they admit there is no exact record.

Potentially, the benefits bill for income support could reach £10m.

New guidelines on income support from the Department for Work and Pensions (DWP) state: "Where there is a valid polygamous marriage the claimant and one spouse will be paid the couple rate (£92.80).

"The amount payable for each additional spouse is presently £33.65."
Now a proponent of multiculturalism might not see a problem here. I on the other hand see capitulation and a total lack of will to defend 500 years of law and tradition. And serious trouble and unrest ahead for a great country.
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Old 05-07-2011, 07:01 PM   #670
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Old 05-07-2011, 09:45 PM   #671
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I on the other hand see capitulation and a total lack of will to defend 500 years of law and tradition. And serious trouble and unrest ahead for a great country.


well, you would, right? where would the right wing be without blind fear of some mysterious Other determined to destroy us form within?
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Old 05-07-2011, 10:49 PM   #672
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well, you would, right? where would the right wing be without blind fear of some mysterious Other determined to destroy us form within?
Blind fear? Is it blind fear that leads to this:

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Nicolas Sarkozy joins David Cameron and Angela Merkel view that multiculturalism has failed

French president Nicolas Sarkozy has joined David Cameron in condemning multiculturalism as a failure.
Cameron launched a scathing attack earlier this months on 30 years of multiculturalism in Britain warning that it fostered extremism. His damning verdict came just months after after German Chancellor Angela Merkel said that multiculturalism in Germany had failed.

Now Sarkozy has joined the growing number of European leaders who have adopted identical views on multiculturalism.

He told the French people: 'We have been too concerned about the identity of the person who was arriving and not enough about the identity of the country that was receiving him.'The president made the declaration in a TV debate last night after being asked if the policy of encouraging the religious and cultural differences of immigrants was not working.
He told viewers: 'My answer is clearly yes, it is a failure.
'Of course we must all respect differences, but we do not want a society where communities coexist side by side.
I'm sure this was already discussed in FYM. Did anyone support the premise or were all three heads of state dismissed as bigots?
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Old 05-08-2011, 12:13 AM   #673
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Blind fear? Is it blind fear that leads to this:



I'm sure this was already discussed in FYM. Did anyone support the premise or were all three heads of state dismissed as bigots?


this is America, INDY, not Europe. i'm stunned: you don't believe in our exceptionalism anymore!?!?!?!
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Old 05-08-2011, 02:34 AM   #674
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Is this equality before the law in Britain?

Now a proponent of multiculturalism might not see a problem here. I on the other hand see capitulation and a total lack of will to defend 500 years of law and tradition. And serious trouble and unrest ahead for a great country.
I don't know, all told it may be better for women than the 'system' we have in the US for dealing with polygamy in (mostly West African) immigrant communities, which basically amounts to Don't Ask, Don't Tell. (The estimated number of polygamous partnerships in NYC alone is higher than the estimate given for all of the UK in the article you posted.) The wife/wives without legal standing have no protection if 'divorced' or widowed, and little incentive to report their husbands for polygamy, since his arrest or deportation would destroy their economic support system, possibly result in their deportations as well, and ruin their reputations in the tight-knit communities they depend on for social support. Not saying the UK's response to the situation is a human rights triumph, and there are likely some very problematic loopholes in the setup, but I rather doubt they're implementing it solely out of some starry-eyed romanticization of cultural diversity etc.
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Old 05-08-2011, 07:23 AM   #675
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I don't know about Sarkozy and Merkel, but when David Cameron speaks up like that about immigration and multiculturalism, all I hear is a guy trying to get love from a certain demographic of voter here in the UK. Nothing less, nothing more. And I think most sensible people realise that. Like watching a Republican who has had 4 wives, 6 mistresses, and a couple of rent boy scandals defending the sanctity of marriage. Plenty of people are stupid enough to buy it, and that's the point, but just as many only roll their eyes.
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