The main reason we have not moved to the US (despite numerous job offers) is because I don’t want my kids going to schools where they could be shot. That in combination with the healthcare situation, which would at least be mitigated somewhat for us by getting the gold standard, and honestly it’s an easy decision. Call me crazy but it’s how I feel.
Ongoing Mass Shooting Thread #3... that's right, a third thread. Because 'Murica.
- Thread starter Headache in a Suitcase
- Start date
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Irvine511
Blue Crack Supplier
Health care, absolutely.
Their odds of getting shot at school are vanishingly small, HOWEVER, the psychological terror of active shooter drills would give me pause as well.
But these are important things for the 2A crowd to hear — just how insane we look and how blitheringly stupid they look and sound.
DaveC
Blue Crack Addict
i don't think i got my point across very well.
there is a risk that exists in the US that doesn't exist in most other countries. the governments of those other countries have a duty to warn their citizens that "hey, if you travel to this other country, you could be at greater risk of x, y, and z". that is all this is. these governments are simply doing what they are responsible for doing for the safety their own citizens. the effect it might have on the US is at best a very minor consideration in the issuance of these advisories.
there is a risk that exists in the US that doesn't exist in most other countries. the governments of those other countries have a duty to warn their citizens that "hey, if you travel to this other country, you could be at greater risk of x, y, and z". that is all this is. these governments are simply doing what they are responsible for doing for the safety their own citizens. the effect it might have on the US is at best a very minor consideration in the issuance of these advisories.
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LuckyNumber7
Blue Crack Addict
You’re not crazy. Most importantly, how you FEEL matters. There is reason to feel that way, even if the risk isn’t truly there.
I would add that I was a child refugee from a war torn country and that never, ever leaves you. I have no intention of my kids doing active shooter drills or buying a kevlar backpack. How daft does a person have to be to suggest kevlar backpacks as opposed to the most logical solutions, I'll never know.
LuckyNumber7
Blue Crack Addict
There is not a measurable risk of a tourist being caught up in a mass shooting. The risk is approximately 0%. It’s also approximately 0% in their home country. Your numerical factors in play are largely time exposed to a hostile environment and frequency of such an event. The frequency of such an event is already still approximately zero in a year (0.0035% of the population die by gun-related homicide in the US, so that’s 0.000001% per day). Now factor in who the targets are (personal and/or crime). Now factor in where the targets are (not places foreigners tend to have any reason to go). Now factor in their limited length of time in the US. Now factor in the requisite of being a “mass shooting” where 3 or more people are shot. These things I don’t have direct statistics for, but add a couple more zeros in there.
There’s nothing wrong with feeling alarmed or worried about it, and individuals have every right to be uncomfortable here. No, these governments are not doing some duty. This is individuals’ feelings within their government getting mixed into the message of their government, and it’s inappropriate.
DaveC
Blue Crack Addict
i never suggested that there's some kind of mathematical threshold of risk that needs to be met. i have no idea what criteria any state government uses to release one of these things. i see it as something an embassy might do in an attitude of "better safe than sorry". we live in an age where by simply entering a starbucks we're required by law to be warned about exposure to cancerous chemicals. it's just another one of those "probably unnecessary but we'll issue it just in case so our ass is covered" warnings most people will see and forget about in an hour. it seems like a weird thing to be upset about, unless you work for a hotel that caters to japanese tourists.
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dazzledbylight
Blue Crack Supplier
This is actually a fairly momentous occasion
Headache is on the money!
WOW
The raging right-wing NY Post!!!??
(I remember when it was a liberal paper, a looong time ago.
)
bono_212
Blue Crack Distributor
This whole conversation reminds me of when people say that there's a better chance of having a vending machine fall on you than get killed by a shark.
Sure, maybe that's true. But I have a say in whether or not I ever go into the water to be eaten by a shark in the first place. Vending machines are everywhere. I can not avoid them.
It's absolutely out of anyone's control to whether or not they will be the victim of a mass shooting, and right now there is certainly a risk of being caught up on domestic terrorism in this country, so I absolutely don't see any reason why it's not OK for another country's government to point out the obvious increase in terrorism in the US.
This whole thing reminds me of when I was a kid in the 90s/early 00s and the idea of going to Ireland or the UK used to terrify me because I always was afraid I'd be the victim of a bombing if I went. Rational? Maybe not, but we were definitely aware over here that there was dangerous shit going on over there, largely domestic terrorism....so I get it.
Sure, maybe that's true. But I have a say in whether or not I ever go into the water to be eaten by a shark in the first place. Vending machines are everywhere. I can not avoid them.
It's absolutely out of anyone's control to whether or not they will be the victim of a mass shooting, and right now there is certainly a risk of being caught up on domestic terrorism in this country, so I absolutely don't see any reason why it's not OK for another country's government to point out the obvious increase in terrorism in the US.
This whole thing reminds me of when I was a kid in the 90s/early 00s and the idea of going to Ireland or the UK used to terrify me because I always was afraid I'd be the victim of a bombing if I went. Rational? Maybe not, but we were definitely aware over here that there was dangerous shit going on over there, largely domestic terrorism....so I get it.
LuckyNumber7
Blue Crack Addict
I fully support an individual’s set of emotions, as I’ve stated. I too am uneasy in open water because of the general “idk what’s in there coming to eat me” sense. And my general discomfort is enough to justify not doing it.
The government has a responsibility to be rational. Not to stoke fears, heck... not to sabotage other government tourism, not to respond on emotion (imagine if we launched a giant war in Iraq because we were mad at the general Middle East and really just hated the guy in power or something like that..).
You’re describing personal feelings for situations that you’ve been in and entirely agree with them as justifiable.
Governments issue alerts like this to notify their citizens of something that’s changed. For example, if it’s election season and there’s civil unrest, I could see a government notice for foreigners to stay away from political rallies and establishments. Because something has changed. Your likelihood of being the victim of a mass shooting has not changed, even if there’s a small difference in mass shootings. If a government felt so inclined to mention just a general note that mass shootings are more common here, pfft fine, might as well remind people of every generalized change in risk from their home country to the next. Which, in some cases, they do, and that’s fine and just. But there isn’t a higher likelihood to be involved in a mass shooting now than prior to last week. Nothing changed. We just live in a country with shit gun laws, a shit Congress, and shit society that glorifies mentally unwell peoples’ final actions of mass murder.
The government has a responsibility to be rational. Not to stoke fears, heck... not to sabotage other government tourism, not to respond on emotion (imagine if we launched a giant war in Iraq because we were mad at the general Middle East and really just hated the guy in power or something like that..).
You’re describing personal feelings for situations that you’ve been in and entirely agree with them as justifiable.
Governments issue alerts like this to notify their citizens of something that’s changed. For example, if it’s election season and there’s civil unrest, I could see a government notice for foreigners to stay away from political rallies and establishments. Because something has changed. Your likelihood of being the victim of a mass shooting has not changed, even if there’s a small difference in mass shootings. If a government felt so inclined to mention just a general note that mass shootings are more common here, pfft fine, might as well remind people of every generalized change in risk from their home country to the next. Which, in some cases, they do, and that’s fine and just. But there isn’t a higher likelihood to be involved in a mass shooting now than prior to last week. Nothing changed. We just live in a country with shit gun laws, a shit Congress, and shit society that glorifies mentally unwell peoples’ final actions of mass murder.
LuckyNumber7
Blue Crack Addict
How on earth could he think that was a good idea?
Irvine511
Blue Crack Supplier
“Keep those bullets coming,” that thumb seems to say.
The cruelty is the point.
The cruelty is the point.
womanfish
Rock n' Roll Doggie ALL ACCESS
So since the shootings,
A man arrested outside an Immigrant detention center in ElPaso, Wearing rubber gloves, with knife, gun and white powder.
Another arrested last night at a Walmart in Missouri. Entered the store with assault rifle, body armor and 100 rounds.
What has this disgusting piece of shit unleashed on us.
A man arrested outside an Immigrant detention center in ElPaso, Wearing rubber gloves, with knife, gun and white powder.
Another arrested last night at a Walmart in Missouri. Entered the store with assault rifle, body armor and 100 rounds.
What has this disgusting piece of shit unleashed on us.
Irvine511
Blue Crack Supplier
i'm quite scared it's going to get much, much worse next summer when he holds his Nuremberg rallies more frequently due to the campaign.
i can't believe they thought the appropriate response to last weekend's pogrom was an ICE raid of fucking factory workers.
OP
OP
Jerry Dunk
Refugee
I think we have several LEO on the record saying this is true. That their explicit intention is to scare people out of the country.
Also, wasn't the ICE raid ordered by someone associated with the Koch's who was mad that the workers banded together to file a sexual harassment lawsuit? My understanding was that it was retaliatory and killed two birds with one stone by targeting immigrants and labor.
Hewson
Blue Crack Supplier
Well you can also choose not to buy a Snickers from a machine and have that corkscrew thing not turn enough to drop said Snickers so you have to bang on the machine until either you get your Snickers or the machine falls on you and you get squashed, but spend your last moments eating a plethora of candy & chips that fell about you when the front glass plate shattered.
Vlad n U 2
Blue Crack Addict
- Joined
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MissCandyGirl
Acrobat
I agree LuckyNumber7: a gun is a gun, whether handheld, a pistol or a machine gun, even. It can still kill people, regardless of its type. Now, I don't know a lot about guns, but I know that.
Just to add my penny's worth.
P.S
I know I'm not an expert.
Just to add my penny's worth.
P.S
I know I'm not an expert.
Irvine511
Blue Crack Supplier
This is the ongoing social media conspiracy theory I’ve seen.
I’m generally fairly sympathetic to LEOs because I work with them a lot, and the vast majority are doing the best they can with what they have.
ICE, however, is a self-selected group based on a mutual interest in inflicting cruelty. Their mission must be redirected with the next administration.
dabiggestu2fan
Rock n' Roll Doggie
I hear you! I am quite happy living in Canada where thankfully we don’t have most of these worries. I find it sad that the USA has so many problems that seems to be easily solved by other first world nations. I feel bad for the good American people who will probably die if they can’t afford health care or those families of shooting victims. Yes Canada is NOT perfect by any means but it sure does feel a lot safer.
MissCandyGirl
Acrobat
It never ends. It is atrocious and devastating.
There's not much to add to that.
There's not much to add to that.
dazzledbylight
Blue Crack Supplier
Yeah.
I was just in Tines Square tonight to see a movie. Only as we were leaving after the dinner after the movie did a barely think about it.
And i w as like... "eh" , dropped the thought. I'm fair!y often in/have been in what are now considered "targety" area after last weekend. Truthfully the odds are still very, very unlikely.
Your kids are probably not going to be shot. In the bigger picture look at how big the USA and really how many (still are horrifying) incidents happened. As though a Canadian you are, all this (and yes all the other countries with stricter gun laws) is extra craaazeee! Id love stricter gun laws! The NRA got highjacked in the 70's into this more guns-on-steroids mode.
Healthcare reasons , i do understand!
Well, not that irrational because compare the size of The UK, or Ireland to the USA.
dazzledbylight
Blue Crack Supplier
Oh, well, now this certainly makes a deep sense. I'm do sorry you had to endure that.
Definitely understandable about children and those school drills. And kevlar backoacks? Shit, change the damn lax gun laws. No one needs guns-of-war.
dazzledbylight
Blue Crack Supplier
Well, he unleashed horrors practically from day #1 of his term.
He started kicking over the rocks of racists, white nationalists, supremacists etc from his rallies onward. Oh wait, no, after he started up with the birther shit.
They did warn abiut cooycst actions after last week's shootings.
Several days a week some my earliest thoughts of the day are "has he been kicked out of being The President yet ?!? ".
BTW headache why did you say you thought he'd resign by the end-of-the-year? Self-motivated, or pushed out by other Repuglicans.
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