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Old 12-25-2011, 11:27 PM   #106
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Why is China so "Western-looking" while NK seems like Nazi Germany?
I don't think that allow for intellectual freedom which might deter progress.
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Old 12-25-2011, 11:34 PM   #107
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I don't actually disagree with all of North Korea's economic policies. To me, paying up to 65% in rental costs, like many do in Western cities, is kinda not fair.
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Old 12-25-2011, 11:41 PM   #108
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China has price controls on energy, limits on investment from foreigners, a partially managed currency, amongst other things. Since everyone disagrees that these are elements of communism, please tell me what they are.

Edit: In original post re: China I said that their economy is "Market Socialism", I never said they have elements of communism, I said that about NK. I think someone misquoted me.
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Old 12-26-2011, 12:37 AM   #109
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As it's been mentioned, both NK and China are communist countries.
have you even read this thread?
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Old 12-26-2011, 12:51 AM   #110
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Why is China so "Western-looking" while NK seems like Nazi Germany?
NK is a dictatorship, just like Nazi Germany was. In NK, the government controls everything, and owning your own business is illegal. Not only is there no freedom of doing business there, but there is very little freedom as is. Furthermore, the government doesn't even provide basic needs in many cases, such as food, and so there is even starvation.

In China, the government used to control a lot more of the business, but over the last few decades they've loosened their controls and now China has substantial private ownership, and so it's more Western looking. Because it loosened it's capital markets, and opened up to trade, it has been growing substantially economically, and will be doing so for many years into the future.
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Old 12-26-2011, 12:54 AM   #111
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I really think there has to be an insane amount of cultural exchange that has to go on before North Korea and the US/Europe begin to become interdependent.

To summarize a display of ignorance, I heard one broadcaster, who I respect tremendously, say that we should just 'go in there' and 'get it over with'. It was quite sad.

The strangest twist of our globalized world is that Korea is in demand for University graduates from Australia, England, Canada and the US. To me it is incredible that a whole nation wants to learn English and is willing to pay very hard earned cash to do so.

Secondly, I wouldn't necessarily call North Korean camps 'slave labour' I would just say that Korean people are very hardworking and very willing to get ahead.
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Old 12-26-2011, 12:59 AM   #112
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NK is a dictatorship, just like Nazi Germany was. In NK, the government controls everything, and owning your own business is illegal. Not only is there no freedom of doing business there, but there is very little freedom as is. Furthermore, the government doesn't even provide basic needs in many cases, such as food, and so there is even starvation.
I think we can all agree that 2011 was a bad year for dictatorships.
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Old 12-26-2011, 01:01 AM   #113
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Originally Posted by canedge
I really think there has to be an insane amount of cultural exchange that has to go on before North Korea and the US/Europe begin to become interdependent.

To summarize a display of ignorance, I heard one broadcaster, who I respect tremendously, say that we should just 'go in there' and 'get it over with'. It was quite sad.

The strangest twist of our globalized world is that Korea is in demand for University graduates from Australia, England, Canada and the US. To me it is incredible that a whole nation wants to learn English and is willing to pay very hard earned cash to do so.

Secondly, I wouldn't necessarily call North Korean camps 'slave labour' I would just say that Korean people are very hardworking and very willing to get ahead.
what is the difference between north korean camps and slave labor?
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Old 12-26-2011, 01:06 AM   #114
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Originally Posted by Achtung11 View Post
NK is a dictatorship, just like Nazi Germany was. In NK, the government controls everything, and owning your own business is illegal. Not only is there no freedom of doing business there, but there is very little freedom as is. Furthermore, the government doesn't even provide basic needs in many cases, such as food, and so there is even starvation.
In addition, we can attribute that to the country's isolation and its national ideology, Juche, which pleads "self-reliance". No one country can live entirely on its own resources.
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Old 12-26-2011, 01:10 AM   #115
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Well first of all, no one really knows shit about what goes on there except probably the CIA and some elite South Koreans. But like I suggested to in another thread, which didn't go over well, sometimes how media outlets 'frame' things distort the true nature of things leaves us with an incorrect understanding.

If North Koreans work 'for the motherland', no questions asked, that might be enough for them and they might care about personal finance. Which might be a foreign concept to them. All I am trying to get at is that shit is radically different over there.
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Old 12-26-2011, 01:12 AM   #116
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No one country can live entirely on its own resources.
Actually they can, they just won't grow with new ideas or live with what the rest of the world has to offer.

As for self-reliance, that is a luxury that globalization will eventually make redundant. 125 years ago, my ancestors didn't have any vehicles, now I have one. If a market economy comes to DPRK, they will have to work to update their personal lifestyles to catch up.
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Old 12-26-2011, 01:20 AM   #117
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Originally Posted by canedge
Well first of all, no one really knows shit about what goes on there except probably the CIA and some elite South Koreans. But like I suggested to in another thread, which didn't go over well, sometimes how media outlets 'frame' things distort the true nature of things leaves us with an incorrect understanding.

If North Koreans work 'for the motherland', no questions asked, that might be enough for them and they might care about personal finance. Which might be a foreign concept to them. All I am trying to get at is that shit is radically different over there.
there is no question that shit is radically different. but just as you say that we do not know much, by the same token you do not know their motivations.
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Old 12-26-2011, 08:30 AM   #118
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How can China be "communist" and have a level of economic equality comparable to that of the US? (don't know how worthy this is, but here's a GINI coefficient map from 2009) They don't even have free healthcare for all of its citizens.

Again, if you read through this thread (or even a simple Google search!)you'd be able to understand that (and I'm tired of repeating this over and over and over) communism is a stateless, classless and moneyless society hence.

this is what I tried to explain a few posts before: China is not communist! They are shedding more and more "communist" (state owened enterprises, etc. etc.) elements for economic growth. The only "communist" elements are, like you already mentioned before: The red flag with stars, the one -party-system and the communist architecture in big cities like Beijing.
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Old 12-26-2011, 02:51 PM   #119
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Originally Posted by Vlad n U 2 View Post
How can China be "communist" and have a level of economic equality comparable to that of the US? (don't know how worthy this is, but here's a GINI coefficient map from 2009) They don't even have free healthcare for all of its citizens.

Again, if you read through this thread (or even a simple Google search!)you'd be able to understand that (and I'm tired of repeating this over and over and over) communism is a stateless, classless and moneyless society hence.
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have you even read this thread?
A lot of it just went over my head. I was hoping for some simplification.

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Originally Posted by Achtung11 View Post
NK is a dictatorship, just like Nazi Germany was. In NK, the government controls everything, and owning your own business is illegal. Not only is there no freedom of doing business there, but there is very little freedom as is. Furthermore, the government doesn't even provide basic needs in many cases, such as food, and so there is even starvation.

In China, the government used to control a lot more of the business, but over the last few decades they've loosened their controls and now China has substantial private ownership, and so it's more Western looking. Because it loosened it's capital markets, and opened up to trade, it has been growing substantially economically, and will be doing so for many years into the future.
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this is what I tried to explain a few posts before: China is not communist! They are shedding more and more "communist" (state owened enterprises, etc. etc.) elements for economic growth. The only "communist" elements are, like you already mentioned before: The red flag with stars, the one -party-system and the communist architecture in big cities like Beijing.
That's all the answers that I needed.
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Old 12-26-2011, 05:43 PM   #120
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I sure hope that North Koreans will be able to get passports soon and leave the country for the best.
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