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Old 12-24-2011, 01:03 AM   #76
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How much impact does one person have? The real work begins when North Korea opens up and begins to embrace Western modernity much like China has over the last twenty five years. Check out the photo below of DPRK and see how much they have to do on the electrical front.

North Korea is Dark
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Old 12-24-2011, 01:10 AM   #77
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North Korea is not communist in the classical textbook term because yes, the government has all the power and so it's not classless. But it is a centrally planned economy and there is almost no private enterprise, which obviously makes it communist economically.
Each country has its own adaptation of free market or planned economy. How successful has the de-centralization of the Soviet and Eastern European economies? Created many billionaires thats for sure.
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Old 12-24-2011, 01:15 AM   #78
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North Korea is not communist in the classical textbook term because yes, the government has all the power and so it's not classless. But it is a centrally planned economy and there is almost no private enterprise, which obviously makes it communist economically. Politically, it's a dictatorship. And so that's why I used the term "communist dictatorship".
... A dictatorship has a planned economy with no private enterprise. It's not exclusive to communism.
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Old 12-24-2011, 02:00 AM   #79
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... A dictatorship has a planned economy with no private enterprise. It's not exclusive to communism.
Not necessarily. Nazi Germany had private enterprise. Saudi Arabia, a monarchy, has significant private enterprise. Libya had some private enterprise under Gaddafi.

Communism is an economic ideology as well as a social and political ideology. On the economic spectrum, ranging from communism to capitalism, North Korea obviously falls on the communist end.

There are no absolutes. Has there ever been a truly communist or capitalist nation by the textbook definition?
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Old 12-24-2011, 02:06 AM   #80
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Hate to say it but now is the time to get in there and make some ground on those prisoners camps.

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Old 12-24-2011, 03:03 AM   #81
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The point he's trying to make is that a lot of people who don't really understand foreign policy look at all "bad" governments as dictatorships, communists, and socialists, as if those words all mean the same thing. They're all just words with such connotations of fear in the US that people don't even understand them. People will call North Korea socialist or communist, when it has never been either of those things. It's a dictatorship.
Thank you.

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North Korea is not communist in the classical textbook term because yes, the government has all the power and so it's not classless. But it is a centrally planned economy and there is almost no private enterprise, which obviously makes it communist economically. Politically, it's a dictatorship. And so that's why I used the term "communist dictatorship".
It has absolutely nothing to do with communism, its economic system is best described as state capitalist. The workers do not control the means of production, and the workers having control is the definition of a communist/socialist economy. So NK is not 'communist', but rather, I feel, quite the peculiar theocracy with a strong sense of nationalism and it's just so messed up in every way and you can't even describe it as being even close to socialism/communism and ugh.

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If I was granted one wish in this world I would wish that people from the US would have a better understanding of the word 'socialism.'
Yeah but then we wouldn't be exposed to as much hilarity as we have.

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Has there ever been a truly communist or capitalist nation by the textbook definition?
We've never had a truly socialist nation in the world to this date, the requirement for that being the workers controlling the production, as mentioned before.

(Phew, it's a damn hot day today. )
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Old 12-24-2011, 08:40 AM   #82
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If I was granted one wish in this world I would wish that people from the US would have a better understanding of the word 'socialism.'
Especially when talking about a certain centre-right President.
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Old 12-24-2011, 11:07 AM   #83
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I should add to Vlads points that only 'micro' systems are purer forms of the above. The character of economic systems tend to change as they get larger or smaller.
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Old 12-24-2011, 12:06 PM   #84
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If I was granted one wish in this world I would wish that people from the US would have a better understanding of the word 'socialism.'
We have a better understanding than we did 3 years ago.
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Old 12-24-2011, 12:29 PM   #85
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It has absolutely nothing to do with communism, its economic system is best described as state capitalist. The workers do not control the means of production, and the workers having control is the definition of a communist/socialist economy.
The ruling party is the Korean Workers' Party so communism is their goal. The problem with central planning is it requires some muscle to convince all the citizens to... play along. That muscle may be the tyranny of communism, the soft tyranny of socialism of the soft despotism of the nanny state.
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So NK is not 'communist', but rather, I feel, quite the peculiar theocracy with a strong sense of nationalism and it's just so messed up in every way and you can't even describe it as being even close to socialism/communism and ugh.
While some of that is true regarding N Korea, by your pure definitions, the United States is not a capitalist economy because it's not laissez-faire capitalism.
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Old 12-24-2011, 01:28 PM   #86
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I generally accepted the North Korean way of life economically. What really shocks and disgusts me is the unacceptable human rights abuses and intolerance of other ways of life.
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Old 12-24-2011, 02:18 PM   #87
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The ruling party is the Korean Workers' Party so communism is their goal. The problem with central planning is it requires some muscle to convince all the citizens to... play along. That muscle may be the tyranny of communism, the soft tyranny of socialism of the soft despotism of the nanny state.

While some of that is true regarding N Korea, by your pure definitions, the United States is not a capitalist economy because it's not laissez-faire capitalism.
we have certainly learned a lot more about laissez faire capitalism in the last 30 years.
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Old 12-24-2011, 02:58 PM   #88
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we have certainly learned a lot more about laissez faire capitalism in the last 30 years.
I'd say we've learned how harmful crony capitalism, government bailouts, tax loopholes, corporate welfare, artificial bubbles and ill-informed regulations are.
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Old 12-24-2011, 03:12 PM   #89
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The ruling party is the Korean Workers' Party so communism is their goal .
Just like the country is called the 'Democratic Republic'?
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Old 12-24-2011, 07:26 PM   #90
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That muscle may be the tyranny of communism, the soft tyranny of socialism of the soft despotism of the nanny state.
Oh nooo!1!! the socilits1!1!1

I'm pretty sure, they don't even have the word 'communism' in their constitution. Their state ideology is Juche/Songun. Which is, yeah, not really related to socialism/communism.

Would you say that China's goal is 'communism'?
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