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Old 11-14-2008, 01:05 PM   #16
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Institutionalized religion of just about any sect is about conformity not free-thinking and democracy.
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Old 11-14-2008, 01:09 PM   #17
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^Just out of interest BoMac why do you believe in intelligent design? The Catholic Church doesn't teach intelligent design and is fully behind evolution...just curious.
I use God and intelligent design interchangeably. I don't know if the type of God that we as Catholics were taught exists or not. No one knows that; that's why it's called 'faith'. But I believe that a higher power, whether it be God or something else, created everything in the universe.

I also don't think that God and evolution are mutually exclusive.
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Old 11-14-2008, 01:17 PM   #18
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and I reconcile my views with religion by thinking that Jesus espoused love, acceptance and tolerance for all.
I think this is what I take from it as well. It's the "feel good" part of church.

And that's why I have a hard time rationalizing the religions or "religious" that grab onto the "mean" parts - the judging, condemning, self-righteousness.

I also agree with your comments about God and evolution. I fully believe in evolution. However, I believe in a higher power that made it all happen.
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Old 11-14-2008, 01:33 PM   #19
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Does the bible specifically instruct Christian followers (of whatever denomination) to obey church leaders, government leaders, their own conscience based on scripture or all three?

Sincere question.
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Old 11-14-2008, 01:51 PM   #20
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And my priest said, "At the last supper, Jesus said 'Take this ALL of you'. He didn't say take this those of you who have never been divorced, believe in a woman's right to choose, use birth control, etc. He said 'Take this ALL of you'. And I LOVED that and was so thankful to my priest for that and felt so much better.
I was brought up Catholic and never went back after confirmation. Six years ago, I went to a United Church of Christ church. Communion is once a month and ALL are invited to partake. I never left. I would guess that more than 25% of our congregation are former Catholics.
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Old 11-14-2008, 02:22 PM   #21
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I use God and intelligent design interchangeably. I don't know if the type of God that we as Catholics were taught exists or not. No one knows that; that's why it's called 'faith'. But I believe that a higher power, whether it be God or something else, created everything in the universe.

I also don't think that God and evolution are mutually exclusive.
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Old 11-14-2008, 03:50 PM   #22
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I'm a practicing Catholic, but more of an agnostic, really. I like the Catholic community, for the most part, but not the Church.

I have a liberal viewpoint on basically every issue, which contrasts with a lot of the Church's views.
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Old 11-14-2008, 03:58 PM   #23
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I'm a practicing Catholic, but more of an agnostic, really. I like the Catholic community, for the most part, but not the Church.

I have a liberal viewpoint on basically every issue, which contrasts with a lot of the Church's views.
So do you feel guilty taking communion? How do you rationalize it?
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Old 11-14-2008, 04:08 PM   #24
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My mother is a Catholic (claims to be Christian, but still attends mass, and goes to a Catholic church, etc...not that it's a big deal to me personally ), and I was raised Christian. I've supported Obama since the start, in spite of the bashing he regularly gets from my parents. All I can say to them is "we'll see." I would much rather take a chance on hope than settle into the mediocrity of the norm. Do I agree with everything Obama supports? No. Do I agree with the spirit behind it and his general intentions? Yes.

So there you go.
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Old 11-14-2008, 04:13 PM   #25
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My mother is a Catholic (claims to be Christian, but still attends mass, and goes to a Catholic church, etc...not that it's a big deal to me personally ), and I was raised Christian. I've supported Obama since the start, in spite of the bashing he regularly gets from my parents. All I can say to them is "we'll see." I would much rather take a chance on hope than settle into the mediocrity of the norm. Do I agree with everything Obama supports? No. Do I agree with the spirit behind it and his general intentions? Yes.

So there you go.
Please forgive my ignorance, but aren't followers of Catholicism, Protestantism, etc., all considered to be Christian? Or am I way off base here?
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Old 11-14-2008, 04:19 PM   #26
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Please forgive my ignorance, but aren't followers of Catholicism, Protestantism, etc., all considered to be Christian? Or am I way off base here?
Christ is Christ. The denominations don't matter much to me, but it is worth mentioning in this context. There are some political stances that the Catholic church itself has taken over the past decade or two that the average fundamentalist Christian would balk at. However, I would place Catholicism, Protestantism, etc. under the umbrella of Christianity, like you said. In any case, your religious beliefs should not alter your stance on issues such as the environment, civil rights, and equality. These are things that Christ always supported.
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Old 11-14-2008, 04:20 PM   #27
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Christ is Christ. The denominations don't matter much to me, but it is worth mentioning in this context. There are some political stances that the Catholic church itself has taken over the past decade or two that the average fundamentalist Christian would balk at. However, I would place Catholicism, Protestantism, etc. under the umbrella of Christianity, like you said. Ultimately, your religious stance should not alter your grasp on objective political issues.
I agree.
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Old 11-14-2008, 04:21 PM   #28
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Please forgive my ignorance, but aren't followers of Catholicism, Protestantism, etc., all considered to be Christian? Or am I way off base here?
Yeah, I've never gotten that bit myself. I know there are certain groups of Protestants that don't believe Catholics aren't real Christians (sounds a lot like "those aren't real Americans" to me), and from what I've read and heard it seems a case of "they don't do things the way we do" more than anything. Always seemed bizarre to me for people to focus on the fairly minor differences instead of the much more intense similarities.
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Old 11-14-2008, 04:28 PM   #29
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Maybe they are just economizing.

Think how much money they can save on their wafer and wine purchases.
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Old 11-14-2008, 04:40 PM   #30
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is that your way of getting all "u2" on us, purpleoscar?
I've never been religious and yes it's a quote from U2. The dualism element and cultural elements of the bible make it look like a cultural document more than "from god" to me.
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