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Old 09-13-2011, 11:26 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by Cactus Annie

How so? This all sounds very complicated. Why can't it all be straightforward? They are many countries that use health insurance but if you can't afford it, it's still provided for free by the tax payer. Take Germany as an example. Why can't the US have the same system as Germany? Is it because The US is a larger country? Why can't the UK adopt the German health system as well?
We have tea party people who would rather see you die.


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Old 09-13-2011, 02:37 PM   #17
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Why do they call those right wing rallies? When I first heard of The Tea Party (which was on this website) I thought that Americans on this forum were being sociable by inviting each other for tea and home-made scones. My mum makes a sick baker! You'd love her rock cakes!


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Old 09-13-2011, 03:56 PM   #18
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One of the gazillion things I never got about our system in the US....I have a prescription, if I purchase it outright without insurance coverage (as I did a few times as a student) it cost me under $25/mo. If I purchase it with insurance co-pay it cost me $10/mo but costs "the plan" $26/mo. $26 + $10 = $36/mo...so then why is it under $25 without insurance? Why do things cost more because you have insurance? Phil had the same thing, he used to have to take a prescription that had no generic and cost $1/pill and he took 4 a day. Without insurance is doctor would sell him about 3 months worth for $100 but with insurance the co-pay was $40/mo for us and who knows what for "the plan".


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Old 09-13-2011, 04:38 PM   #19
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all i know is that the crowd tonight cheered at the thought of letting a 30-year old (perhaps like that woman) without health insurance die should something catastrophic happen to her.

i thought that the cheers for 237 executions was bad. but that was the ghastliest thing i've ever heard in a "debate."

party of life, lol. they only care about fetuses.
I happened to see that part and I thought it was so disturbing. No matter what their beliefs are, doing that is just..there really aren't sufficient words.

HuffPost asked Grayson what he thought of the crowd cheering for the death of the uninsured man. He writes:

My speech was about the fact I had been listening to the Republicans for months, and they literally had no plan to help all those millions of people who can’t see a doctor when they’re sick. So I said, in sort of a wry manner, that their plan was "don’t get sick." All I really wanted to do was just call attention to the stark absence of a Republican plan. But Fox, trying to take the heat off Joe Wilson and Sarah Palin I guess, transmogrified that into a charge that Republicans want to kill people.

What you saw tonight is something much more sinister than not having a healthcare plan. It's sadism, pure and simple. It's the same impulse that led people in the Coliseum to cheer when the lions ate the Christians. And that seems to be where we are heading -- bread and circuses, without the bread. The world that Hobbes wrote about -- "the war of all against all.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=-usmvYOPfco


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Old 09-13-2011, 05:07 PM   #20
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party of life, lol. they only care about fetuses.
Pro-life until birth. Then you become a welfare problem.


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Old 09-13-2011, 05:20 PM   #21
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I think this excerpt from an essay about the presidential election explains it well:

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Our runaway health care costs can be traced by our failure to nationalize health care when the rest of the developed did so in the late 1940’s, enabling them to keep their medical expenses to two thirds of ours, with better results. Social security and Medicare were financially flawed from the day they were launched, and modern day politicians were loath to touch them once they became sacred cows. None of these intractable problems are amenable to a quick fix.
Diary of a Mad Hedge Fund Trader


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Old 09-13-2011, 05:23 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by Cactus Annie View Post
How so? This all sounds very complicated. Why can't it all be straightforward? They are many countries that use health insurance but if you can't afford it, it's still provided for free by the tax payer. Take Germany as an example. Why can't the US have the same system as Germany? Is it because The US is a larger country? Why can't the UK adopt the German health system as well?
Because poor people in America are immoral, and cannot be allowed to exploit the tax system to steal from richer, and therefore, morally better, citizens. If they are given free healthcare, where will it end? They need to remember that the tax system exists solely for the benefit of large corporations.


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Old 09-13-2011, 06:15 PM   #23
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Because poor people in America are immoral.

not necessarily immoral, it's just their fault that they're poor.

although this attitude is much more common among the not-quite-poor rather than the upper classes, i'd argue.


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Old 09-20-2011, 11:56 AM   #24
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That's simply not true. So just because I'm poor richer people think they're better than me? How is it that my mum has been made redundant after working at her former employer for 10 years and she's told she has to live off her redundancy payout until she is allowed to sign on? That money should be her nest egg after she's been made jobless through no thought of her own. How comes David Cameron is no wanting to force people out of their council flats and make them pay extortionate higher rates in the private sector? This is total exploitation. If we could afford over £500 for a scanky little 2 bedroom flat in a town with high unemployment, why wouldn't we just take out a mortgage. I thought renting was for those who can't afford a mortgage.

They are only paying a third of our rent for a scant £200 pcm and we've got up to make up the rest out of the redundancy payout.


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Old 09-29-2011, 01:58 AM   #25
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Early Supreme Court Review Of Health Care Law Could Impact 2012 Race : It's All Politics : NPR

The plot thickens: The Obama administration has asked the SCOTUS to review the Affordable Care Act (what our conservative friends on the forum call Obamacare) early, essentially doubling-down for the 2012 election.

Very interesting move in a more and more complex chess game.


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Old 09-29-2011, 09:38 AM   #26
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fwiw, my premiums somehow just went down $20 a month.

also, over a million more people in their early 20s are now insured because they can remain on their parent's insurance until the age of 26, which is something i really wish i had had back then.


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Old 09-29-2011, 03:23 PM   #27
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mine is still $840 a month

with a $3600 deductible and then a 20% co-pay until $5000. per year.


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Old 09-29-2011, 03:34 PM   #28
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that's capitalism for you.


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Old 09-29-2011, 06:53 PM   #29
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My father's job situation changed recently, so we had to change insurance companies. My brother has a medical condition that calls for regular care, and his costs have not only skyrocketed, but the company's bullshit policy does not allow him to get care at his normal doctor, so he literally has to change everything he's learned in the past few years about caring for himself because this insurance company blows.

I'm angry. My instincts tell me to find someone to blame. If I followed these instincts, I'd make a great Republican voter.


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Old 09-29-2011, 11:01 PM   #30
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I'm angry. My instincts tell me to find someone to blame. If I followed these instincts, I'd make a great Republican voter.

but they would boo you at a Republican debate for daring to mention something like this, hippie.


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