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Old 05-08-2009, 01:09 PM   #121
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Well yeah, I'm sure it did...but apparently the great wave of liberation and reform that was supposed to sweep over Iraq didn't turn out as planned.
Sadly, this is true.
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Old 05-08-2009, 01:16 PM   #122
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Well yeah, I'm sure it did...but apparently the great wave of liberation and reform that was supposed to sweep over Iraq didn't turn out as planned.
I'm not surprised it didn't. All we can do is hope that it'll be allright some time. Just keep in mind that it's an Islamic country and that they've never been fond of gay people, nor women's rights.
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And if U2 EVER did Hawkmoon live....and the version from the Lovetown Tour, my uterus would leave my body and fling itself at Bono - for realz.
Don't worry baby, it's gonna be all right. Uncertainty can be a guiding light...
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Old 05-08-2009, 01:25 PM   #123
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I'm not surprised it didn't. All we can do is hope that it'll be allright some time. Just keep in mind that it's an Islamic country and that they've never been fond of gay people, nor women's rights.
Excellent point! Things aren't perfect in the U.S. But, I do feel that women have better protection under the law, than women living in Muslim countries. FGM is illegal in the U.S. Even for Muslims.
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Old 05-08-2009, 02:29 PM   #124
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Just keep in mind that it's an Islamic country and that they've never been fond of gay people
Yet, homosexuality happens as often as it does in Western countries, and sometimes you wonder if its because of their gender segregated society.

I say that because a couple of years ago, I read "Inside the Kingdom" by Carmen bin Laden (sister in law to you know who). In the book, she discussed her time in Saudi Arabia, and what life is really like there. Bin Laden says even though imams preach against homosexuality and being gay can lead to death, homosexuality is pretty prevalent in Saudi Arabia. She says while it is possible a lot of the homosexuals are born as such, she wonders if Saudi Arabia's strict rules which separate the sexes and demean women leads to homosexuality. For example, boys in that country are taught from an early age that women are beneath them and should not be turned to for intellectual or emotional needs. And with little access to women, what does a hormone driven teenage guy do? Same with the Saudi women; they are taught not to turn to men for needs because men are different from them, so they turn to other women. Bin Laden also said there are plenty of parties throughout Saudi Arabia where men pick up men, and women pick up women.

I wish I could copy those few pages of that book here, but I took the book out from the library. Maybe I should get my hands on it so my post would be more legitimate.

I've been meaning to bring this up on FYM for a long while, and I hope this was the right time. I don't mean to start a debate on what causes homosexuality. I just wanted to show how hypocritical some Islamic countries are when they want to prevent any "immoral" activity between the sexes that they wind up creating "immoral" situations anyway.
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Old 05-08-2009, 02:32 PM   #125
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That's a really interesting piece you wrote there. I've never actually thought of it like that!
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And if U2 EVER did Hawkmoon live....and the version from the Lovetown Tour, my uterus would leave my body and fling itself at Bono - for realz.
Don't worry baby, it's gonna be all right. Uncertainty can be a guiding light...
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Old 05-08-2009, 02:41 PM   #126
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I've been meaning to bring this up on FYM for a long while, and I hope this was the right time. I don't mean to start a debate on what causes homosexuality. I just wanted to show how hypocritical some Islamic countries are when they want to prevent any "immoral" activity between the sexes that they wind up creating "immoral" situations anyway.
I do think there is a difference between our natural sexuality and circumstantial sexuality. Usually circumstantial sexuality has little to do with sexuality and more with just the act of sex or power.

But I think that's probably all a little over Joe's head. I think Joe would have a hard time understanding anything or anyone that wasn't white, "Christian", straight, conservative, or came in a sixpack.
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Old 05-08-2009, 02:56 PM   #127
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I do think there is a difference between our natural sexuality and circumstantial sexuality. Usually circumstantial sexuality has little to do with sexuality and more with just the act of sex or power.
That kind of behavior is actually quite common in many societies which have what we might call a "machismo"-based masculinity--the Mediterranean (including but certainly not limited to the Arab world) and many parts of Latin America, as well as others. And often in such societies, the men who are stigmatized as "gay" over it are strictly the "passive" ones, the ones who accept a "woman's" position during sex.
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