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Old 01-06-2009, 02:52 PM   #106
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Only a fool can now believe they are not deliberately targetting civilians.


Hamas also deliberately stockpiles their weapons where there are lots and lots of civilians. bloody kids on Al-Jazeera is a great PR tactic.

don't know if this is the case here, but this is one of Hamas's tactics -- maximize their own civilian casualties in order to gain the greatest possible sympathy.

i have no love for Hamas. i feel tremendous sympathy for Palestinian civilians. and i wish Israel wouldn't play directly into their hands.
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Old 01-06-2009, 02:56 PM   #107
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Results from a Rasmussen public opinion poll released late last week:
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Americans, while far more sympathetic to Israel than the Palestinians, are closely divided over whether the Jewish state should be taking military action against militants in the Gaza Strip. 44% say Israel should have taken military action against the Palestinians, but 41% say it should have tried to find a diplomatic solution to the problems there, according to a new Rasmussen Reports national telephone survey. 15% are undecided.

62% of Republicans back Israel’s decision to take military action against the Palestinians, but only half as many Democrats (31%) agree. A majority of Democrats (55%) say Israel should have tried to find a diplomatic solution first, a view shared by just 27% of Republicans.
If the discrepancy between the range of opinion indicated by those figures (particularly among Democrats) and the lack of range reflected by the statements of public officials (including the Democratic leadership) thus far bothers you, then contact your Congress(wo)men, contact the Obama transition team, and sign the petition posted at J Street, the advocacy wing of the only progressive Israel-policy PAC. We won't get anyone's ear in Washington if we don't purposefully organize and act to make our voices heard.
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Old 01-06-2009, 02:57 PM   #108
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Originally Posted by Irvine511 View Post
Hamas also deliberately stockpiles their weapons where there are lots and lots of civilians. bloody kids on Al-Jazeera is a great PR tactic.

don't know if this is the case here, but this is one of Hamas's tactics -- maximize their own civilian casualties in order to gain the greatest possible sympathy.

i have no love for Hamas. i feel tremendous sympathy for Palestinian civilians. and i wish Israel wouldn't play directly into their hands.
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I am sure there were Hamas terrorists hiding in that school.

This is exacually the type of things they do, use children as human shields to make the Israeli Defense Forces look bad.

Why aren't these Hamas soldiers, (terrorists) out in the open identifying themselves,
if what they are doing is right, why are they hiding?


ok. we have cast our next movie

you are dumb and I am dumber.
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Old 01-06-2009, 03:01 PM   #109
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and they shouldn't?
What they shouldn't do is assume that every Jew is automatically an expert on Israeli history/politics. The fact that I do give a shit about such things is moot. The "Oh, you're a Jew, so you're an expert" attitude rankles, that's all.
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Old 01-06-2009, 03:03 PM   #110
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we only keep Sean around to get the Negro perspective.
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Old 01-06-2009, 03:09 PM   #111
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ok. we have cast our next movie

you are dumb and I am dumber.


i can't even tell if you are being ironic anymore.

i mean no irony by my statement. dead kids help Hamas.

i blame the Israelis for falling for it. continuously.
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Old 01-06-2009, 03:11 PM   #112
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What they shouldn't do is assume that every Jew is automatically an expert on Israeli history/politics. The fact that I do give a shit about such things is moot. The "Oh, you're a Jew, so you're an expert" attitude rankles, that's all.
no... that's ridiculous. unless they're flat out saying as much, they're only showing an interest in something they feel relates to you.

i live abroad, and whenever shit goes on in my country people ask me about it too. why the hell would that put me off? if people actually care what i think, it's an honour.
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Old 01-06-2009, 03:13 PM   #113
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Originally Posted by deep View Post
I am sure there were Hamas terrorists hiding in that school.

This is exacually the type of things they do, use children as human shields to make the Israeli Defense Forces look bad.
What makes the Israeli forces look bad is killing children and calling them collateral damage - just as reprehensible, if not more so by its deliberate nature, as using them as shields.

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If the discrepancy between the range of opinion indicated by those figures (particularly among Democrats) and the lack of range reflected by the statements of public officials (including the Democratic leadership) thus far bothers you, then contact your Congress(wo)men, contact the Obama transition team, and sign the petition posted at J Street, the advocacy wing of the only progressive Israel-policy PAC. We won't get anyone's ear in Washington if we don't purposefully organize and act to make our voices heard.
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Old 01-06-2009, 03:16 PM   #114
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Once again, Israel goes in heavy handed.

They have basically waved a big stick around and played an extremely heavy handed version of Whack-A-Mole for almost 60 years.

And it's worked wonderfully, no wonder they keep continuing it.

In 50 years, we are going to have in place a minority population that occupies the majority which lives in squalor. We've had that before, we like to call it apartheid.

I don't understand why it is that Israel doesn't understand that it's pretty much doing everything wrong most of the time, and that with the demographic results that are clear to any sentient being, that the time is ticking for them. That alone should be a great motivating factor to getting a peaceful long-term solution.
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Old 01-06-2009, 03:16 PM   #115
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no... that's ridiculous. unless they're flat out saying as much, they're only showing an interest in something they feel relates to you.

i live abroad, and whenever shit goes on in my country people ask me about it too. why the hell would that put me off? if people actually care what i think, it's an honour.



NSW is not Israeli.

(i don't think)
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Old 01-06-2009, 03:23 PM   #116
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by its deliberate nature, as using them as shields.


Children are really ineffective as shields.

Kevlar, is pretty good, light weight and stops quite a bit of munitions.

Now, a three year old, Israeli sharpnel goes right through them, like butter
and despite their small size they are rather heavy, also after a few hours they have a disagreeable odor about them.

kids as shields - not practical at all
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Old 01-06-2009, 03:28 PM   #117
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You all missing the fact it's a UN run school. It's extremely unlikely that Hamas were storing weapons there. The UN had provided the GPS co-ordinates to the school to the IDF when the conflict began. The Israelis have hit 3 schools (two UN run) in the last 2 days. They're also using bunker busting bombs in an area with a far higher population density than Manhattan.

In fact people where supposedly taking shelter at the school because it was a UN building, they probably should have remembered that the IDF has a history of blowing up UN facilities for shits and giggles.
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Old 01-06-2009, 03:28 PM   #118
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Originally Posted by Irvine511 View Post
Hamas also deliberately stockpiles their weapons where there are lots and lots of civilians. bloody kids on Al-Jazeera is a great PR tactic.

don't know if this is the case here, but this is one of Hamas's tactics -- maximize their own civilian casualties in order to gain the greatest possible sympathy.

i have no love for Hamas. i feel tremendous sympathy for Palestinian civilians. and i wish Israel wouldn't play directly into their hands.
Does it trouble you that this post reads to me precisely like what a Fox News talking head would say, or indeed, that on this issue your views appear to be more or less indistinguishable from Strongbow's?
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Old 01-06-2009, 03:28 PM   #119
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Children are really ineffective as shields.

Kevlar, is pretty good, light weight and stops quite a bit of munitions.

Now, a three year old, Israeli sharpnel goes right through them, like butter
and despite their small size they are rather heavy, also after a few hours they have a disagreeable odor about them.

kids as shields - not practical at all
Indeed - at least an adult martyr has made some sort of voluntary and active contribution to 'the cause'.

Well, that's what, 40 less future terrorists today?
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Old 01-06-2009, 03:31 PM   #120
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You all missing the fact it's a UN run school. It's extremely unlikely that Hamas were storing weapons there. .
Who is missing the fact?

That is exactly the kind of place that Hamas would hide those Katyusha rockets, and in Hospitals, ambulances, under wounded women on stretchers, don't you get it.
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